America's ridiculous stance on Kashmir

[Kazhugu]

^^^^ what the hell are you trying to say man...........

So in truth a final outcome here has to be okay-ed by USA.

bs.....the final outcome has to be okayed by indian people........not americans.....americans neither have the intent nor the resources to enforce their will on us.........

 

[mautkimaut]

1. America is the "bara saab" acknowledged by successive Indo-Pak leadership who are dependent on USA for various reasons. So in truth a final outcome here has to be okay-ed by USA. There are very few people in the world as unfortunate as the Kashmairis.The land is so beautiful. So are the people. And they by themselves are economically sound. Yes, every one has always remembered to forget the Kashmiris.

2. Have you traveled on the road Jammu to Srinagar? If you haven't then you are not born, says the Kashmiris. From Bhimbar's front positions (Koel-Moel posts perhaps) or from Phuklean across R Jammu Tawi/Munawwar Tawi you can see Samba with binos. But try and venture nearer and you will enter a place of beauty incomparable. Unlike the ares north of Bhimbar this location has a great charm. From Kotli northwards, across Tain feature, the mountains are rather rugged.

3. Perhaps Mush and Vajpaye had reached a formula which would have given them a joint Nobel. But Indian leadership around Vajpaye had threatened a revolt. We do not know what the formula was or what the Indians objected to. But from various media reports the understanding seems to have been to convert the once CFL, and now LOC, into an international border. Jammu and Leh would join India, and the Valley would be independent. India on its part would accept Akshai Chin belonging to China; and accept Azad Kashmir and the Northern Areas as Pakistan territory. There would be a peace - but at the unfortunate cost of the Kashmiris. Most Indians define J&K to include Pak NA also -and they want all. Most Pakistanis do not want to betray Kashmiris after all the sacrifices made.

4. Is the Kashmiri struggle diminishing? For the moment perhaps. But gone are the days when Kashmiris, except the Suddans, were treated as non-martial, passive, etc. Once a people learn to shed blood for freedom it is not possible to keep them down. That is the verdict of history.

5. America's stance seems to be ridiculous because they are perplexed, if not confused, like everyone else.

Thing is Pakistan has no right gifting areas of Kashmir to China....where else do you see a similiar example..
This simply shows that they are not serious about land of Kashmir..

 

[MilSpec]

1. America is the "bara saab" acknowledged by successive Indo-Pak leadership who are dependent on USA for various reasons. So in truth a final outcome here has to be okay-ed by USA. There are very few people in the world as unfortunate as the Kashmairis.The land is so beautiful. So are the people. And they by themselves are economically sound. Yes, every one has always remembered to forget the Kashmiris.

2. Have you traveled on the road Jammu to Srinagar? If you haven't then you are not born, says the Kashmiris. From Bhimbar's front positions (Koel-Moel posts perhaps) or from Phuklean across R Jammu Tawi/Munawwar Tawi you can see Samba with binos. But try and venture nearer and you will enter a place of beauty incomparable. Unlike the ares north of Bhimbar this location has a great charm. From Kotli northwards, across Tain feature, the mountains are rather rugged.

3. Perhaps Mush and Vajpaye had reached a formula which would have given them a joint Nobel. But Indian leadership around Vajpaye had threatened a revolt. We do not know what the formula was or what the Indians objected to. But from various media reports the understanding seems to have been to convert the once CFL, and now LOC, into an international border. Jammu and Leh would join India, and the Valley would be independent. India on its part would accept Akshai Chin belonging to China; and accept Azad Kashmir and the Northern Areas as Pakistan territory. There would be a peace - but at the unfortunate cost of the Kashmiris. Most Indians define J&K to include Pak NA also -and they want all. Most Pakistanis do not want to betray Kashmiris after all the sacrifices made.

4. Is the Kashmiri struggle diminishing? For the moment perhaps. But gone are the days when Kashmiris, except the Suddans, were treated as non-martial, passive, etc. Once a people learn to shed blood for freedom it is not possible to keep them down. That is the verdict of history.

5. America's stance seems to be ridiculous because they are perplexed, if not confused, like everyone else.

> Pakistan occupied Kashmir and Aksai chin is stolen territory from India, This is disputed territory

> The so called Kashmir struggle is a Armed Insurgency, fueled, organised, funded and orchestrated by the state of Pakistan as a tool of asymmetric warfare against India.

> Pakistani backed militants have selectively targeted and killed Hindu Kahmiri Pandits, and coerced them into leaving there homelands

> Pakistan had tried to annexe kashmir in 1947 and 1965, failure of which and defeat in 1971 led the pakistani establishment to rethink their engagement terms to hurt India. Asymmetric warfare was the only option as pakistani establishment cannot think of any scenario in which they can win against India in direct military confrontation.

>This rethink in policy led to ISI's support to Khalistan and kashmir movements.

