American attack aftermath: Pakistan declares attack a 'plot'

[mjnaushad]

This doesnt seem right.. Even if NATO patrols the border on a regular basis, this does not mean Pakistan forces stop guarding those borders. Specially after the Abbotabad and subsequent air space violations. Also if the whole operation took 2 hours, and remember, 2 separate check posts were attacked, I am sure there was enough time to report back the attack and get air support. I do remember reading somewhere on this thread that some reinforcements were sent.. The question is why not Air support when the attack was airborne..

About being impervious to ground fire, its a little tough to digest that a checkpost large enough to house scores off full military men, will have nothing in its arsenal to hit back at a low and slow flying attack helicopter..

Something surely is amiss here..

Troops stationed their are to watch the borders to stop cross border movement of Taliban..... I dont know taliban use Chopper and we should have put a MANPAD there for the taliban......

 

[lem34]

Guys I am not for one moment suggesting that we do nothing. However we can not afford to have open warfare with america without hundreds of thousands of deaths. We can close the supply routes. Ironically the fuel for those helicopters probably came through pakistan. In my earlier posts I quoted americans stating that they expect that ISI will take action and they expect this to come back and bite them in the ***.

I regard american govt as pakistans enemy. They have been demonising PA and ISI for the last 12 months. You have to agree with me western press has been attacking PA and ISI to the nth degree. So if my enemy hates something in my country it means that something is not as compliant as it may seem. For gods sake they want us to hate our army cant you guys see that

 

[Jango]

This doesnt seem right.. Even if NATO patrols the border on a regular basis, this does not mean Pakistan forces stop guarding those borders. Specially after the Abbotabad and subsequent air space violations. Also if the whole operation took 2 hours, and remember, 2 separate check posts were attacked, I am sure there was enough time to report back the attack and get air support. I do remember reading somewhere on this thread that some reinforcements were sent.. The question is why not Air support when the attack was airborne..

About being impervious to ground fire, its a little tough to digest that a checkpost large enough to house scores off full military men, will have nothing in its arsenal to hit back at a low and slow flying attack helicopter..

Something surely is amiss here..

Attack helicopters, in this case most probably Apache, are bullet proof and kevlar covered in the Avionics bay, cockpit area, engine, and other crucial spots.

So, a G-3 or AK-47 fire randomly is not going to do much damage, and considering that the Helis don't really need to be so close to the action, they could have fired from far away. Night time is also another factor.

And you would not be expecting Taliban to have helicopters now would you?

 

[Al Bhatti]

Troops stationed their are to watch the borders to stop cross border movement of Taliban..... I dont know taliban use Chopper and we should have put a MANPAD there for the taliban......

But there had been repeated intrusions and attacks from the sky on the western border.

 

[Jango]

But there had been repeated intrusions and attacks from the sky on the western border.

But you have standing orders. You just don't keep on giving out weapons and start firing. Things might change from now on.

 

[JonAsad]

They were not on that Outpost for Picnic..... Do you want full check post awake 24/7..... They all were sleeping proves PA point that they were not attacking.... One fire from AK can wake up the whole village.....

Great- Pakistan Army made an outpost for these soldiers- and all went to sleep-
Never heard of that tactic before- where were the scouts?- Isn't it a standard practice?-
1 and half hour of the attack the whole village woke up- but the decision makers generals and PA were still sleeping-
That makes the whole situation more Great-

Then lets show some ghairat and block the roads..... Civil disobedience..... Protests..... Etc etc..... The army is beghairat... You are not.... Go ahead do something.... PA is doing what is doable.....

