AMAN KI ASHA: Indo-Pak Friendship
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^It will not be possible to be friend with Pakistan.
India is generally into non-alignment movement from as early as 1950's.India's friends may include Iran,Afghanistan as well as USA,Israel too.
India and the Non-Aligned Movement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Again an Indian trick.
Let me enlighen those who live in self concocted dreams.
India has been alligned with russia since 50s, How do you figue that India is non align, Nehru formed a group cosisting of russia, Yogoslavia Egypt etc etc.
Russian was Arms suplliers to India, and U.S, was Arm supplier to Pakistan.
How do you than call India non Align.
It has been a problem with India, it does what ever it thinks is good for it, and I have no ptoblem with that.
But if they do something that effects Pakistan and is not true, than It is upto pakistanis and other countries who claim to be the saviour of truth and honesty in this wolrd to tell India the truth.
It is strange that in the map above writer also takes all the middle eastern countirers their partners, far from it, they much closer to pakistan than India can ever imagine. There are too many assumption in this post.
So no India was not non alligned, only spins it so.
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AZADPAKISTAN2009
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I think its our own public fault we buy billions and billion dollar worth of weaponry from west , and we become pawns in the global strategic game
Imagine if India - did not buy weapons with 200 billion and we capped our weapons program , and we decided to solve Kashmire , we got proper water for our farm lands
Instead we take that 200 billion + 20-30 bilion form Pakistan and build big energy plants and water desalination plant
We could irrigate the whole region and even desert areas could have fresh water -
If we changed our weapons program from Missile technology to Spach technology may be India / Pakistan could land frist on Mars
The only people who capatalised on our disaggrement are well countries that want to sell us weapons - ?
I wonder sometime , if we had cooperation
Its really a shame -
Politicians just use the Pakistan/India card to win votes and to psche up public , media plays that card to sell newspaper
When would it stop ???
I honestly thought that we will make break thru in Musharif sahib's time now that guy is gone and we are back to our 60/70's cold war
I asked my parents how was it like before and they all said that things were very different before partition -
I personally have came across many hindu and to be honest I found them very kind and helpful , but then you see videos and news in India you see small minority buring effigies and riots ...
But its just strange ... if only there was some thing that could be done - to change all this madness
Now the generation of ppl who were alive when partician happended are going away ... slowly and part of history is going away with them - will that spirit of friendship will go away with them as well....
May be we can all do something to change that ... each one of us
May be someday , there would be trust and friendship that a person could eat break fast in karachi and travel on train to delhi and eat dinner there ...
We need to wake up from this ... dream which is taking us towards a path of mutual destruction ... sooner then later
Imagine if India - did not buy weapons with 200 billion and we capped our weapons program , and we decided to solve Kashmire , we got proper water for our farm lands
Instead we take that 200 billion + 20-30 bilion form Pakistan and build big energy plants and water desalination plant
We could irrigate the whole region and even desert areas could have fresh water -
If we changed our weapons program from Missile technology to Spach technology may be India / Pakistan could land frist on Mars
The only people who capatalised on our disaggrement are well countries that want to sell us weapons - ?
I wonder sometime , if we had cooperation Its really a shame -
Politicians just use the Pakistan/India card to win votes and to psche up public , media plays that card to sell newspaper
When would it stop ??? I honestly thought that we will make break thru in Musharif sahib's time now that guy is gone and we are back to our 60/70's cold war
I asked my parents how was it like before and they all said that things were very different before partition -
I personally have came across many hindu and to be honest I found them very kind and helpful , but then you see videos and news in India you see small minority buring effigies and riots ...
But its just strange ... if only there was some thing that could be done - to change all this madness
Now the generation of ppl who were alive when partician happended are going away ... slowly and part of history is going away with them - will that spirit of friendship will go away with them as well....
May be we can all do something to change that ... each one of us
May be someday , there would be trust and friendship that a person could eat break fast in karachi and travel on train to delhi and eat dinner there ...
We need to wake up from this ... dream which is taking us towards a path of mutual destruction ... sooner then later
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Hulk
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The basic problem I feel in India Pakistan friendship is that we do not want to change.
We seems to think from the same tunneled vision, Pakistani’s think Indian’s are very bad people, Hindus cannot be trusted and what not. The same thing applies to Indians they keep on thinking on the same lines of hatred.
In order for us to have any chance to become friends with each other we have to start thinking differently, try forming opinion based on facts not based on what we have been told. I do not think many people are doing this, seriously telling many people post comment about India which clearly indicates that they do not have an iota of idea about India. The same thing applies to Indians, I am 100% sure Pakistani’s feel the same way.
