Afghanistan’s Future according to Amrullah Saleh

[Indus Pakistan]

Your absolutely correct sometimes i ask myself the same question what is the difference between us and them do we have our own history or we live under the history of our Indian ancestors ??

The truth is we do have our own history. Depending on which part of Pakistan your from we have our own history, own culture, own language and own ethnic group. The problem is for variety of reasons this has not been allowed to firmly defined and developed. The result you say today we are a nation of with no identity. Look at it this way are the following people same.

1.
Pashtun
Punjabi
Sindhi
Baloch

2.
Bengali
Tamil
Kannada
Bengali
Maratta

Clearly group 1 and group 2 are not the same. In fact they are more differant than a German or English or French are. Pakistan is a composite of of group 1. Nothing wrong with this. India is composite of at least 20 peoples. Afghanistan is composite of at least 4.

What we have done in Pakistan is wrapped our identity entirely around one strand. Islam. The problem with that is does a Nigeran Muslim also a Pakistani? Is a Chechen Muslim also a Pakistani?

@A-Team Trust me I know why he does that. The problem with that is he maybe garnering support but in the long term he is creating problems by throwing oil over fire of hate. This will work against Pak/Afghan coming to peace with each other. Not good in the long run.

 

[xyxmt]

Contrary to what some members think -- it is important to hear what Amrullah Salleh has to say since he represents the thinking and opinions of a large section of the Afghan population.

Interview here, excerpts below:

Pakistan has always supported the Taliban. It has also always been involved in destabilizing Afghanistan. Why do you think Pakistan wants an unstable Afghanistan? What is it about an unstable Afghanistan that benefits Pakistan? 

Pakistan is a politically insecure, psychologically nervous, and strategically narrow-minded state. It wants parity with India. In the belief of the Pakistani strategists, subordination of Afghanistan to the wishes and demands of Pakistan will give them a depth in the region and will in some way put pressure on India. They also hate seeing Afghanistan have a democratic system. Pakistan sees democracy as an existential threat. A real, robust democracy will transform Pakistan into a cultural and economic satellite state of India. Something that the Pakistani leaders want to avoid at any cost. While on the surface Pakistan seems to have a democracy, it is an army-run country. Democracy in its truest sense does not exist in Pakistan. On critical foreign policy issues — issues that have the potential to change the national fate of Pakistan — it’s not the country’s parliament that has decision making powers, but its army’s.

Actually what he said is quite different than what he thinks, what he thinks?
Do a search and replace - replace "Pakistan" with "Afghanistan", replace "India" with "Pakistan"
he is thinking the the truth

 

[bdslph]

I'm repeating myself here again: "this guy is smoking, the stuff he sells!"

dude every afgan smokes the fun staff and they start talking like that
when you smoke that the side effect

 

[Kaniska]

Yes, indeed it is right of you to post this. It is the smart thing to listen to what your detractors are saying. You guy's have failed to understand what he is saying. You should never underestimate your enemy. This Tajik belonging to Norther Alliance is smart as they come.

What he is saying is that Pakistan does not have a identity. That it's existance is in the shadow of India. That it must oppose India because not having a identity means if it made peace with India it would just coalesce back into India. That it is just estranged Indian who if peace is made will just fall in line. In other words it would just be a province of India. Is this true? Maybe or maybe not.

Do we have our identity? Do we have our language? Do we have our own history? Do we have separate clearly defined profile across the world?

Yesterday I drove past mile of shops in a neighbourhood in UK. These are the shops I saw. Asian Cloth House, Dhesi Sweet Centre, Apna Money exchange, Islamic Relief, Muslim Finance, Indian Restaurent, Kurdistan Restaurent, Slovakian Grocery, South Asian Fruits & Veg.

From this what would you conclude is the primary community in that neighbourhood? Kurdish? Slovakian? Indian? No, you would be wrong. It is 94% Pakistani, 2% Kurds, 2% Slovakian, zero Indian.

Now what does that tell you? Insecurity? Lack of depth? Psychological issues around knowing who and what it is? Please do some introspection.

Ps. The Kurds don't even have a country called Kurdistan. Slovakia is smaller than Sindh. Yet they have no issues about announcing who they are. They don't use adjectives to avoid using the name of their country.

Just to add you to the post...Sometime i get surprised why you guys do not even name the shops, restaurants or even clothing stores with Pakistan in its name....If small african nation like Ethiopia can have a restaurants and shops with their own name, why not Pakistan people do the same in US?? Is it lack of confidence in their nationhood or just interested in making more money by putting India or Desi name on the top of the stores???

