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Ahmadiyya Muslim sect thanks Guardian for exposing hate

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well turks have al levis. they are just like qadianis. but nothing is written in the law about them in turkey at all.

Assalam alikum

nusairies ( alaviees ) r a sect of shia as we all know it , they don't need to write that in their constitution as i said we don't take our religion from constitution we take if from ulema otherwise we will be accepting that how come qadianies r in there since late 1800 and we declared them non muslims in 1974. as a fact our ulema have declared them kuffar from day one

bashar the criminal is a nusairi also

our ulema have talked about this sect even the shias had many issues with this sect until khomini came in

TARIQ
 
that isn't the point thor.

let's all agree ahmadiyya are NOT muslim and that they are all idiots (irrelevant).

It's more their rights that matter. Society can easily disprove them to be Muslims if they are not through text evidence.

---------- Post added at 05:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:05 PM ----------

Assalam alikum

nusairies ( alaviees ) r a sect of shia as we all know it , they don't need to write that in their constitution as i said we don't take our religion from constitution we take if from ulema otherwise we will be accepting that how come qadianies r in there since late 1800 and we declared them non muslims in 1974. as a fact our ulema have declared them kuffar from day one

TARIQ

right. but you mentioned the turks dont need to mention qadianis because they don't exist in turkey. the al levi do, but turkey does not mention them in its law. so turkey is not a good example in this case because it does not mention the qadiani like al levis in their law.
 
irony is the basic principles of Islam that were obligatory in Hazrat Umar goverment system are discussed in a very strange manner. Eg the accountability of the people representatives. Islam has clear laws about this in Quran and Hadis. But i have never heard any thing about accountability in our constitution. Normally they are treated as Fraud cases. If its a Islamic country and we are following Islam in government matters then it must be dealt separately ( in the same manner Hazrat Umar did). But we were contended by including these two lines from objectieve resolution

Sovereignty belongs to Allah alone but He has delegated it to the State of Pakistan through its people for being exercised within the limits prescribed by Him as a sacred trust.
The State shall exercise its powers and authority through the chosen representatives of the people.

and noting is done pratically to ensure this.

i think secular government would work. so could one based on religious law. it would need to be logical though
 
roadtrunner.............first gets the facts of Ahmaddiya sorted.......... they are the product of the West for what reason...........

Why were they put togethre in the first place....... what is their true agenda.........

No one should be discriminated, however Pakistan is a country where everyone is a target........ Ahmadis make up less then a percent........... 80 Ahmadis died in the bomb attacks in Pakistan thusa far out of 40,000.......... work out the maths..... why would anyone give then special treatment.

If treason has been committed with Islam then it should be dealt with and Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) example's are clear here....

Musailama al-Kazzab: Among the first false claimants to Prophecy was Musailama al-Kazzab, who appeared during the time of Prophet Muhammad (upon whom be blessings and peace) and his Companions and caused numerous troubles among Muslims and had many followers. He eventually surrendered along with his supporters in Al-Yamama battle, led by the first Caliph Abu Bakr, and was killed.

Sajah al-Kahenah: Along with Musailama in falsely claiming Prophethood, was his wife, Sajah al-Kahenah, although she later reversed her position after her husband, Musailama, had been killed.

Declare that these actions by Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) himself were incorrect, and then discuss this topic further......... Ahmaddiya can be seen as a treason of Islam and the actions of the Prophet show a clear example
 
Why Ahemediyas are non muslims, while agha khanis are considered muslims?
Both have Imams...
 
At least you are honest and have given up the real game behind all this facade of religiosity. It’s the hate by hateful narrow minded people that is driving this.
We hate them on the basis that they disrespected/disobeyed(Na-oozo-billah) our Rasool Allah PBUH and the true religion of Islam and our Holy Quran.
 