Me as a Pakistani is playing my part-
The Army is for that purpose- Defend the sovereignty of a state- defend its people- if the army fails to protect its people- The people as they call it "bl00dy civilians" can only protest and lay the blame on The untouchables- the Army-

Instead of asking me to do sme thing- demand from the army to concentrate solely on for the purpose it was built for-

 

[Jango]

Great- Pakistan Army made an outpost for these soldiers- and all went to sleep-
Never heard of that tactic before- where were the scouts?- Isn't it a standard practice?-
1 and half hour of the attack the whole village woke up- but the decision makers generals and PA were still sleeping-
That makes the whole situation more Great-

Everything does not go to the jarnail straightaway. It was the company HQ, so the Company Havaldar or the Maj there would have contacted the Unit, which would have contacted the formation, which would have contacted the brigade, which would have contacted the Corp headquarter , and then it goes to the very high level that you are talking about.

Although, I agree, the response might have been slow.

 

[Najam Khan]

Great- Pakistan Army made an outpost for these soldiers- and all went to sleep-
Never heard of that tactic before- where were the scouts?- Isn't it a standard practice?-
1 and half hour of the attack the whole village woke up- but the decision makers generals and PA were still sleeping-
That makes the whole situation more Great-

JonAsad stop speculating things....its all BS. I bet none of us know what happened that night...then why write BS when their is no available information?

 

[sreekimpact]

I have closely watched General Kayani these years . He is a wise man and more capable than any other leaders in the present pakistan.

Im Damn sure that he knows that ... this not the time to go to war against USA .

 

[JonAsad]

Don't need to drag PAF in each and every violation. Air defence of each sector is managed by mixture of Hi/Low-Level radars supported by patrolling fighters. In case of western border, PAF maintains air defence by Hi-Level radars, with lot of separation between them....I doubt their is any PAF air defence radar/site near the place where this incident happened...helicopters might have taken advantage of height and blind spots.

Since out policy on western border is different then eastern border,, therefore the SOPs for scramble are not applicable. As NATO/US aircraft took part in activities near Pak-Afghan border on routine basis with lenient behaviour from Pakistani side, so its not a surprise that they easily hopped in while getting the advantage of 'routine mission'.

Well well-
When the first time an incident of this sort happened- Whose duty/ responsibility was it to make sure this sort of incident never happen again?- Whose responsibly was it to change the SOP's?-
Then OBL happened which showed the weakness on our western side- whose responsibility was it to rectify what went wrong?-

I blame the army- the air force- for not doing what it is meant for-
Or tell me who to blame and drag here?-

 

[lem34]

I have closely watched General Kayani these years . He is a wise man and more capable than any other leaders in the present pakistan.

Im Damn sure that he knows that ... this not the time to go to war against USA .

Open warfare is not an option. It is accepted we would hurt americans with open warfare but hundreds of thousand pakistani lives are at stake. But I am sure our high command will respond with the options at their disposal

 

[slytherin]

Open warfare is not an option. It is accepted we would hurt americans but hundreds of thousand pakistani lives are at stake. But I am sure our high command will respond with the options at their disposal

which are??

 

[Jango]

Well well-
When the first time an incident of this sort happened- Whose duty/ responsibility was it to make sure this sort of incident never happen again?- Whose responsibly was it to change the SOP's?-
Then OBL happened which showed the weakness on our western side- whose responsibility was it to rectify what went wrong?-

I blame the army- the air force- for not doing what it is meant for-
Or tell me who to blame and drag here?-

SOP's don't change overnight.

Did you know what exactly happened at OBl, did you know the route they took? The kind of supporting equipment they had? The kind of helicopters they had? Everything is not as straightforward as it seems.

 

[JonAsad]

But there had been repeated intrusions and attacks from the sky on the western border.

Exactly-
its becoming a routine-

Dont know who much more times we are going to repeat the same excuse again and again-

Taliban doesn't have heli- we dont need air support to fight talibans- fcuk with this sh!t-

It is not talibans who are attacking and killing our soldiers any more -

 

[Jango]

which are??

Stopping NATO supply and cooperation of intelligence agencies and of political type. Not playing their servants. Not allowing them any room inside pakistan, expel their hundreds of useless personnel stationed here.