 

[Razia Sultana]

Just to add you to the post...Sometime i get surprised why you guys do not even name the shops, restaurants or even clothing stores with Pakistan in its name....If small african nation like Ethiopia can have a restaurants and shops with their own name, why not Pakistan people do the same in US?? Is it lack of confidence in their nationhood or just interested in making more money by putting India or Desi name on the top of the stores???

The name India was given by europeans after indus river and in 1947 when we got freedom along with partition the western part of India where the indus river majorly flows opted to have a new name. The issue is you cant back date that and give a new name to 5000 years history and heritage. Had Pakistan chosen to be known as West India just like North & South Korea perhaps they would have had the first claim over the history and heritage vis-a-vis their easten counterparts. Now if they do claim their place they have this fear of being second fiddle to India as rightly commented by Amarullah saleh.

 

[pakistani342]

The name India was given by europeans after indus river and in 1947 when we got freedom along with partition the western part of India where the indus river majorly flows opted to have a new name. The issue is you cant back date that and give a new name to 5000 years history and heritage. Had Pakistan chosen to be known as West India just like North & South Korea perhaps they would have had the first claim over the history and heritage vis-a-vis their easten counterparts. Now if they do claim their place they have this fear of being second fiddle to India as rightly commented by Amarullah saleh.

Really, really?

So India preferes to be called by a name given by Europeans -- why use it at all -- why not go back to your roots like Bombay became Mumbai, Banglore became Banaluru, etc. Why use India.

What people forget to say remember conveniently is that Modern India as in 1946 was cobbled together by the Europeans, yes the British. So a united India would have been a British concoction. For all the swadeshi fans (and I guess I am one to an extent) why stick with a European definition of ourselves. Why not go to princely states, or Ashoka's kingdom.

And, if we are to look to at our other Human cousins. Iran is not called Persia nor is Italy called Rome. Iranians have not given up their culture because they are no longer called Persia.

Because Pakistan was founded in 1947 -- people somehow think Pakistanis popped out of thin air in 1947. We are as old or as young as anybody else.

Further the US is only 229 years old -- they don't seem to have any issues when dealing with 5000 year old states now do they.

Age is but a number?

Razi Sultana as confused as Amrullah Saleh?

Further why don't Razi Sulatan and Amrullah Saleh convert back to Hinduism and Buddism respectively, clearly their forefathers converted only a few centuries ago.

Just to add you to the post...Sometime i get surprised why you guys do not even name the shops, restaurants or even clothing stores with Pakistan in its name....If small african nation like Ethiopia can have a restaurants and shops with their own name, why not Pakistan people do the same in US?? Is it lack of confidence in their nationhood or just interested in making more money by putting India or Desi name on the top of the stores???

My dear in the US nearly all the Sushi restaurants are run by the Korean Americans -- why don't they call Sushi restaurants Korean restaurants.

Or why don't Indians call Indian restaurants Bharati restaurants -- clearly the Indus river is in Pakistan not India. I suspect the explanation is more mundane -- good marketing.

Imagine if all the Indian restaurants labelled themselves as Bharati restaurants.

 

[Kaniska]

Really, really?

So India preferes to be called by a name given by Europeans -- why use it at all -- why not go back to your roots like Bombay became Mumbai, Banglore became Banaluru, etc. Why use India.

What people forget to say remember conveniently is that Modern India as in 1946 was cobbled together by the Europeans, yes the British. So a united India would have been a British concoction. For all the swadeshi fans (and I guess I am one to an extent) why stick with a European definition of ourselves. Why not go to princely states, or Ashoka's kingdom.

And, if we are to look to at our other Human cousins. Iran is not called Persia nor is Italy called Rome. Iranians have not given up their culture because they are no longer called Persia.

Because Pakistan was founded in 1947 -- people somehow think Pakistanis popped out of thin air in 1947. We are as old or as young as anybody else.

Further the US is only 229 years old -- they don't seem to have any issues when dealing with 5000 year old states now do they.

Age is but a number?

Razi Sultana as confused as Amrullah Saleh?

Further why don't Razi Sulatan and Amrullah Saleh convert back to Hinduism and Buddism respectively, clearly their forefathers converted only a few centuries ago.



My dear in the US nearly all the Sushi restaurants are run by the Korean Americans -- why don't they call Sushi restaurants Korean restaurants.

Or why don't Indians call Indian restaurants Bharati restaurants -- clearly the Indus river is in Pakistan not India. I suspect the explanation is more mundane -- good marketing.