>these following agencies involved in Kashmir Insurgency:
Hizb-ul-Mujahideen (HM)
Harkat-ul-Ansar (HuA, presently known as Harkat-ul Mujahideen)
Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT)
Jaish-e-Mohammad Mujahideen E-Tanzeem (JeM)
Harkat-ul Mujahideen (HuM, previously known as Harkat-ul-Ansar)
Al Badr
Jamait-ul-Mujahideen (JuM)
Lashkar-e-Jabbar (LeJ)
Harkat-ul-Jehad-al-Islami(HUJI)
Muttahida Jehad Council (MJC)
Al Barq
Tehrik-ul-Mujahideen
Al Jehad
Jammu & Kashmir National Liberation Army
People’s League
Muslim Janbaz Force
Kashmir Jehad Force
Al Jehad Force (combines Muslim Janbaz Force and Kashmir Jehad Force)
Al Umar Mujahideen
Mahaz-e-Azadi
Islami Jamaat-e-Tulba
Jammu & Kashmir Students Liberation Front
Ikhwan-ul-Mujahideen
Islamic Students League
Tehrik-e-Hurriat-e-Kashmir
Tehrik-e-Nifaz-e-Fiqar Jafaria
Al Mustafa Liberation Fighters
Tehrik-e-Jehad-e-Islami
Muslim Mujahideen
Al Mujahid Force
Tehrik-e-Jehad
Islami Inquilabi Mahaz

Supported by major trusts like :
Al-Rashid Trust
Al-Akhtar Trust
Rabita Trust
Ummah Tamir-e-Nau

This asymmetric warfare has led to large presence of Indian military in the J&K state which has disrupted the natural progression of democratic privileges. Pakistan is responsible for the hardships being faced by Kashmiris. Reforms and stability driven programs cannot be implemented without peace. Peace is covertly disrupted in this region by coercion and by subversion by Pakistani elements to ensure this region remains disgruntled.


If pakistan was so concerned about kashmir, they have been administering P.o.K since 1948, how may Universities, Colleges, Factories, development projects have been deployed in P.o.K compared to Islamabad or Lahore??

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

Nah! India has no interest in changing the boundaries. The rearmament is to deter any foolish attempts by neighbors to do that..

Thats what everybody claims, the recent Indian military ex across Pakistani border and the long rang Artillary and Advanced Fighter Aircraft deployment across Pakistani border plus Genral Depak Kapur(Rt) comments negate your claim.Owing to the Military Up-gradation There may come a time when the balance of military power might shift greatly towards india and Indian leaders might find it a workable option to venture a military confrontation with Pakistan

 

[Kazhugu]

Thats what everybody claims,

how many times india has invaded pakistan unilaterally without any provocation from pakistan for you 2 suspect that claim ?

the recent Indian military ex across Pakistani border

So are we not allowed to even practice to prove we are peaceful ?

and the long rang Artillary and Advanced Fighter Aircraft deployment across Pakistani border

deterrence...............plus you are fast losing the position of enemy # 1.......mrca is not supposed to be based on the western border.....

plus Genral Depak Kapur(Rt) comments negate your claim.

he was misquoted intentionally....how many times pakistanis are going to cling to that?

Owing to the Military Up-gradation There may come a time when the balance of military power might shift greatly towards india and Indian leaders might find it a workable option to venture a military confrontation with Pakistan

if pakistan indulges in any provocation or stupid move like kargil, 26/11 etc.......we neither have any desire nor time for invading pakistan without any provocation and a serious one at that from pakstan......our concern now is our economy and the social standards of our people........

 

[muse]

For Pakistanis who may be interested - please do some research on how the Pakistani position on captive Kashmir was built - it was in fact built by the US, don't believe me - do the research

 

[muse]

So why the different position now? As the adviser to the US negotiating delegation in Switzerland (US Soviet negotiations to end Soviet presence in Afghanistan) told me when I asked him why the US decided to Abandon the Afghan and Pakistanis, "Things change"

And tomorrow they will change again -- so long as Pakistanis and Indians allow themselves to be the plaything of others, expect to be kicked around.

 

[Luftwaffe]

For Pakistanis who may be interested - please do some research on how the Pakistani position on captive Kashmir was built - it was in fact built by the US, don't believe me - do the research

Contribute your research and knowledge over Pakistan position being built by US, It would be Interesting.

 

[muse]

It will not be as interesting as doing your own research -- why settle for being spoon fed?

 

[Luftwaffe]

The point of being on forum is also to bring in your research and authentic or close to for other members to read and squeeze some knowledge out of it after all you are a think tank wouldn't you want to contribute.

 

[muse]

I take your point but that's not going to happen. This is not a negotiation, just do the negotiation - Start with the creation of the Pakistani position on captive Kashmir in the UN

 

[Zabaniyah]

It will not be as interesting as doing your own research -- why settle for being spoon fed?

But you are a think tank!

 

[asad71]

And tomorrow they will change again -- so long as Pakistanis and Indians allow themselves to be the plaything of others, expect to be kicked around.[/B]

Yes, that is the crux of all our ills in SA. But our leaders are politicos who will do what will help them cling to the "gaddi".

 

[muse]

Think Tank doesn't mean some cow you milk whenever - there is just one way, do the research, begin with the UN

 

[karan.1970]

Interestingly, I remember the time when Pakistan every alternate month used to ask for American intervention of Kashmir and Indians would go ballistic at the demand and talk about this being a bilateral issue. How things have changed. I am sure no Pakistani diplomat or politician in his right mind would do that now...