Assalam alaikum

see when we started discussing mirza qadiani, mirza followers ran away they r good at twisting the fact but when it come to mirza and his actions they can't justify them and prefer to run away and keep him in dark

Roadrunner they don't need to mention them and might mention them in future but the ulema has the knowledge about their faith.

we pakistanies had to mention it in our constitution and i m glad they did it

TARIQ
 
Ahmadiyya Sect Rejected by Orthodox Islam – Understanding Other Cultures - My Telegraph


Ahmadiyya Sect Rejected by Orthodox Islam

By amuhd



ISLAMIC COUNTRIES THAT HAVE REJECTED THE AHMADIYYA SECT
There are many Muslim countries that have also rejected Ahmadis as Muslims.
(1) Mauritius was the first country to declare them non-Muslims in 1930’s
(2a) South Africa, followed in 1974,
(2b) Saudi Arabia simply deports Ahmadis. [3] [3a]

(2c) Indonesia: Government Orders Ahmadiyya Sect to Cease Practice- Manis Lor June 9, 2008.
Indonesia: Government Orders Ahmadiyya Sect to Cease Practice-Manis Lor-
On Monday the President of Indonesia signed a decree ordering the Muslim ahmadiyya sect to cease the practice of their form of Islam, the International Herald Tribune reported on June 9. The hard-line Muslim organization ‘United for Islam’ has attacked the Ahmadiyya sect for not following mainstream Islamic practices. Five thousand members of the ‘United for Islam’ recently protested outside the Presidential palace. The Ahmadiyya represent only a small minority of Muslim followers in Indonesia and their sect has 242 branches. [4] [4a]
(2d) Bangladesh:
“In Bangladesh, where Ahmadis number 100,000 the government has not officially declared them as non-Muslims. But in recent years, there have been several attacks in Dhaka and other cities on the community by Muslim extremist organizations, such as Khatme Nabuwat and Jaishe-Mistafa. In a development reflecting the hardliners’ growing influence, the government last year banned the publication and sale of all books on Islam published by the community, saying they might hurt the sentiments of the country’s majority Muslim population. [5]
(3) Pakistan 1974:
Islamic Republic of Pakistan became the first Muslim country to pass a law and legally declared Qadianis/Ahmadis/Lahoris a non-Muslim minority, giving them all the rights of a minority that are guaranteed in its constitution. [6]
In Islamic Pakistan, the original home of the Ahmadis, the following law applies:
” Specific government policies that discriminate against religious minorities include the use of the “anti-Ahmadi laws”, the blasphemy laws, and the Hudood Ordinances. In 1984, the Government added Section 298(c), commonly referred to as the “anti-Ahmadi laws”, to the penal code.
(1) The section PROHIBITS AHMADIS FROM CALLING THEMSELVES MUSLIMS OR
(2) POSING AS MUSLIMS, OR
(3) FROM REFERRING TO THEIR FAITH AS ISLAM, OR
(4) FROM PREACHING OR PROPAGATING THEIR FAITH, or
(5) From inviting others to accept the Ahmadi faith, AND
(6) FROM INSULTING THE RELIGIOUS FEELINGS OF MUSLIMS.
(7) THE BLASPHEMY LAWS PROVIDE THE DEATH PENALTY FOR DEFILING ISLAM OR ITS PROPHETS; life imprisonment for defiling, damaging, or desecrating the Qur’an; and ten years’ imprisonment for insulting the religious feelings of any citizen. These laws are often used to intimidate reform-minded Muslims, sectarian opponents, and religious minorities, or to settle personal scores. The Hudood Ordinances impose elements of Qur’anic law on both Muslims and non-Muslims and different legal standards for men and women. “(Caps are my modifications to highlight the essentials.)
(8) FROM REFERRING TO THEIR PLACE OF WORSHIP AS A MOSQUE.
(9) AHMADIS CANNOT ISSUE THE CALL TO PRAYER AS OTHER ORTHODOX MUSLIMS DO.
The blasphemy laws provide the death penalty for defiling Islam or its prophets; life imprisonment for defiling, damaging, or desecrating the Qur’an; and ten years’ imprisonment for insulting the religious feelings of any citizen. These laws are often used to intimidate reform-minded Muslims, sectarian opponents, and religious minorities, or to settle personal scores. The Hudood Ordinances impose elements of Qur’anic law on both Muslims and non-Muslims and different legal standards for men and women. ” [6]
(4) “1974 Declaration by the World Muslim League
(Rabita al-Alam al-Islami)
by
Mohammad Bashir
In the same year, An International Convention of Islamic Scholars was held in Makkah AlMukarramah under the auspeces of Rabita AlAlam AlIslami. Scholars from 124 countries unanimously declared Qadianis/Ahmadis as non-Muslim, disbelievers and out of the fold of Islam. This sealed the fate of this creed for ever in the Arab World and other Muslim Nations. This is what ‘The World Muslim League-An International Convention of Islamic Scholars” had stated:
World Muslim League held its annual conference at Makkah Al-Mukaramma Saudi Arabia from 14th to 18th of Rabiul Awwal 1394 H (April 1974) in which 140 delegations of Muslim countries and organizations from all over the world participated. I (Mohammad Bashir) too was there in this Conference alongwith the other journalists from all over the world. The Conference unanimously adopted the following Resolution regarding Qadianism.
