A trilateral aimed at Pakistan

[pakistani342]

Article here, excerpts below:

Afghanistan’s Ashraf Ghani government has come to recognize that Pakistan will not play ball in bringing stability to Afghanistan. The quadrilateral coordination group of Afghanistan, China, Pakistan and the US on Afghan peace and reconciliation failed to take the peace process further due to Pakistani intransigence. Now Kabul wants to fight it out with the backing of Washington and New Delhi. And the Narendra Modi government seems more than willing to lend a hand to a partner which is also facing hostility from Pakistan. This is in sync with its priorities at the moment to isolate Pakistan globally and regionally.

The renewed trilateral engagement will work only if there is a sustained momentum towards deliverable outcomes. The Pakistani military-intelligence apparatus will do its best to scupper this initiative and will lash out in response to its growing marginalization. It will try to show its relevance by wreaking more havoc in Afghanistan and the region. The regional states should prepare for the worst even as they work towards a more coordinated response vis-à-vis Pakistan.

 

[wiseone2]

Article here, excerpts below:

Afghanistan’s Ashraf Ghani government has come to recognize that Pakistan will not play ball in bringing stability to Afghanistan. The quadrilateral coordination group of Afghanistan, China, Pakistan and the US on Afghan peace and reconciliation failed to take the peace process further due to Pakistani intransigence. Now Kabul wants to fight it out with the backing of Washington and New Delhi. And the Narendra Modi government seems more than willing to lend a hand to a partner which is also facing hostility from Pakistan. This is in sync with its priorities at the moment to isolate Pakistan globally and regionally.

The renewed trilateral engagement will work only if there is a sustained momentum towards deliverable outcomes. The Pakistani military-intelligence apparatus will do its best to scupper this initiative and will lash out in response to its growing marginalization. It will try to show its relevance by wreaking more havoc in Afghanistan and the region. The regional states should prepare for the worst even as they work towards a more coordinated response vis-à-vis Pakistan.

Iran, Afghan and India initiative with respect to Chahbahar is more serious long term threat to Pakistan

 

[pakistani342]

Iran, Afghan and India initiative with respect to Chahbahar is more serious long term threat to Pakistan

mmm, Not so much I'd say, Chabahar:
1. is not a Natural deep sea port
2. to have any value for India it requires a stable Afghanistan
3. to have any value for Afghanistan it requires a stable Afghanistan
4. to have any value for Iran it requires Chabahar not to get lapped up in the India/Pak strategic competition
5. Iran will still need to use Dubai because it's not a natural deep sea port
6. The Delaram-Zaranj highway runs through the Taliban heartland

There is a reason Iran sought China to help develop it first -- who wants to get caught in the vortex of petty Indian/Pakistani geopolitics.

 

[wiseone2]

mmm, Not so much I'd say, Chabahar:
1. is not a Natural deep sea port
2. to have any value for India it requires a stable Afghanistan
3. to have any value for Afghanistan it requires a stable Afghanistan
4. to have any value for Iran it requires Chabahar not to get lapped up in the India/Pak strategic competition
5. Iran will still need to use Dubai because it's not a natural deep sea port
6. The Delaram-Zaranj highway runs through the Taliban heartland

There is a reason Iran sought China to help develop it first -- who wants to get caught in the vortex of petty Indian/Pakistani geopolitics.

the purpose of Chahbahar is not massive amount of global trade. It is an alternate route to trade with Afghanistan.
Irrespective of India it is Iran's interest to have an independent Afghanistan free of Taliban and other pakistani proxies.

 

[pakistani342]

the purpose of Chahbahar is not massive amount of global trade. It is an alternate route to trade with Afghanistan.
Irrespective of India it is Iran's interest to have an independent Afghanistan free of Taliban and other pakistani proxies.

Oh I forgot -- but I'm sure Iran (and Iranians are smart -- how the have Mollahs ruling them is a mystery) -- would not want to get wedged into the strategic competition between India and Pakistan -- further it still does not nullify the remaining points:

mmm, Not so much I'd say, Chabahar:
1. is not a Natural deep sea port
-- OK you answered this -- the goals of Chabahar are rather limited -- ah well on this you win
2. to have any value for India it requires a stable Afghanistan
-- still open
3. to have any value for Afghanistan it requires a stable Afghanistan
-- still open
4. to have any value for Iran it requires Chabahar not to get lapped up in the India/Pak strategic competition
-- still open
5. Iran will still need to use Dubai because it's not a natural deep sea port
-- OK you answered this
6. The Delaram-Zaranj highway runs through the Taliban heartland
-- still open

 

[wiseone2]

Oh I forgot -- but I'm sure Iran (and Iranians are smart -- how the have Mollahs ruling them is a mystery) -- would not want to get wedged into the strategic competition between India and Pakistan -- further it still does not nullify the remaining points:

mmm, Not so much I'd say, Chabahar:
1. is not a Natural deep sea port
-- OK you answered this -- the goals of Chabahar are rather limited -- ah well on this you win
2. to have any value for India it requires a stable Afghanistan
-- still open
3. to have any value for Afghanistan it requires a stable Afghanistan
-- still open
4. to have any value for Iran it requires Chabahar not to get lapped up in the India/Pak strategic competition
-- still open
5. Iran will still need to use Dubai because it's not a natural deep sea port
-- OK you answered this
6. The Delaram-Zaranj highway runs through the Taliban heartland
-- still open

