A Trilateral Whose Time Has Come: US-Japan-India Cooperation

[Capt.Popeye]

What bothers me is the muddle headedness that so many Indians have with respect to China. Russia, one can understand but China? The only place for India in a Chiinese plan is as a vassal state.

I do not think its only that. Actually my earlier post (to which you responded) was in a lighter vein.
Now, having said that: India and a good lot of Indians are wary of the US. There are reasons for that stance. Though I am not Marxist-oriented in any way, even I am inclined to that line of thought. Simply because the US has (time and again) demonstrated sheer self-centered policies (which is understandable) which however incredibly reek of 'pig-headedness' to an imbecilic degree (which simply defies comprehension).

Many years ago; a Princeton Don said to me (at the Woodrow Wilson School) that Americans have no sense of History! How true that is. The reasons for that can be explained somewhat, but maybe else-where.
Take the average American; his area of interest extends upto the end of his block or at the most the edge of his county. Unfortunately this thinking is common even at the highest echelons of US Policy making. Now wonder their "roller-coaster ride" even with their alleged allies such as Pakistan!
So much so that to be an enemy of Uncle Sam is dangerous and to be a friend even more hazardous.

Therefore; India has always dealt with USA in a stance of :"We'll engage with you, but on our own terms. We're no push-over, we and our thought-processes have existed and evolved for centuries. We can and will live in our own way, never mind the cost. We are not a "Bonsai Republik" where you can decide who runs our country, and how we run it"
That will never change. Eisenhower and John F Kennedy were told that. Nixon got slapped in his face with that. Reagan was too senile to understand that. Clinton and Bush recognised that, maybe Obama and his successors will seek to build further on it.

Now the ground-rules (and red-lines) have been clearly laid out. So its probably time to proceed.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

What bothers me is the muddle headedness that so many Indians have with respect to China. Russia, one can understand but China? The only place for India in a Chiinese plan is as a vassal state.

Many Indians still live in the Nehruvian perception of Pan-Asian unity against West and anti-colonial hangover

 

[Bang Galore]

I do not think its only that. Actually my earlier post (to which you responded) was in a lighter vein.

I got that, what I said was what I think about the constant talk about China as an ally. If the argument was against having the U.S. as a close partner, it would be understandable but whatever the case, our view of China should never be based on some pipe dream.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

Many Indians still live in the Nehruvian perception of Pan-Asian unity against West and anti-colonial hangover

That is not correct. The Indians who may have subscribed to that perception are dead and gone as has Nehru. Any ideas of Pan-Asian Unity have got subsumed by Real-Politik. Most people of this generation do not even understand Anti-Colonialism, since its context has disappeared.
Now its simply this: we want to live in our way, in our own fashion. Call it Neo-Nationalism if you wish, born out of sense of growing self-esteem. No more victim-hood; that is for Wimps anyway.

 

[Bang Galore]

Many Indians still live in the Nehruvian perception of Pan-Asian unity against West and anti-colonial hangover

Especially since I have absolutely no idea of why we would gang up against the U.S. (or against Russia for that matter). The key here is to understand that there is some alignment of these 3 countries w.r.t China even if each of the three have their own reasons & are not interested in getting sucked into some wider conflict. There is no such alignment of interests with China.

Now its simply this: we want to live in our way, in our own fashion. Call it Neo-Nationalism if you wish, born out of sense of growing self-esteem. No more victim-hood; that is for Wimps anyway.

That's perfectly fine, how you do that by being muddle headed about a country that you have serious territorial issues with is what I don't get. The Chinese are anything but wooly headed about these matters.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Especially since I have absolutely no idea of why we would gang up against the U.S. (or against Russia for that matter). The key here is to understand that there is some alignment of these 3 countries w.r.t China even if each of the three have their own reasons & are not interested in getting sucked into some wider conflict. There is no such alignment of interests with China.

The other theory among Indian strategists, is allying with China may help isolate Pakistan. Which I doubt has any significance.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

That's perfectly fine, how you do that by being muddle headed about a country that you have serious territorial issues with is what I don't get. The Chinese are anything but wooly headed about these matters.

There will not be any alliances with China; there will be only business, even in increasing amounts.....

 

[Bang Galore]

The other theory among Indian strategists, is allying with China may help isolate Pakistan. Which I doubt has any significance.

That is exactly the kind of thinking I remain troubled by. The Chinese do not see us as an equal & have absolutely no interest in sharing power space with us. They will give you nothing on Pakistan, that is simply not how the Chinese think. In any case, what should we do to isolate Pakistan? Offer our backside on a platter?

There will not be any alliances with China; there will be only business, even in increasing amounts.....

That is how it should be.

 

[T-Rex]

policies can always change,,,,,btw tab.codein 15mg qds might help u

Well then, it is time for 'forward policy 2', what is india waiting for? Could it be that some indians are still having nightmares about it?

 

[northeast]

So if we nuke Japan，does india dare nuke us back？Or if we nuke India，would US nuke us back？The military power of India is too small to be our primary concern，don't add US and Japan to delude yourself.You indian should knowthat even if we have nuke you guys to hell，the US is not gonna do much to help you.

 

[Beidou2020]

Chinese view India as a defeated nation that is still a pawn of the West.

 

[MarkovChain]

Chinese view India as a defeated nation that is still a pawn of the West.

Not this again. India had a set back 50 years back - big deal. China was ripped apart and humiliated for 150 years by multiple colonial powers before that, didn't China ever get up? We need to keep thinking forward as nations - not keep taunting each other saying "I got one over you - hahahaha".

 

[Beidou2020]

Not this again. India had a set back 50 years back - big deal. China was ripped apart and humiliated for 150 years by multiple colonial powers before that, didn't China ever get up? We need to keep thinking forward as nations - not keep taunting each other saying "I got one over you - hahahaha".

Dude, I'm just saying Chinese generally don't take India seriously. Just like India views Pakistan as a defeated country, that's how China views India.

US views Russia the same way.

 

[Gandhiv]

Dude, I'm just saying Chinese generally don't take India seriously. Just like India views Pakistan as a defeated country, that's how China views India.

US views Russia the same way.

yaa thats why chinese supplied nukes and delivery systems to pakistan. India will surely payback this once we have strengthened ourselves. No stupid one china policy. Free Tibet.

 

[NALANDA]

So if we nuke Japan，does india dare nuke us back？Or if we nuke India，would US nuke us back？The military power of India is too small to be our primary concern，don't add US and Japan to delude yourself.You indian should knowthat even if we have nuke you guys to hell，the US is not gonna do much to help you.

Nuking is what your Pakistani association must have taught you. Pakistan forgets that India is better off in quantity and quality of Nuclear weapons when they talk about Nuking India ( they are stupid we know but tell them this and see their reactions). You will not see Indians talking about Nuking China.

China cant handle Vietnam. The day you are able to handle Vietnam, we will take you seriously.