Qadianism or Ahmadiyyat: It is a subversive movement against Islam and the Muslim world, which falsely and decietfully claims to be an Islamic sect; who under the guise of Islam and for the sake of mundane interests contrives and plans to damage the very foundations of Islam. Its eminent deviations from the basic Islamic principles are as follows:
Its founder claimed that he was a Prophet.
They deliberately distort the meanings of the verses of the Holy Quran.
They declared that Jehad has been abolished.
Qadianism was originally fostered by the British imperialism. Hence it has been flourishing under her flag. This movement has completely been disloyal to and dishonest in affairs of the Muslim Ummah. Rather, it has been loyal to Imperialism and Zionism. It has deep associations and cooperation with the anti Islamic forces and teachings especially through the following nefarious methods:
Construction of mosques with the assistance of the anti Islamic forces wherin the misleading Qadiani thoughts are imparted to the people.
Opening of schools institutions and orphanages wherein the people are taught and trained as to how they can be more anti Islamic in their activities. They also published the corrupted versions of the Holy Quran in different local and international languages.
In order to combat these dangers, the Conference recommends the following measures:
All the Muslim organization in the world must keep a vigilant eye on all the activities of Qadianisin their respective countries; to confine them all strictly to their schools, institutions and orphanages only. Moreover he Muslims of the world be shown the true picture of Qadianism and be briefed of their various tactics so that the Muslims of the world be saved from their designs.
They must be declared non Muslims and ousted form the fold of Islam. And be barred to enter the Holy lands.
There must be no dealings with the Qadianis. They must be boycotted socially , economically and culturally Nor they be married with or to Nor they be allowed to be buried in the Muslims graveyards. And they be treated like other non Muslims.
All the Muslim countries must impose restrictions on the activities of the claimant of Prophethood Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani’s followers; must declare them a non Muslim minority must not etrust them them with any post of responsibility in any Muslim country.
The alterations effected by them in the Holy Quran must be made public and the people be briefed of them and all these be prohibited for further publication.
All such groups as are deviators from islam must be treated at par with the Qadianis.”
Despite these religious edicts, Ahmadiyya Movement and its followers (ahmadis) continue to pretend to be Muslim and the Champions of Islam, who are admired by the Westerners for their moderate views. The reason for their obstinacy is quite obvious. They are the fifth columnists amongst the Muslims and their so-called islamic identity provide a cover for their clandestine activities while they continue to serve the interests of their masters.” [7]
Views of Prominent British Muslims about the Ahmadi sect.
“Iqbal Sacranie, secretary general of the Muslim Council of Britain, has a different take. “Whilst we fully accept the right of Ahmadiyas to their own religion, it is clearly misleading to describe them as Muslims. They are outside the fold of Islam.”
His views are endorsed by Lord Nazir Ahmed of Rotherham, who said, “Ahmadiyyas are not Muslims. Therefore calling the religious complex in Morden a mosque hurts the sentiments of those who believe in Mohammed, the last prophet of Islam, peace be upon him.”
Born in ***************** Kashmir, Lord Ahmed is well known among Kashmiri immigrants and Pakistanis.”
A Perspective of the Ahmadiyya sect
The following information is intended to give a perspective of the Ahmadiyya sect in relation to orthodox Muslims, Christianity, and the rest of the world at large.
Views of mainstream Muslims
Orthodox Muslims (Sunnis and Shias) consider the Ahmadi sects to be heretics for a number of reasons, chief among them being the question of finality of the prophethood, since Ahmadis believe members of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community do not regard the Islamic prophet Muhammad to be the last prophet ( however, the Lahore Ahmadiyya Movement does not subscribe to this belief). Ahmadis claim that this is a result of misinterpreting Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s statements referring to his coming “in the spirit of Muhammed”, (similar to John the Baptist coming in the spirit and power of Elijah).The Ahmadi sect believes that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad to be the Mahdi and promised Messiah, while mainstream Muslims refute/reject this claim, they do not believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad fulfilled the prophecies about the Promised Messiah and Mahdi and see him as a false prophet. Both Ahmadi groups are considered non-Muslims by the Pakistan government, and have this fact recorded on their travel documents. In contrast Ahmadi citizens from Western countries and other moderate Muslim nations perform Hajj and Umra as the Saudi government is not made aware they are Ahmadis when applying for the visa. A court decision has also upheld the right of Ahmadiyyas to identify themselves as Muslims in India.