It is Iran's interest to have an Afghanistan independent of Pakistan control

No mention of india

 

[coffee_cup]

Article here, excerpts below:

Afghanistan’s Ashraf Ghani government has come to recognize that Pakistan will not play ball in bringing stability to Afghanistan. The quadrilateral coordination group of Afghanistan, China, Pakistan and the US on Afghan peace and reconciliation failed to take the peace process further due to Pakistani intransigence. Now Kabul wants to fight it out with the backing of Washington and New Delhi. And the Narendra Modi government seems more than willing to lend a hand to a partner which is also facing hostility from Pakistan. This is in sync with its priorities at the moment to isolate Pakistan globally and regionally.

The renewed trilateral engagement will work only if there is a sustained momentum towards deliverable outcomes. The Pakistani military-intelligence apparatus will do its best to scupper this initiative and will lash out in response to its growing marginalization. It will try to show its relevance by wreaking more havoc in Afghanistan and the region. The regional states should prepare for the worst even as they work towards a more coordinated response vis-à-vis Pakistan.

So are we expecting a Taliban office in New Delhi now?

Because the way Talibans are running amock, it doesn't seem like any durable peace is possible without first coming to terms with Taliban.

 

[Max]

Iran, Afghan and India initiative with respect to Chahbahar is more serious long term threat to Pakistan

who said its threat to Pakistan? Pakistan calculated every thing, it is principle founder of Chabahar saga, if Pakistan would have allowed Indian transit for Afghanistan there would be no chabahar today, but Pakistan despite knowing bharat and iran are in talks for chabahar since 90's rejected it anyways.

 

[wiseone2]

who said its threat to Pakistan? Pakistan calculated every thing, it is principle founder of Chabahar saga, if Pakistan would have allowed Indian transit for Afghanistan there would be no chabahar today, but Pakistan despite knowing bharat and iran are in talks for chabahar since 90's rejected it anyways.

Afghanistan independent of Pakistan is considered by Pakistani establishment to be a threat
Pakistani elite never expected the Chahbahar agreement

 

[mdcp]

There are too many divisions in Afghan govt. All mafias like Rasheed Dostam and their cheif executive nd other group will fight for their cruel agenda so why they blame on Pakistan.

Pkistan should block all borders with afghanistan cuz they are so ill thankful and traitors and let them rot amongst them. Taliban is the movement of Afghan people and they have deep support and it is not right to blame everything on Pakistan

 

[Max]

Afghanistan independent of Pakistan is considered by Pakistani establishment to be a threat
Pakistani elite never expected the Chahbahar agreement

myth, it has nothing to do with reality, and yeah Pakistani officials are blind, they cant see Iran and bharat were in talks for chabahar.. only bharti trolls on PDF knows whats going on in Pakistani officials mind.

 

[wiseone2]

Myth..

there is rhetoric and there is actions

only interpretation of Pakistan actions is to keep Afghanistan embroiled in a civil war and to keep it weak

 

[Max]

only interpretation of Pakistan actions is to keep Afghanistan embroiled in a civil war and to keep it weak

It suits gangaland more, a destablize shithole is best playground against west Pakistan..

 

[wiseone2]

It suits gangaland more, a destablize shithole is best playground against west Pakistan..

someone in Rawalpindi came up with strategic depth

 

[pakistani342]

It is Iran's interest to have an Afghanistan independent of Pakistan control

No mention of india

It is Iran's interest to have an Afghanistan independent of Pakistan control

No mention of india

Very good point -- to answer the questions:

1. Imagine India did not exist -- where would that leave Iran and Pakistan: they not natural rivals, and actually have supported each other during crises.
2. Imagine would Iran want to get into hostility with its nuclear armed neighbor over far away India (?) -- the Mollahs are misogynistis but not stupid.

So again:

mmm, Not so much I'd say, Chabahar:
1. is not a Natural deep sea port
-- OK you answered this -- the goals of Chabahar are rather limited
2. to have any value for India it requires a stable Afghanistan
-- still open -- either Pakistan and Iran can keep Afghanistan unstable (Iran projects power all the way to Syria!!!)
3. to have any value for Afghanistan it requires a stable Afghanistan
-- still open -- either Pakistan and Iran can keep Afghanistan unstable (Iran projects power all the way to Syria!!!)
4. to have any value for Iran it requires Chabahar not to get lapped up in the India/Pak strategic competition
-- still open (the same way Pakistan chose not to participate in the Saudi vs Iran competition)
5. Iran will still need to use Dubai because it's not a natural deep sea port
-- OK you answered this -- the goals of Chabahar are rather limited
6. The Delaram-Zaranj highway runs through the Taliban heartland
-- still open -- either Pakistan and Iran can keep Afghanistan unstable (Iran projects power all the way to Syria!!!)

So where were we?