Afghan president dismisses Pakistani training offer

[ramu]

This is very much related to this topic

You were talking about looking after 'interests' of afghans I just remined you that there is more looking after to done in your india than in afghanistan , it makes more sense to help your fellow coutrymen lift themselves out of poverty than to spend 1.4 bn$ in afghanistan, which is intended only as a means to destablise Pakistan.

Indians are looking into the problems inside and outside India and are trying to protect their interests. Now your bird brain can't understand foreign policy or can appreciate Indian effort to uplift its poor. The activities of good local governance is independent of Indian interaction with other countries. I know I am talking to a wall and if you continue your illogical rant, I will ignore your posts.

What makes more sense for India is for Indians to decide. If have no choice in Afghans decisions and this is a thread that is not about India or Indian poverty. It is about Afghanistan telling your General "No thanks". Now you take offence and I can understand your frustration.

 

[ramu]

equally I can say that you have no interest in 're-buliding' afghanistan your only aim is to create problems for Pakistan under the guise of 'looking after interests of common afghans'

You cannot decide for Afghanistan dude. It is for Afghans to decide whether we are rebuilding Afghanistan or not.

 

[rubyjackass]

Great that you said that now tell me why did u think that we had to interfere in Afghanistan when more then 3 million Afghans crossed into PAksitan. So do you think that we were wrong when we took the side of the normal Afghani when your own gov was still busy paying the cheap political card against Pakistan.

India's Position on the Occupation
India was the one major noncommunist state that maintained amicable relations with Afghanistan in the mid-1980s. Although the Indian government called for a withdrawal of Soviet troops on December 31, 1979 it also expressed its apprehensions about United States military commitments to Pakistan. New Delhi feared that newly acquired United States arms could be used against India, rather than to secure the Afghan border. Its close ties with the Soviet Union, highlighted by a treaty of friendship in 1971, were another factor in its relative reluctance to issue public condemnations of the occupation. Leaders voiced support for apolitical resolution of the crisis and deplored the use of "cold war rhetoric" to describe the situation.

An Indian observer notes that on two occasions Prime Minister Indira Gandhi, in meetings with Soviet leaders in 1980 and 1982, privately urged a pullout of Soviet troops. But before her assassination in October 1984, member nations of the Nonaligned Movement repeatedly criticized Gandhi's reluctance to publicly condemn Soviet actions. Her son, Rajiv Gandhi, elected prime minister in December 1984, was equally circumspect. He avoided criticism of the Soviet Union in his address before the UN in October 1985. As on five previous occasions, India's representative to the UN abstained in the November 13 1985, vote on the General Assembly resolution on withdrawal.
Afghanistan Country Study

May be you need to read this.
Spokane Daily Chronicle - Google News Archive Search
The part where Indira Gandhi came to power.

You will get a touch of how people used to think then. It talks of WW III and other such fears which we may be totally out of touch now.
In the same breath the report says why India had to turn towards USSR and that Indira condemned Soviet invasion. No action is isolated. It gets mixed up with politics and all that BS.
If only the US suspected India any lesser as a NAM country then, much of this bad reputation would not be there, something too much to ask of the cold-war hawks.

 

[ambidex]

Excellent. We agree and with reason. I am sure you have your reasons and we have ours. Pakistan wants peace and so do Afghans. Indians have no interest in projecting power. Win Afghan's trust and the issues you have will be ironed out.

Just adding to your wise discussion. Sooner or later when AF will become a more stable and self governed nation. They will start hating all forniers including Indians. There is nothing strategically for India in Afghanistan to use against Pakistan and same can be said about Pakistan.
I don't know what else is giving sleepless nights to Pakistan but India was never worried about Pakistan friendly regime in AF. Our approach was always benign and pessimist. But after kandahar hijacking and how terrorists were trespassed into Pakistan without objection pressed the panic button. Since then we were praying for a change and friendly govt in AF. This is in our national interest to support a democratically elected (better friendly) political party.

Rather having diplomatic relationship with a fanatic mullah it is always preferable to shake hand with well dressed diplomat. You know what i mean.
Regards

 

[FireFighter]

Indians on board are both factually and historically wrong.


Pakistan supported and helped various jihadi groups Fight off the Soviet Invaders and Occupiers. Those jhadi groups later evolutioned into the Taliban on one hand and Northern Alliance on the other.

Pakistan has no relations with Taliban anymore, infact we're fighting another version. Pak's participation in WOT is evident of the fact that we're against both terrorists elements and religious extremists. However we have reservations over the method and ways it is to ought to be done in our part of the world.

The whole western and Muslim worlds supported the Taleban/jhadi groups fight off the Soviet Invaders.


Fact: One thing Afghans as whole Nation unanimously Hate the Most:

1) Foreign Invaders

Sadly, India has always sided with the Invaders of Afghanistan in modern history.


Ask your babus one question for me: Are you guy's really in Afghanistan to settle some historical scores?

 

[pakdefender]

Just adding your wise discussion. Sooner or later when AF will become a more stable and self governed nation. They will start hating all forniers including Indians. There is nothing strategically for India in Afghanistan to use against Pakistan and same can be said about Pakistan.
I don't know what else is giving sleepless nights to Pakistan but India was never worried about Pakistan friendly regime in AF. Our approach was always benign and pessimist. But after kandahar hijacking and how terrorists were trespassed into Pakistan without objection pressed the panic button. Since then we were praying for a change and friendly govt in AF. This is in our national interest to support a democratically elected (better friendly) political party.