As the Lahore Ahmadiyya Movement’s view regarding Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s status as a Prophet is closer to traditional Islamic thought, the Literature published by the Lahore Ahmadiyya Movement has found greater acceptability among the Muslim Intelligentsia.
Some mainstream Muslims group both Ahmadi sects together and refer to them as “Qadianis”, and their beliefs as “Qadianism” (after the small town of Qadian in the Gurdaspur District of Punjab in India, where the movement’s founder was born). However most, if not all, Ahmadis of both sects dislike this term as it has acquired derogatory connotations over the years and furthermore they prefer to differentiate their two separate movements. Furthermore, mainstream Muslims will not use the term “Muslim” when referring to Ahmadis, even though both sects refer to themselves as such citing the fatwas given by the Islamic scholars. However, as members of Lahore Ahmadiyya Movement deny the prophethood of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, some orthodox Islamic Scholars consider the Lahore Ahmadiyya as Muslims. In earlier times in Pakistan and India, there was widespread persecution of Ahmadis by certain Muslim groups. Sporadic violence as well as persecution of a more subtle nature against Ahmadis continues even today. This forced the Pakistani Government to declare Qadianis non-Muslims.
AHMADIYYA’s DECLARE Orthodox Muslims (Sunnis and Shias etc) As NON-MUSLIMS
Ahmadis are also at odds with several fundamental orthodox Islamic beliefs.
The following quote clearly states that Ahmadiyya members reject traditional (orthordox) Muslims as “non-Muslims.” Ahmadiyya represent less than 2% of the world Muslims, but this is a reaction to the rejection of the Ahmadiyya sect.
“In the same book, Mirza Mahmud Ahmad summarises an earlier article of his, published in April 1911, which had sparked off the doctrinal differences that led to the Split. He explains:
“Regarding the main subject of my article, I wrote that as we believed the Promised Messiah to be one of the prophets of God, we could not possibly regard his deniers as Muslims.” (pp.137.138)
And he writes that he had drawn the following conclusion in the article:
“. . . not only are those deemed to be Kafirs who openly style the Promised Messiah as Kafir, and those who, although they do not style him thus, decline still to accept his claim, but even those who, in their hearts, believe the Promised Messiah to be true, and do not even deny him with their tongues, but hesitate to enter into his Bai`at, have here been adjudged to be Kafirs.” (pp. 139, 140)
In his book Anwar-i Khilafat, published in 1916, Mirza Mahmud Ahmad wrote:
“It is our duty that we must not consider non-Ahmadis as Muslims, and we must not pray following them, because we believe that they are denying a prophet of Almighty God.”
The two doctrines stated above clearly is the demarkation of the irreconcilable split of doctrines between the Ahmadiyya sect and that of Orthodox Islam. No orthodox Islamic sect could compromise on this issue because Ahmadi doctrines do not conform to the interpretation of the orthodox Qur’an.
Relationship with Christians
Christian missionaries during the life of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad were actively engaged in debates, prayer duels and written arguments with the Ahmadiyya Movement. The Ahmadiyya Movement considers Christian nations (particularly of the developed world) to be the prophesied Dajjal and Gog and Magog, thus making the relationship very hostile. The Ahmadiyya view of death of Jesus has also been a source of ongoing friction with the Christian Church.
Abbot Freeland, observed in his book, Islam and Pakistan,
The primary significance of the Ahmadiyya Movement lay in its missionary emphasis. Every Muslim believed that Islam was the only religion free from error. The Ahmadiyyas made it part of their principles to show the errors of other religions to their adherents and to proselytize energetically for Islam. In a sense, the Ahmadiyyas represent the Muslims emerging, religiously speaking, from the withdrawal that had begun with the arrival of the British, just as the Muslim League represents the political emergence from that same withdrawal. ……………………………. It is somewhat ironic that the sect most attacked by Muslims in India and Pakistan has also been that, which has worked hardest, in both its branches, to defend and extend Islam against the competition offered by other faiths.
Ghulam Ahmad was constantly engaged in controversies with the British missionaries. Western historians have recorded this effort as one of the features of Ghulam Ahmad’s legacy. Francis Robinson states;
At their most extreme religious strategies for dealing with the Christian presence might involve attacking Christian revelation at its heart, as did the Punjabi Muslim, Ghulam Ahmad (d.1908), who founded the Ahmadiyya missionary sect.
 