Imagine if all the Indian restaurants labelled themselves as Bharati restaurants.

Because...we do not have issues between Bharaat and India...For us it is same thing...But it is not same thing, when a Pakistan resturant name it as Indian resturant in US.

 

[pakistani342]

Because...we do not have issues between Bharaat and India...For us it is same thing...But it is not same thing, when a Pakistan resturant name it as Indian resturant in US.

Just because it is the same thing for you does not mean it is so historically or that is has the mean the same thing for other people.

I'll name my restaurant Martian restaurant as long as it complies with my moral code and generates profit.

The arguments being used are bogus.

India as referring to the Indus valley civilization is not Modern India -- so just because you have co-opted India -- why shouldn't other people. Could it mean that you are not secure in your non-Indus valley civilization heritage?

 

[Kaniska]

Just because it is the same thing for you does not mean it is so historically or that is has the mean the same thing for other people.

I'll name my restaurant Martian restaurant as long as it complies with my moral code and generates profit.

The arguments being used are bogus.

India as referring to the Indus valley civilization is not Modern India -- so just because you have co-opted India -- why shouldn't other people. Could it mean that you are not secure in your non-Indus valley civilization heritage?

Thanks for accepting that you are trying to coopt the ancient India..I am really glad that you are accepting your own roots..No argument on this point..

 

[pakistani342]

Thanks for accepting that you are trying to coopt the ancient India..I am really glad that you are accepting your own roots..No argument on this point..

I was not denying my roots.

If I'm not mistaken Pakistan has/had a case against India that India cannot use the word India in the International Court (?) -- not sure where that went.

That for some reason you are co-opting my heritage (Indus valley civilization) might give you pause -- ;-) -- tell me how does that make you feel

 

[Kaniska]

I was denying my roots.

If I'm not mistaken Pakistan has/had a case against India that India cannot use the word India -- not sure where that went.

That for some reason you are co-opting mine (Indus valley civilization) might give you pause -- ;-)

Even i am also surprised...I am not trolling now...Let us be honest...the Pakistan is the place of the Sindhu Civilization...But you guys never ever tries to accept your roots....rather you accepted the roots of the people who invaded you and us too....And for us, we call them invaders so we accept the emotions of a place which is supposed to be unline you who accepts invaders are your hero...That is why you never carries the legacy of the great civilization..

 

[pakistani342]

Even i am also surprised...I am not trolling now...Let us be honest...the Pakistan is the place of the Sindhu Civilization...But you guys never ever tries to accept your roots....rather you accepted the roots of the people who invaded you and us too....And for us, we call them invaders so we accept the emotions of a place which is supposed to be unline you who accepts invaders are your hero...That is why you never carries the legacy of the great civilization..

Well there may be some truth to what you say -- but then so is that true with you -- unless your family emigrated from what is now Pakistan to what is now India -- you should, by your logic, embrace your roots whatever they are -- which I presume is not Indus valley.

Further before we were Hindus we were Buddhists I think -- before we were Buddhists we were Hindus (first round) -- before we were Hindus (first round) we must have been something else -- animal worship (like the Nuristianis) ???

Perhaps we've discovered a human trait? that we humans take on cultures, values of other people and then think they are ours?

Thoughts? or does time only start with the Vedas and Upanishads?

In science we must trust?

 

[Kaniska]

Well there may be some truth to what you say -- but then so is that true with you -- unless your family emigrated from what is now Pakistan to what is now India -- you should, by your logic, embrace your roots whatever they are -- which I presume is not Indus valley.

Further before we were Hindus we were Buddhists I think -- before we were Buddhists we were Hindus (first round) -- before we were Hindus (first round) we must have been something else -- animal worship (like the Nuristianis) ???

Perhaps we've discovered a human trait? that we humans take on cultures, values of other people and then think they are ours?

Thoughts? or does time only start with the Vedas and Upanishads?

In science we must trust?

Nice and logical reply...I appreciate it.

 

[mingle]

ALLAH ki shaan democracy in Afghanistan Kia baat hai Punj Sheri rang baz ki.

 

[pakistani342]

Nice and logical reply...I appreciate it.

@Kaniska Bhaijan -- and (not trolling now, and not being sarcastic at all -- but genuinely asking): Our Indian brothers must know this right? so why do we get the arguments about roots like the ones you posted. What I've stated above is pretty basic and not rocket science.

BTW, as a side: I registered a couple of times for Sanskrit classes but unfortunately had to drop out of them due to time commitments and I practiced yoga after coming to the US for many years -- hope to restart next year.