Rather having diplomatic relationship with a fanatic mullah it is always preferable to shake hand with well dressed diplomat. You know what i mean.
Regards

self contradiction , if you were not 'worried' then why 'pray' for a change ?

Look after the 300 million poverty stricken indians and forget about getting one up on Pakistan , your anti-Pakistan investments in afgahnistan with fetch you no ROI , unfortuantley

 

[Windjammer]

As i said elsewhere, successive governments of the day, implement their policies as they deem fit for their own benefits.

Today, India probably wouldn't send it's forces into Sri Lanka as it boldly did in the past, similarly, Talibans were sent in to stop the Afghan war lords tearing the country apart.
Today, India and Pakistan are again exercising for their own goods, it's difficult to conclude who will reap the fruits of benefits, India may get bogged down in Afghanistan or Pakistan may end up with another refugee crisis, in any case one thing is clear that President Karzai has very little say in all of this.

 

[ice_man]

KARZAI is a puppet president! just like in the SOVIET era they had a communist president! his power is ONLY in kabul! the typical pashtoons hate him! & he is an imported president just like the US likes it where ever they invade!

 

[ramu]

Indians on board are both factually and historically wrong.

Pakistan supported and helped various jihadi groups Fight off the Soviet Invaders and Occupiers. Those jhadi groups later evolutioned into the Taliban on one hand and Northern Alliance on the other.

OK, so far so good.

Pakistan has no relations with Taliban anymore, infact we're fighting another version. Pak's participation in WOT is evident of the fact that we're against both terrorists elements and religious extremists. However we have reservations over the method and ways it is to ought to be done in our part of the world.

"anymore" in the above statement is key. Pak's participation in WoT was not out of choice. Remember with us or against us. Also did you get a chance to read Musharaff's book ?

The whole western and Muslim worlds supported the Taleban/jhadi groups fight off the Soviet Invaders.

In your previous statement you say Taliban was the result of some evolution. Now you say that it was Taliban that the muslim world supported. Please don't bring religion in to everything. It was the US that mainly supported the resistance.

Fact: One thing Afghans as whole Nation unanimously Hate the Most:

1) Foreign Invaders

Sadly, India has always sided with the Invaders of Afghanistan in modern history.

Why conclude on your logic when the proof for Indian development work is on ground?

Ask your babus one question for me: Are you guy's really in Afghanistan to settle some historical scores?

 

[ramu]

KARZAI is a puppet president! just like in the SOVIET era they had a communist president! his power is ONLY in kabul! the typical pashtoons hate him! & he is an imported president just like the US likes it where ever they invade!

The day a policy goes against Pakistan, the Govt becomes a puppet. Just 2 days back, Pakistanis were hailing Karzai and making statements that sounded like history was in the making. Suddenly why this U turn?

 

[Ahmad]

It takes time to bridge the differences but i think the terrorists have unified the people on both sides.
Pak Afghan is a strange tale of love and hate...i think it will have a happy ending.
Karzai will tread carefully but we are right next door and have time.
Inshallah our efforts will bear fruit.

Fingers crossed. Good ties is good for all of us. More trust means more cooperation. We want good ties and relationship with both india and Paksitan. Relationship is already excellent with india(in terms of gov and public trust), hope we get everything in the right track with pakistan as well. If pakistani public didnt know the terror situation before about afghansitan, they know it now because they are facing the same problems. We are both in the same boat and being terrorized by the same group and party. this is one of the factors that can help us get our acts toghether.

 

[Ahmad]

dont take it to heart yara. So many will be calling him a khaar


there are many khar including ours who are acting like a khar.

Dear Jana, I dont know about your leaders, you might call them Khar(donkey in farsi), it is your choice and i dont want to be dragged to that, but it wont go down well with Afghans if you call any of their leaders Khar. Believe me or not i have been a long term critical of Karazai, if i was in afghanistan, i would never have casted my vote for him in a milion years. at the same time it is not acceptable to me if he gets insulted.

 

[Ahmad]

Afghan President is dead wrong in mentioning the Soviet Experience for like an infinite reasons.

Why not? what is the guarantee that Paksitan not to do the same thing what the soviets did?

 

[mjnaushad]

I dont understand one thing. What the big deal if he refuses. We all know he is not the guy who can make decision. Not even US president can make decision on his own. Lot of factors effect his decisions. Karzai might himself want Pakistani training for his soldier but not the "other factors" in his govt. So chill.

And i think thats why when he is here he speaks good but when get back to his "wise advisers" and "well wishers" his statements start effecting the relationship of both countries.

So chill everybody.

 

[Aslan]

You should STFU and stop dectating Afghans what to do and what not. Pakistan is investing in Afghanistan(thanks for that) and so are the indians. And please dont bring islam in the middle of such a messy politics and stop scoring political points using our religion.

Well what I said was not wrong by any means at all. Rather then telling me to shut up you should go tell your curropt and un appreciative Afghani elite to be more realistic. And should stop the support of terrorism in Pakistan. Afterall it was us the Pakistanis who supported you sheltered you fed you un thankful indian apolagetic freaks when you had no home. We sacrafised it all for all of you and where many Afghans Alhamdullilah appreciated that there were some un greatful ones like you as well. So go mind your own business and also keep your tongue stuck as high the Indians back side as you can it might come in handy for you guys latter.