Why Ahemediyas are non muslims, while agha khanis are considered muslims?
Both have Imams...
they as well are considered as a sect

it doesn't mean they can be well considered
i have not a bad consideration on ismaelis for many reasons, one of them is the layers of lecture of Quran
 
Why Ahemediyas are non muslims, while agha khanis are considered muslims?
Both have Imams...
The Agha Khanis are not as bad as the Qadyanis are. The Qadyanis are the worst. Work on the directions of Dajjal/Anti-Christ group/pplz
 
ashok321 - It is the Ahmadis themselves who declared this as stated by their founder


"Question: Huzoor-e-aali has mentioned in thousands of places that it is not at all right to call KAFIR a Kalima-go (one who recites a Kalima) and an Ahle-Qibla. It is quite obvious that except those Momineen who become Kafir by rejecting you, just by not accepting you no one becomes a Kafir. But you write to Abdul Hakeem Khan that anyone who has recieved my message and he has not accepted me, he is not muslim. There is contradiction between this statement and the statements in previous books. Earlier in Tiryaq-ul-Quloob etc you had mentioned that no one becomes Kafir by not accepting you and now you are writing that by rejecting me he becomes a Kafir.
Answer: This is strange that you consider the person who rejects me and the person who calls me Kafir as two different persons, whereas in the eyes of God he is the same type; because he who does not accept me is because he considers me a fabricator.... apart from this, he who does not accept me, he does not believe in God and His Prophet as well, because there is God and his Prophet's prophecy regarding me"

(Haqeeqat-ul-Wahi, Roohani Khazain vol.22 p.167)

http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i421/rab_zuk1/QA-kaffir.jpg

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"Thus remember as God has informed me, it is forbidden and absolutely forbidden to pray behind any disbeliever and hesitant; but is should be that your imam should be one of you." (Arbaeen No 3, Roohani Khazain vol.17 p.417 footnote)

http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i421/rab_zuk1/kaffir2.jpg

----------

"Except for the CHILDREN OF PROSTITUTE, whose hearts have been sealed by God, everyone else believes in me and has accepted me."