The other factor is we try to analyze the current situation from the experience of past, while history is not something one should forget at the same time we should not become slave to history. The fact is circumstances was very different in the past from today and we have to start thinking about what is applicable today.
Our story trust me is very similar to many stories seen in TV/Film/Real life where two neighbors cannot see each other eye to eye. In all those movies people become more destructive then constructive, they try to bring down the other person. What they do not understand that this makes the situation insecure and we have spend our resource on security which otherwise could have been spent on better things.
This I feel is the truth, unfortunately the truth is even today the war mongers on both sides are supreme and peace lovers are suppressed. I do not see peace happening soon.
We seems to think from the same tunneled vision, Pakistani’s think Indian’s are very bad people, Hindus cannot be trusted and what not. The same thing applies to Indians they keep on thinking on the same lines of hatred.
In order for us to have any chance to become friends with each other we have to start thinking differently, try forming opinion based on facts not based on what we have been told. I do not think many people are doing this, seriously telling many people post comment about India which clearly indicates that they do not have an iota of idea about India. The same thing applies to Indians, I am 100% sure Pakistani’s feel the same way.
The other factor is we try to analyze the current situation from the experience of past, while history is not something one should forget at the same time we should not become slave to history. The fact is circumstances was very different in the past from today and we have to start thinking about what is applicable today.
Our story trust me is very similar to many stories seen in TV/Film/Real life where two neighbors cannot see each other eye to eye. In all those movies people become more destructive then constructive, they try to bring down the other person. What they do not understand that this makes the situation insecure and we have spend our resource on security which otherwise could have been spent on better things.
This I feel is the truth, unfortunately the truth is even today the war mongers on both sides are supreme and peace lovers are suppressed. I do not see peace happening soon.
AZADPAKISTAN2009
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I think may be it has to do with our educational system perhaps boh gov need to implement special instructions on news reporting
Perhaps , we need to differentiate that yes there are some elements of population that really don't want reconciliation but how can we by pass these elements in favour or the large 80% population on both sides --- there must be a way ...
My be media has to be cautious
a) Don't judge other country
b) Don't spread rumors
c) Greater cross educational transfer of students between countries
I mean I am saying 100-200 students go to Pakistan and 100-200
travel to india and study every semister thry special credit
programs
d) If we do this student exchange program may be in 7-10 years
we will have new generation of people who will be more open
minded
e) May be , if we celebrated a day together a "Thank you day" of
some sort on top of our independence day so we can have
something that we can celebrate together - where the leaders of both nations
came together and planted some trees and gave congrats to both nations -
Clearly I see the gap in understanding stems from ... young generation comes thru , and then it gets minipulated by the older generation and then the same distrust prevails ....
So we need to break that cycle - and introduce a generation which can challenge opinions and challenge the news media to provide credible proof before making claims ... on both sides
May be if we learned to just - understand weapons don't solve anything
Right now situation is so absurd , every one is buying weapons and stock piling it just beacause they fear - and can't seem to sleep in peace...
May be the movement has to be local so we can tell our gov that look ... enough of the wepaons buying we have enough how about you spend some on public ?
May be if we had enough , organizations 10,000 on each side of border that promote the mentality of living side by side , in peace .. yes I think if we launched initiatives like Aman ki Asha at that level we can see big difference -
The irony is nations that were hit hard in WW2 managed to rebuild themselves 100% because they had no wars and they had peace meanwhile our nations are constantly spending on weapons - and while we don't spend enough on people of nations....
Perhaps , we need to differentiate that yes there are some elements of population that really don't want reconciliation but how can we by pass these elements in favour or the large 80% population on both sides --- there must be a way ...
My be media has to be cautious
a) Don't judge other country
b) Don't spread rumors
c) Greater cross educational transfer of students between countries
I mean I am saying 100-200 students go to Pakistan and 100-200
travel to india and study every semister thry special credit
programs
d) If we do this student exchange program may be in 7-10 years
we will have new generation of people who will be more open
minded
e) May be , if we celebrated a day together a "Thank you day" of
some sort on top of our independence day so we can have
something that we can celebrate together - where the leaders of both nations
came together and planted some trees and gave congrats to both nations -
Clearly I see the gap in understanding stems from ... young generation comes thru , and then it gets minipulated by the older generation and then the same distrust prevails ....
So we need to break that cycle - and introduce a generation which can challenge opinions and challenge the news media to provide credible proof before making claims ... on both sides
May be if we learned to just - understand weapons don't solve anything
Right now situation is so absurd , every one is buying weapons and stock piling it just beacause they fear - and can't seem to sleep in peace...
