Agencies in NW Pakistan

[Armstrong]

Are you advocating that it is okay for the Supreme Court not to be the supreme legal authority with jurisdiction over all the territory of Pakistan? What other modern country tolerates that?

65 years have gone by and no steps to even begin effecting a change in this shameful state of affairs have been taken.

I'd say take their existing system temper it with some of the better local government systems out there & let it run its course till the people out grow it.

Shoving a dysfunctional foreign system down their throats would be a massive cultural shock & could possibly even lead to a reprisal of sorts.

 

[Icarus]

But how can one have a Supreme Court that is not supreme? Amongst the many considerations, given the present circumstances, it reinforces the international perception that these areas are lawless breeding grounds for terrorism, and thus fair game for attacks since laws of the State of Pakistan do not apply there.

I know it sounds crazy but it's actually a very fair and balanced system. You have to be a part of it to understand the beauty of it.

 

[VCheng]

I know it sounds crazy but it's actually a very fair and balanced system. You have to be a part of it to understand the beauty of it.

Sir, I accept that the existing local system may work just fine, it is just that the existing situation, on a certain legal level, means that those areas are not quite part of the State of Pakistan, and therein lies the rub.

 

[Icarus]

But how can one have a Supreme Court that is not supreme? Amongst the many considerations, given the present circumstances, it reinforces the international perception that these areas are lawless breeding grounds for terrorism, and thus fair game for attacks since laws of the State of Pakistan do not apply there.

These people operate on Xenophobia. They are averse to foreign presence and influence, by foreign I don't mean from our of the continent, I mean out of that particular agency. In such a case, you cannot just tell them that some people sitting in Islamabad have scrapped their way of living and they are subject to such and such laws from this moment on. To quote Armstrong, there will be reprisals. I reiterate that any change has to be brought in gradually, over the course of a few decades.

 

[VCheng]

These people operate on Xenophobia. They are averse to foreign presence and influence, by foreign I don't mean from our of the continent, I mean out of that particular agency. In such a case, you cannot just tell them that some people sitting in Islamabad have scrapped their way of living and they are subject to such and such laws from this moment on. To quote Armstrong, there will be reprisals. I reiterate that any change has to be brought in gradually, over the course of a few decades.

With nothing done for 65 years already, and given the present situation, how many more decades would you propose?

 

[Icarus]

Sir, I accept that the existing local system may work just fine, it is just that the existing situation, on a certain legal level, means that those areas are not quite part of the State of Pakistan, and therein lies the rub.

To some extent yes, FATA is a Special Administrative Region and can be considered a satellite of Pakistan, rather than a part of it.

 

[VCheng]

To some extent yes, FATA is a Special Administrative Region and can be considered a satellite of Pakistan, rather than a part of it.

Thank you. I am sure you do understand the implications of such an admission.

 

[Icarus]

With nothing done for 65 years already, and given the present situation, how many more decades would you propose?

Over the last 6 decades, very minute changes have been brought about. The people have been granted seats in National and Provincial Legislatures, National Education has been introduced, the FCR has been brought into agreement with the laws of Pakistan.

With the prevailing situation, I'd say two decades to fully root out the effects of the Taliban Insurgency and then we can get somewhere. That too if we have a system that delivers results.

Thank you. I am sure you do understand the implications of such an admission.

There is nothing to be admitted about that statement, it is in fact state policy. Azad Kashmir, FATA and formerly FANA are/were SARs not subject to the laws of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan.

 

[VCheng]

Over the last 6 decades, very minute changes have been brought about. The people have been granted seats in National and Provincial Legislatures, National Education has been introduced, the FCR has been brought into agreement with the laws of Pakistan.

With the prevailing situation, I'd say two decades to fully root out the effects of the Taliban Insurgency and then we can get somewhere. That too if we have a system that delivers results.

Thank you for that information, at least it is a start of sorts, but two decades might a luxury ill-afforded by the present situation.

There is nothing to be admitted about that statement, it is in fact state policy. Azad Kashmir, FATA and formerly FANA are/were SARs not subject to the laws of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan.

I was referring to the implications, not the admission per se, Sir.

 

[Icarus]

Thank you for that information, at least it is a start of sorts, but two decades might a luxury ill-afforded by the present situation.

3 Decades is the time needed to completely defeat an insurgency (Only if successful) because it is the time taken for two complete generations to mature and thus for the insurgent's ideology to lose favour and sympathisers with each passing generation. This generation will continue to carry the ideology within them, whether they agree with it or not. The next shall receive some parts of it and so on, until it dies out.

I was referring to the implications, not the admission per se, Sir.

Implications such as.........

 

[VCheng]

3 Decades is the time needed to completely defeat an insurgency (Only if successful) because it is the time taken for two complete generations to mature and thus for the insurgent's ideology to lose favour and sympathisers with each passing generation. This generation will continue to carry the ideology within them, whether they agree with it or not. The next shall receive some parts of it and so on, until it dies out.

I sure hope such a long period of time is available.

Implications such as.........

I don't want to paint an even bigger target on my forehead on DefPk than the previous one, now do I, Sir?

What was the old saying, "Aa bayle mujhe maar"?

 

[Icarus]

I sure hope such a long period of time is available.

COIN is a time-consuming game. The US fails to learn that, which is why their COIN campaigns remain unsuccessful. You have to wait it out, like a stare down. The question is not if the time is available or not but whether we can MAKE the time. Our military successes in the present will secure our ideological victory in the long run. The physical space has been recovered, now the politicos and time will reclaim the social space.

I don't want to paint an even bigger target on my forehead on DefPk than the previous one, now do I, Sir?

What was the old saying, "Aa bayle mujhe maar"?

I assure you, there won't be a problem. I can understand your vibes but need to be very sure of where you are coming from in order to present a valid and accurate counter-argument.

 

[truthseer]

How come people don't comment on the manipulations of agencies in Sindh?

 

[truthseer]

Implications such as.........

He is trying to lead you into saying that Drones are allowed

 

[474474]

No more of a Peshawar via Bajaur syndrome !

P.S On a serious note why do you say that ?

You are overly nice to traitors, you act like when a certain group does something wrong claims somethings wrong, it's not as bad as if others would have done it.
Maybe you won't get what I'm saying but it's a unique and constant trait in you I can't stop noticing.