(Aina-e-Kamalat-e-Islam, Roohani Khazain vol.5 p.547)

http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i421/rab_zuk1/Kaffir1.jpg - Top half of page

http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i421/rab_zuk1/Kaffir1a.jpg - Bottom half of page

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It is when the above comments were mentioned in the Parliament house in Pakistan were Ahmadis declared Non-Muslim
 
roadtrunner.............first gets the facts of Ahmaddiya sorted.......... they are the product of the West for what reason...........

Why were they put togethre in the first place....... what is their true agenda.........

The true agenda of the Ahmadiyy is irrelevant.

Whether the Ahmadiyy are Muslim is irrelevant.

Ahmadiyy rights are relevant. It is very easy to prove they are not Muslim with text evidence. Why are laws required?

No one should be discriminated, however Pakistan is a country where everyone is a target........ Ahmadis make up less then a percent........... 80 Ahmadis died in the bomb attacks in Pakistan thusa far out of 40,000.......... work out the maths..... why would anyone give then special treatment.

It could be because they are a very small percentage of the population of Pakistan? So less of them would be able to be targeted. The point is that there is no need for any law on them. Why have one? Explain.

If treason has been committed with Islam then it should be dealt with and Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) example's are clear here....

Musailama al-Kazzab: Among the first false claimants to Prophecy was Musailama al-Kazzab, who appeared during the time of Prophet Muhammad (upon whom be blessings and peace) and his Companions and caused numerous troubles among Muslims and had many followers. He eventually surrendered along with his supporters in Al-Yamama battle, led by the first Caliph Abu Bakr, and was killed.

Sajah al-Kahenah: Along with Musailama in falsely claiming Prophethood, was his wife, Sajah al-Kahenah, although she later reversed her position after her husband, Musailama, had been killed.

Declare that these actions by Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) himself were incorrect, and then discuss this topic further......... Ahmaddiya can be seen as a treason of Islam and the actions of the Prophet show a clear example

Every Ahmadiyy hasn't committed treason. Don't be so silly. Most are just born into it.
 
thats why we had so many protest before this law was passed. Most notably in 1953 Actually goverment had to do this under the pressure of people.

This is what they did in 1953;

For two days last week, a wild mob ruled the Pakistan city of Lahore (pop. 849,000). Surging through the streets, hungry ******* stoned and stabbed police, burned buses and automobiles, ripped up railroad tracks, cut telegraph wires, smashed traffic lights and forcibly blackened the faces of anyone caught riding a bicycle or automobile. All shops closed and public officials fled. The city's 300 police, disarmed by the mob, were withdrawn from the streets. All communication with the outside world was cut off.

It was a minor revolution which swept this capital of the fertile Punjab province—a revolution engineered by fanatical mullahs against the Pakistan government. Five and a half years ago, when millions of frightened refugees were pouring into newly created Pakistan, the mullahs were the people's leaders. They had a strong voice in the government. But when the country began establishing industries, hospitals, schools and banks, the mullahs protested that these innovations clashed with Islamic law. When Pakistani women shed their veils and emerged from purdah (complete seclusion in the home), the more fanatic mullahs were outraged. When the time came for Pakistan to draw up a constitution, the mullahs demanded that it be based on the Koran. (Result: Pakistan, a nation of 76 million, is still without a constitution.) The government of Prime Minister Kwaja Nazimuddin avoided an open clash with religious leaders, but paid less attention to their counsel.

