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American attack aftermath: Pakistan declares attack a 'plot'

Russia could deliver death blow to Nato, say analysts

ISLAMABAD: With the Russian threat to cut land routes for supply to NATO troops in Afghanistan, the Afghan battleground may turn into a cold death trap for NATO, defence analysts believe. They say that Pakistan should utilise the opportunity for a peaceful and prosperous Pakistan by pulling it out of the American war.

Russia has threatened to cut off NATO supply routes to Afghanistan if the alliance doesn’t compromise on its missile defence plans. “If NATO doesn’t give a serious response, we have to address matters in relations in other areas,” Russian news services reported. Russia’s cooperation on Afghanistan may be an area for review, the news services reported.

Pakistan has already cut the NATO supply route after the Mohmand Agency attack by NATO troops that killed twenty-six Pakistani soldiers. Lt General (retd) Hameed Gul while talking to The News said that Russia would utilise every option to take revenge from the Americans and time has come for the Russians to do this. He said that Russia wants to join hands with Pakistan and Pakistan should re-consider its policy towards Russia. “Americans and NATO troops have been strangled in Afghanistan and time has come for Pakistan to avail the opportunity that it missed on 9/11 to regain the respect and sovereignty”, Gul said.

He mentioned that Americans will have to leave Afghanistan and will ask for concessions and Pakistan should negotiate with them for their exit. If Russia cuts the supply then the route will be from Georgia to Baku and then to Azerbaijan, which means NATO will never get the supply, said Gul.

“Now NATO troops will have to exit Vietnam style, and that too by using Pakistan’s airspace because Iran will never let USA use its airspace”, the retired General said. He mentioned that the war against terror that was started with our own people will come to an end at once and there will be peace in no time once the Americans leave Afghanistan. He said that Indian interests in Afghanistan were growing but India will get nothing from Afghanistan.

Maria Sultan, defence analyst, while talking to this correspondent said that if the Russians also cut the supply line of NATO then it will turn out to be cold death for NATO troops. “They will literally be strangled in Afghanistan with 90000 troops and as they admit that they have reserves for three months which actually means they have reserves for two months and then NATO will have to airlift the troops and during the airlift only 15 to 20 percent can be alive out of the 90000 troops”, Maria said.

She mentioned that in Afghanistan, everything comes from outside and the insurgency this year has been very high as 700 causalities have been reported. Therefore after the Russian decision, Afghanistan will turn into a reverse Kargil for NATO. “They will have weapons but no bullets to fire; and if Pakistan shuts the air corridors on NATO then it would be a cold death for them and America will have to renegotiate with Pakistan”, she said.



Russia could deliver death blow to Nato, say analysts
 
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He had recently 'sweeped' the forces and many were court martialed for being corrupt. But the fact he has not taken any action against his brother makes him on the list of doubtful people serving. I have got my trust in Shuja Pasha though.

The way of operation of Pakistani Government is a ring. It is a trio which controls everything, the President, COAS and the Prime Minister. If COAS wills, he could have haulted many things. Everything seems so broken nothing is fitting to make the picture.

Bold part is not reality, its COAS who sees major policies.

Anyway, lets stick to the topic..
 
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Please. I used to be as great fan of Kayani as you are. The sooner you see the truth the better. I am not neglecting the sacrifises. The young fighters are top class. But the highier management is screwed up.

The part in bold is an oft-quoted point to make it look like the General staff is different from the rest of the Army. This is not the case. The senior officers are from the one and the very same "young fighters" class that you give high marks to. The difference is that at the higher levels, you are thinking more at the strategic level. I do not buy the argument that after spending 32 years in the Army and being put through the mill, the general staff (Lt Gens and above) simply sells out and becomes useless.

We need to stop thinking like this. Most of the senior officers are exposed to information/deliberations that the junior officers are not. The Corps commanders sit and deliberate on Pakistan's security responses day and night. But they are also limited in their abilities to do certain things owing to the available budget and capabilities.

Not giving these chaps a pass, but do realize the limitations with any action that we take.
 
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To all , we are not here to discuss the personal character and life of COAS so spare us all these **** and bull conspiracy theories trying to assassinate his character ...

Stick to the topic Please ...
 
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Very bad move.

Will give rise to unnecessary confrontations/escalations in the future without accountability.