May be the movement has to be local so we can tell our gov that look ... enough of the wepaons buying we have enough how about you spend some on public ?
May be if we had enough , organizations 10,000 on each side of border that promote the mentality of living side by side , in peace .. yes I think if we launched initiatives like Aman ki Asha at that level we can see big difference -
The irony is nations that were hit hard in WW2 managed to rebuild themselves 100% because they had no wars and they had peace meanwhile our nations are constantly spending on weapons - and while we don't spend enough on people of nations....
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Both countries will prosper at much higher rate if they keep aside all their differences/issues and concentrate more on cultural and economic ties.
Lets not give undue importance to borders and un-civilian forces who have just played a spoil-sport game since their inception. Do you guys think that armed forces will resolve all issues between India and Pakistan?
I know, its a BIG NO, otherwise we would have already achieved it after having fought many wars.
Democracy with full decision making power, control on armed and intelligence forces, zero tolerance against any terrorist act against any country, trade, tourism are the only solutions to expect AMAN KI AHSA
Mods - Can you please add Indian Flag as well in the existing smilies?
Lets not give undue importance to borders and un-civilian forces who have just played a spoil-sport game since their inception. Do you guys think that armed forces will resolve all issues between India and Pakistan?
I know, its a BIG NO, otherwise we would have already achieved it after having fought many wars.
Democracy with full decision making power, control on armed and intelligence forces, zero tolerance against any terrorist act against any country, trade, tourism are the only solutions to expect AMAN KI AHSA
Mods - Can you please add Indian Flag as well in the existing smilies?
AZADPAKISTAN2009
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I do think that no conflict can be resoled via weapons - it will be constant loop.... same countries will sell few weapons to pakistan and then sell same wepons to india and then it will keep happening over and over again ...
Kashmir can't be solved by war - water will lead to war but it need not ... if we just sit down and resolve matter before its late
The question is when can we sit down and say look .... we know you got your guns and we know we got guns ist not working and its not moving anywhere -
There must be a way , with out ... accusation with out the weapons race - with out no more crazy weapons that we already have that can probbly kill every one 10 times
There must be an alternative
Just think about it - all that cash going for weapons ??? Sure they look good in pictures
and yes its cool to see them do tricks and stuff and it makes us feel secure .. but
Why do we need to live in constant fear ?? of someone else taking other the other country did we not get independence in 1947??
Why can't we just live in peace like US/Canada or Britain with rest of europe ?
Sure , we know we came close but few taliban infested ppl ruined it with Bombay/Mumbai massacre , but we all said ok that was wrong ... moving on ...
How can we pick the peaces and move forward ... can every thing just get derailed by action of 4-5 people ??
But these same ppl continue to wreck hevoc in Pakistan cities - as proof
But - why can every thing can be derailed by few - how come we can't out power the few ... who want war all the time -
We see our nations buying more weapons and more weapons - do we need all that ???
Why can't we have families travelling across countries with out fear of mod violence on both side ????????? Is there lack of security or the system is not good to stop the few 7% that just like to make a noise becasue they feel they have power due to the FEAR they create of the other !!
Most euro countries have small airforce , 100-200 planes high tech planes but rest are all trainers - etc ...so why do Pakistan/India need to go on into this mindless need to have 4000 planes ??? When our people don't have
Food, water and health care
"May be we need a plan - a plan to first device a strategy on how to control ppl who don't want peace and would disrupt any effort to rerail things by odd bomb blast here and there and odd setting fire to trains here and there and odd attacks on civilians here and there"
And may be we need to put the lid on media from flaming the fires -
Its almost like fire and petrol (media and the 5-8% trouble makers) , they both love each other and the more they get together the bigger the flame gets and it burns every one , and then people wake up and notice every thing got burnt ... and we are at ground zero - so this relation between the media and trouble maker has to change
Kashmir can't be solved by war - water will lead to war but it need not ... if we just sit down and resolve matter before its late
The question is when can we sit down and say look .... we know you got your guns and we know we got guns ist not working and its not moving anywhere -
There must be a way , with out ... accusation with out the weapons race - with out no more crazy weapons that we already have that can probbly kill every one 10 times
There must be an alternative
Just think about it - all that cash going for weapons ??? Sure they look good in pictures
and yes its cool to see them do tricks and stuff and it makes us feel secure .. but
Why do we need to live in constant fear ?? of someone else taking other the other country did we not get independence in 1947??
Why can't we just live in peace like US/Canada or Britain with rest of europe ?