The Hungry Mobs. Last month a religious group known as the Ahraris, influenced by fanatic mullahs, demanded that the government declare half a million members of the Ahmadiya sect to be non-*******. The Ahmadiyas are a close-knit and unpopular group, followers of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, who at the turn of the century declared himself a Nabi, or prophet of Allah. There was politics in the mullahs' demands, because Pakistan's Foreign Minister, able, bearded Sir Mohammed Zafrullah Khan, is an Ahmadiya.* The Ahraris' mullahs demanded his removal. When the government refused, the mullahs began stirring up trouble, particularly in Lahore, where there are many Ahmadiyas. Craftily they timed their protest to occur before the new season's crops were harvested, when people were hungry.

Spellbinding mullahs whipped up crowds in Lahore's many mosques, and in a few days wild processions were shouting anti-Ahmadiya slogans. When police clubbed and shot demonstrators, the bodies of the dead and wounded were dragged to the mosques, where the mullahs exhibited them. Within a week the Ahmadiyas had been forgotten: thousands of hungry Pakistanis had turned their wrath on the government. In the streets they cried "Hai Nazimuddin" (Woe on Nazimuddin).

The Counter Blow. When news of the Lahore uprising reached Prime Minister Nazimuddin in Karachi, he ordered 44-year-old Major General Mohammed Azam Khan, commander of the military cantonment outside Lahore, to move into the city and regain control. Ten thousand Pakistani troops put the city under martial law. Within six hours the revolution was over.

...

At week's end, Moslem Prime Minister Nazimuddin cautiously blamed the Ahraris for the rioting. This was strong stuff in a nation founded on religion. When the Ahraris failed to protest. Nazimuddin boldly lashed out, accused them of having opposed the formation of Pakistan. The Ahraris stayed silent.

The only sound in Lahore was the banshee wail of the curfew siren and the tramp of hobnailed military boots on the darkened, empty streets.

* Another of his distinctions: to have made the longest-winded speech in U.N. history, which took up two consecutive Security Council meetings. Subject: India's misdeeds [in Kashmir].

Read more: PAKISTAN: The Mad Mullahs - TIME

This the work of good Muslims trying to uphold Islamic values...hardly.

..and the Justice Munir report;
The Mullah and the Munir Report - Chowk: India Pakistan Ideas Identities.com

clearly explains that this was a politically motivated movement in religious guise to;

a. Allow mullahs who had opposed creation of Pakistan such as Maududi, Ihrars and Deobandi Maulanas and had lost credibility among Muslims to regain lost ground, and

b. Allow Mumtaz Doltana, chief minister of Punjab who was underhand supporting the movement, to undermined federal government of Khawaja Nazimuddin and become Governor General himself if possible.

So this movement was entrenched in bigotry and self interests by the maulanas and the politicians then and still is now.
 
i think secular government would work. so could one based on religious law. it would need to be logical though

Islamic constituion can work as Quaid e Azam said

"The constitution of Pakistan has yet to be framed by the Pakistan Constituent Assembly. I do not know what the ultimate shape of this constitution is going to be, but I am sure that it will be of a democratic type, embodying the essential principle of Islam. Today, they are as applicable in actual life as they were 1,300 years ago. Islam and its idealism have taught us democracy. It has taught equality of man, justice and fair play to everybody. We are the inheritors of these glorious traditions and are fully alive to our responsibilities and obligations as framers of the future constitution of Pakistan. In any case Pakistan is not going to be a theocratic State to be ruled by priests with a divine mission. We have many non-Muslims — Hindus, Christians, and Parsis — but they are all Pakistanis. They will enjoy the same rights and privileges as any other citizens and will play their rightful part in the affairs of Pakistan”.

Unfortunately we never practiced equality of man, justice and fair play to everybody

( and for qadiyani they never acted like a minority so their case is different )
 
Hello everyone.

We've established they're probably not Muslim. Can we move on?

So they're non Muslim. What is the point of a law for them?
 
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