In a pure shooting game, Pakistan is no match to NATO/ISAF.

Well no one wants a shooting war, but Pakistan's options aren't limited to just a shooting game.

---------- Post added at 03:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:57 PM ----------

Bold part is not reality, its COAS who sees major policies.

Anyway, lets stick to the topic..

Not all major policies. The Army does have a dominant influence on regional security policy.
 
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Please. I used to be as great fan of Kayani as you are. The sooner you see the truth the better. I am not neglecting the sacrifises. The young fighters are top class. But the highier management is screwed up.

The way of operation of Pakistani Government is a ring. It is a trio which controls everything, the President, COAS and the Prime Minister. If COAS wills, he could have haulted many things. Everything seems so broken nothing is fitting to make the picture.
Whatever you are saying may be true but there is overwhelming evidence to the contrary so i am obliged to believe otherwise ... I have stopped believing in conspiracy theories long ago ...

Yes , our COAS is appointed from CENTCOM and the Americans never went to the moon ...
 
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I've actually heard about the missiles being brought to the border as well.

who told you that? even the unit that is being moved wont discuss this in the army gathering or with other units except the unit officers and senior JCOs and NCOs. the movement will be done at odd hours and will be very discrete without any word of destination and reason to move.
Either you are one of the unit officers (in which case you are violating the secrecy act) or you are speculating.

If its true then do tell what kind of missile systems that need to be moved next to the border? If they are the man pads then they are as useless as the 12.7mm or MG 1A3 those poor soldiers had because the NATO gunship’s are pretty much immune to the fire from these things. Anything bigger doesn’t need to be moved and can take out the intruders from many a miles.
 
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PAF to PA communications were down couldn't take action, what the hell is that Northern Air Command for we have Radars that can look deep into Afghanistan, for 2 hours you saw bogeys on radar in a specific area and Air Chief says couldn't take action all PAF had to do was scramble and reach the Conflict Area these helos would have turn back, action was not necessary but presence was necessary.
 
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All those who think this is a bad decision, or we should have more talks - NO. Pakistan has been humiliated and disgraced enough, now it's time to go all out. This continuous humiliation has caused us to lose confidence in ourselves. We are much powerful than we think we are. Declaring war on Pakistan is not a walk in the park.

"An honorable death is better than a dishonorable life"

Pakistan is no match for NATO? Hah!
The same NATO that took 8 months to take (69 year old) Gaddafi down?
 
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bravado is a great trait, but there is a thin line between bravado and foolishness. Let me start by saying, If there was ack ack fired on allied troops then i guess Pakistani troops did retaliate and got the brunt of NATO forces. Now, the questions is, if Pakistani army reacted the way they reacted, then i guess it shows us the battle outcome clearly. PA lost that encounter with heavy losses.

The only thing missing in the equation is the availability of MANPADs. Sounds like what i am hearing is that ack ack was present but was futile. Can some senior member share more on what weapns were available a troops disposal during unfortunate encounter?

Now another interesting point is, Pakistan has established 820 border post on afghan border, are we implying that every post will carry MANPADs, if we are talking about 4 missile per post we are talking about 820x4 = ~ 3280 missiles delpoyed? If Pakistan is locally producing all these MANPADs then they need to replenish their stocks ASAP as well. we are talking about full scale war then?

Question will be how much missile are there and how fast pakistan can procure and procude them. battles are only won if you have logistics to support a war, thats the rule no1 and then other rule is to use your reserves as tactfully as possible.

Pakistan knows it very well, if it takes down NATO planes or helis, then western coutnries which alreayd has 70% + negative opinion about pakistan, will call for open war. How is the equation come into picture. is pakistan ready to fight a prolonged war. Guys, i know PA is very professional and die hard force, just look into oil reserves for war and logistics of it before taking any step. Pakistan doesnt want to end up in stone age as well.

Please refrain from being mad at me, i am throwing some questions out, think and then answer.
 
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If its true then do tell what kind of missile systems that need to be moved next to the border? If they are the man pads then they are as useless as the 12.7mm or MG 1A3 those poor soldiers had because the NATO gunship’s are pretty much immune to the fire from these things. Anything bigger doesn’t need to be moved and can take out the intruders from many a miles.

So no MANPADS in PA inventory can shoot down a gunship? RBS, ANZA?
 
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