Sure , we know we came close but few taliban infested ppl ruined it with Bombay/Mumbai massacre , but we all said ok that was wrong ... moving on ...
How can we pick the peaces and move forward ... can every thing just get derailed by action of 4-5 people ??
But these same ppl continue to wreck hevoc in Pakistan cities - as proof
But - why can every thing can be derailed by few - how come we can't out power the few ... who want war all the time -
We see our nations buying more weapons and more weapons - do we need all that ???
Why can't we have families travelling across countries with out fear of mod violence on both side ????????? Is there lack of security or the system is not good to stop the few 7% that just like to make a noise becasue they feel they have power due to the FEAR they create of the other !!
Most euro countries have small airforce , 100-200 planes high tech planes but rest are all trainers - etc ...so why do Pakistan/India need to go on into this mindless need to have 4000 planes ??? When our people don't have
Food, water and health care
"May be we need a plan - a plan to first device a strategy on how to control ppl who don't want peace and would disrupt any effort to rerail things by odd bomb blast here and there and odd setting fire to trains here and there and odd attacks on civilians here and there"
And may be we need to put the lid on media from flaming the fires -
Its almost like fire and petrol (media and the 5-8% trouble makers) , they both love each other and the more they get together the bigger the flame gets and it burns every one , and then people wake up and notice every thing got burnt ... and we are at ground zero - so this relation between the media and trouble maker has to change
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Machoman
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I always talk about Amman, but honestly this is all bull. Unless both side heart is clean with each other. One drama and all back to where point Nukes on each other first of all No Bool Bachan just clean your heart first and when we truly think we did that then talk about peace. This is all DRAMA again and I am sick and tired of it.
AZADPAKISTAN2009
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Same here and honestly - it all comes down to "Media"
and the 5-8% trouble makers
The trouble makers, flame the public and they do thing by force , they break laws , and the media picks it up and flames it further
Its almost as if things are planned the way to incite greater public discontent with peace efforts -
Its almost as if just a routine , once the big budget purchases re done , and all the money is gone , every thing becomes normal ...
once the money is all gone ...
So why is it that we need weapons to feel good aboutselves ?
Sure its important for national defence , but what is it that we fear?
The whole idea of independence was that look we are free !!!!
But here we are 2010 .. and yet we still feel that we are not safe ...
So why can't we sort out small issues on territory and just move to next level -
When can we just have open train service , or trade
Why can't we have gas pipeline from Iran-Pakistan-India
May be Indian companies providing electricity into Pakistan ?
or Joint Space research programs?
Will we feel safe after 1000 ships , or 10,000 planes - or may be 10,000 missile ... or freedom is that you wake up and you have job and your family has health and justice and security ?
Is freedom just going to watch cricket match between Pakistan/India with your family in any city in either country ...
or is it having biggest bomb .....k we have the nuclear bombs NOW what ??? Does that means cheaper rooti ? no ..
So why are we still moving in that path ... of weaponization ??
The reality is that there are million and millions of children in both countries that roam the street or people who are old that have no income ... or poverty ... will our bombs and weapons solve this crisis -
Yes... the politicians think so becasue they sure spend millions for their own daily expense -
@ some stage we need to start the process of RE-EDUCATION of public ... and try to curb out hate in media - and it has to be a joint effort - inorder to see result -
Cuz every time ppl will come close the few 5-7% will do what they can to create havoc ... but if we can control these 5-7% and just super control them... I think we can make big progress
and the 5-8% trouble makers
The trouble makers, flame the public and they do thing by force , they break laws , and the media picks it up and flames it further
Its almost as if things are planned the way to incite greater public discontent with peace efforts -
Its almost as if just a routine , once the big budget purchases re done , and all the money is gone , every thing becomes normal ...
once the money is all gone ...
So why is it that we need weapons to feel good aboutselves ?
Sure its important for national defence , but what is it that we fear?
The whole idea of independence was that look we are free !!!!
But here we are 2010 .. and yet we still feel that we are not safe ...
So why can't we sort out small issues on territory and just move to next level -
When can we just have open train service , or trade
Why can't we have gas pipeline from Iran-Pakistan-India
May be Indian companies providing electricity into Pakistan ?
or Joint Space research programs?
Will we feel safe after 1000 ships , or 10,000 planes - or may be 10,000 missile ... or freedom is that you wake up and you have job and your family has health and justice and security ?
Is freedom just going to watch cricket match between Pakistan/India with your family in any city in either country ...
or is it having biggest bomb .....k we have the nuclear bombs NOW what ??? Does that means cheaper rooti ? no ..
