Abandoning status as "Islamic Republic"

[Indian_Devil]

Easier said then done. You can see on this forum itself, the ones wanting real change are outnumbered 15-1.
As for the Pak. govt. They have SO FAR not taken any action against extremism.

Attacking few taliban outposts and giving statement is all they have done post that school attack. Nothing significant, and not directed at root cause of extremism. So far just business as usual.

Let's see if Pak. govt. does anything in future, or if the secularists can force the govt.

Your answer is hidden inside your question itself.. You have different views than the rest 15 members cause your thoughts are somewhat ahead and clear as compared to them... Yeah changing one's thought is harder than it sounds... but that is what world is all about... either change others or change yourself....
But beware, Socrates was killed only because his thinking were ahead of their fellow countrymen...

 

[Bouncer]

May I clear your doubts... that 'Sir Haafiz Saed' is an International criminal as identified by US...

And Sir Narendara Modi was put under travel restrictions for domestic terrorism by the US. What is your point?
You should have read my comment in context of discussion with @timetravel .

This thread is about Pakistan and secularism. It doesn't matter what the US or India think about a certain Pakistani, who btw is not an angel in the eyes of pro-secularism Pakistanis either.

 

[Indian_Devil]

And Sir Narendara Modi was put under travel restrictions for domestic terrorism by the US. What is your point?
You should have read my comment in context of discussion with @timetravel .

This thread is about Pakistan and secularism. It doesn't matter what the US or India think about a certain Pakistani, who btw is not an angel in the eyes of pro-secularism Pakistanis either.

Cant you differentiate between a suspect and a convict???? Ages have been passed since he was found innocent by the Courts...
Ohhhoo... to sirf khairaat lete waqt America ki yaad aati hai????

 

[Rashid Mahmood]

OP


Many have previously tried to abandon the "Islamic Republic" status for Pakistan.
You can also try....Good Luck.

 

[Ussaid]

OP


Many have previously tried to abandon the "Islamic Republic" status for Pakistan.
You can also try....Good Luck.

Thanks I guess, and I am going to need, as most Pakistanis are only ballsy enough to condemn injustice from their couches or internet posts. I truly am alone in this regard, just like every sensible person in Pakistan. Your generation's time is up anyways; the new generation wouldn't repeat the same mistakes that made Pakistan what it is today.

 

[Metanoia]

I would like Pakistan to be completely secular

 

[timetravel]

................

who btw is not an angel in the eyes of pro-secularism Pakistanis either.

Its good. I am fine if Pak. society takes out Aziz earlier, and then later remove Hafiz Sayeed. Taking on all jihadis at same time might be tough. But Hafiz needs to be eliminated from society eventually - if not today, then tomorrow. A secular Pakistan will have no place for hafiz and his Jihadis.

 

[SQ8]

Sure. Everything in Pakistan is just flowers and butterflys, and we are totally not into bestality ****, Google is ofc spreading Jewish funded lies! Nothing needs to be changed and we must accept our descend into fundamentalism. P.S Did you knew a few months ago a Christian Church was bombed up killing people in double digits? I didn't saw it much on the media, because infidels. Yeah I assume too quick because your location is the USA

Yeah all of these happened.. I saw the Christian Church being bombed in the Media.. perhaps you should not look for news in the soap opera channels. The rest of your post is of a person whose frustration in the inability to support a PoV is coming out in ranting.

 

[Ussaid]

Yeah all of these happened.. I saw the Christian Church being bombed in the Media.. perhaps you should not look for news in the soap opera channels. The rest of your post is of a person whose frustration in the inability to support a PoV is coming out in ranting.

Good thing you say it on the Media, but there in no medal I am afraid. My point was it was not the topic of conversation around the country as people weren't interested. However, ofc your opinion is superior and I am just ranting because I don't agree with you. You want a crazed Islamic State, fine, move to Iran, but the new generation of Pakistan rejects this admiration for rapist Maulvis and Maulanas. Just a few days back a six year old boy was found raped and murdered on a roof mosque. His killer would be free, hidden by other religious people, till the heat cools down and he can go back to raping/preaching again. And this kind of behavior is wide spread through the country, if different organizations are to be believed. Just it is not reported/the body is not found. But it only exists because people like you like to think that the situation is not as worse media makes it out to be. Well, I have actually gone inside real slums and these sick places and the situation is every bit as insane. If you can't fight it, at least don't deny it.

Sure, as long as it provides for me. You are mistaking the inability of the state to act out its functions due to a malignant population as problems relating to the state laws itself(not that many are not discriminatory.. but not all are either).

Rebranding, removing Islamic.. these are all wishful thoughts.. the recent attack on the civil society protest should be ample proof that the issue with bigotry has much less to do with the state than with the society itself. The state can be called the glorious Islamic galactic empire of Lalapalooza and it still will not have that effect on the people that is being supposed.