So why are we still moving in that path ... of weaponization ??
The reality is that there are million and millions of children in both countries that roam the street or people who are old that have no income ... or poverty ... will our bombs and weapons solve this crisis -
Yes... the politicians think so becasue they sure spend millions for their own daily expense -
@ some stage we need to start the process of RE-EDUCATION of public ... and try to curb out hate in media - and it has to be a joint effort - inorder to see result -
Cuz every time ppl will come close the few 5-7% will do what they can to create havoc ... but if we can control these 5-7% and just super control them... I think we can make big progress
Guys, there is huge difference between Indo-Pak and Sino-Japan hatred/rivalry ........Indians don’t hate Pakistani........Indian don’t have anything against Pakistan except their ongoing support to militancy against India.....If Pak stops sponsoring terrorism against India and get hold of their non-civilian agencies... relationship will flourish like anything....innocent people from both sides have suffered a lot and if we come together aam aadmi will really welcome a new era of friendship with an open heart..
Sino-Japan have a disgusting history so its obvious Chinese will never accept them as their friend
Sino-Japan have a disgusting history so its obvious Chinese will never accept them as their friend
Bang Galore
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Why equal, why not better? I for one would welcome any level of friendship with Pakistan. Maybe we should start off small, maybe just by being civil to each other on this forum. We blame politicians, media, everyone else but us. What do we do differently? We can't even disagree without being disagreeable.It's always easy to blame someone else when the fault lies as much with us as it does with them. We easily hand out prescriptions of what others should do, maybe it's about time we start on the medicine first.
Thank you for your thoughts & your time
AZADPAKISTAN2009
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Even if 1% of what we spend on weapons gets spent on educating people and raising awareness , we won't really have to part of weapons race -
I can understand to some extent to chase weaponization but like we are like 600% or 800% over weaponized... and we are targeting 2000% weaponization which can't be good.
I think of we really think about it
a) We can produce 10 times more water then the rivers produce
from sea
b) We can procude 100 times more food if we use electricty
and mechanical means to raise production
c) We can create Solar , Wind fars across vast desert areas and
harness energies
We are stuck on same , issues from 1947-1948, I mean come on , its 2010 - really nations that were devestated went to moon and landed , and our cities and rural areas don't even have 'toilets'
It puts things into prespective , will the divide grow between rich and poor class ? Will there be civil disorder ?
But we control all these lements - if we all limit our careless chase of weaponry.
The 5% trouble makers will always exist - that is a fact , so the question is , ok we know these 5-7% will be there they will shoot , bomb , harass, kidnap
So how can the 95% - over look the 5% and continue to march on ??
This is the million dollar quetion
Over and over again , the 5% are able to damage progress , and damage anything positive
It seems all they need is few rifles , or granades or bombs or petrol and fire stick ...
What we need to educate people is EXPECT the derail , EXPECT the bomb and expect the odd deaths but ----- can you have the strength to keep moving forward???
If we can have resolve in general public that we can withstand - collectively the chaos that is the 5-7% of general population be it some crazy mulla or shiv sena how can we just bycott that and move ahead , there should be a debate on this issue !!
I can understand to some extent to chase weaponization but like we are like 600% or 800% over weaponized... and we are targeting 2000% weaponization which can't be good.
I think of we really think about it
a) We can produce 10 times more water then the rivers produce
from sea
b) We can procude 100 times more food if we use electricty
and mechanical means to raise production
c) We can create Solar , Wind fars across vast desert areas and
harness energies
We are stuck on same , issues from 1947-1948, I mean come on , its 2010 - really nations that were devestated went to moon and landed , and our cities and rural areas don't even have 'toilets'
It puts things into prespective , will the divide grow between rich and poor class ? Will there be civil disorder ?
But we control all these lements - if we all limit our careless chase of weaponry.
The 5% trouble makers will always exist - that is a fact , so the question is , ok we know these 5-7% will be there they will shoot , bomb , harass, kidnap
So how can the 95% - over look the 5% and continue to march on ??
This is the million dollar quetion
Over and over again , the 5% are able to damage progress , and damage anything positive
It seems all they need is few rifles , or granades or bombs or petrol and fire stick ...
What we need to educate people is EXPECT the derail , EXPECT the bomb and expect the odd deaths but ----- can you have the strength to keep moving forward???
If we can have resolve in general public that we can withstand - collectively the chaos that is the 5-7% of general population be it some crazy mulla or shiv sena how can we just bycott that and move ahead , there should be a debate on this issue !!
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