The character of the state, constitution and institutions all need change.. that is a given.. but to expect rather naively just like the Government of Pakistan says that the problem will solve within 2 years is folly. The sort of mess Pakistan is in requires invasive surgery.. or a self implosion.. a civil war to say at the least... something that is already in progress.. it just hasnt expanded to the level for people to start calling it that.

Again, change of name serves as a metaphor for change in society.

 

[SQ8]

I am not against the profession of Doctor/Accountant either. I meant do you like to stay as a Muslim in a Hindu/Jews/Christian country with Hindu/Jews/Christian constitution.

Sure, as long as it provides for me. You are mistaking the inability of the state to act out its functions due to a malignant population as problems relating to the state laws itself(not that many are not discriminatory.. but not all are either).

Rebranding, removing Islamic.. these are all wishful thoughts.. the recent attack on the civil society protest should be ample proof that the issue with bigotry has much less to do with the state than with the society itself. The state can be called the glorious Islamic galactic empire of Lalapalooza and it still will not have that effect on the people that is being supposed.

The character of the state, constitution and institutions all need change.. that is a given.. but to expect rather naively just like the Government of Pakistan says that the problem will solve within 2 years is folly. The sort of mess Pakistan is in requires invasive surgery.. or a self implosion.. a civil war to say at the least... something that is already in progress.. it just hasnt expanded to the level for people to start calling it that.

Good thing you say it on the Media, but there in no medal I am afraid. My point was it was not the topic of conversation around the country as people weren't interested. However, ofc your opinion is superior and I am just ranting because I don't agree with you. You want a crazed Islamic State, fine, move to Iran, but the new generation of Pakistan rejects this admiration for rapist Maulvis and Maulanas. Just a few days back a six year old boy was found raped and murdered on a roof mosque. His killer would be free, hidden by other religious people, till the heat cools down and he can go back to raping/preaching again. And this kind of behavior is wide spread through the country, if different organizations are to be believed. Just it is not reported/the body is not found. But it only exists because people like you like to think that the situation is not as worse media makes it out to be. Well, I have actually gone inside real slums and these sick places and the situation is very bit as insane. If you can't fight it, at least don't deny it.

Assumed rants again. All of what is you say is rather correct, but I also know that there is a throwback from society against these acts. The issue remains the implicit support from political parties against these religious nutjobs... and the recognition that this malignancy is much more widespread than we think. Ranting about it or going into slums and howling about it at least to me is preaching to the choir.
Neither of which supports your idea that changing the name will perform the miracle that is needed.

The irony that you accuse others of having superior opinion is in that your own behaviour and the rather pointless poll you setup with two options shows that either you see secularism as the only option.. anything else is beneath your opinon.. hypocrite much?

 

[Ussaid]

Neither of which supports your idea that changing the name will perform the miracle that is needed.

Dude, do you even poetry or literature? Again, change of name is suppose to serve as a metaphor for a change in society. I didn't said that anything magical will happen, but it will send a message and a processes will be started. We would be going from an odd Islamic Republic to a Secular country. Secularism basically means respecting rights.

IT is a METAPHOR, not a LITERAL proposal

 

[SQ8]

Dude, do you even poetry or literature? Again, change of name is suppose to serve as a metaphor for a change in society. I didn't said that anything magical will happen, but it will send a message and a processes will be started.

No it wont. You can call it secularistan and the Moulvis will have a field day with burning whatever is left is down.
There is a point where you cannot treat a patient with drugs and have to rely on the body to provide some resistance. Anything else , you kill the patient...

 

[Armstrong]

I don't agree with the idea of an 'Islamic State' but I fail to see what a name change would achieve and more so what could be so utterly fascistic about it as some posters make it out to be ?

 

[SQ8]

Dude, do you even poetry or literature? Again, change of name is suppose to serve as a metaphor for a change in society. I didn't said that anything magical will happen, but it will send a message and a processes will be started. We would be going from an odd Islamic Republic to a Secular country. Secularism basically means respecting rights.

IT is a METAPHOR, not a LITERAL proposal

Sure it does, but try explaining that to the Mullah.. see if you last the day.

I don't agree with the idea of an 'Islamic State' but I fail to see what a name change would achieve and more so what could be so utterly fascistic about it as some posters make it out to be ?

exactly, like you calling yourself Jinnah's successor does nothing to take away from the fact that you are essentially the next Mir Jaffar.

 

[Ussaid]

No it wont. You can call it secularistan and the Moulvis will have a field day with burning whatever is left is down.
There is a point where you cannot treat a patient with drugs and have to rely on the body to provide some resistance. Anything else , you kill the patient...

I said a process, a process, not a name change. People need to abandon the ideology of a Islamic Republic instead be more realistic, the Moulvis will disappear gradually then