1965 war with India was Pakistan's biggest blunder, says Ishtiaq Ahmed

[Finer]

Muslims consume camel's urine in addition to engaging in other detestable customs like female genital mutilation, niqah e mutah, Niqah e missiyar and halala. In the past, Indian Muslims would sell their 6- to 12-year-old girls to Arab sheikhs in the name of Allah; although they claimed to be acting in the interests of Allah, they were really acting in the interests of money. When the Modi government outlawed these practises, they broke out in riots and staged anti-Modi protests.

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Yes, Female Genital Mutilation happens in India; here's everything you need to know

We bring you the why, how and why-not of female genital mutilation in India.

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Abominable rapes in the name of Nikah Halala: An analytical study of Halala with special reference to Rape Laws in India

The practice of Nikah Halala is one of the most misconceived Islamic practices necessitating cohabitation by the woman victim of irreversible talaq with another man, in the name of marriage, so a...

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'Marriage without strings': Saudi confronts rise of 'misyar' - Times of India

Middle East News: The Muslim no-strings-attached "misyar" marriage often done in secret is fast pervading Saudi society -- a boon for cash-strapped men unable to afford

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

That has nothing to do with Islam- more to do with ancient cultures. Mutilation is African culture predated Islamic era.

They just happen to be Muslims following the trend of ignorances that exists in the nation such as India, Africa and some Muslim countries that follows predated Islamic era even though Islam has come to put an end to all those ignorances.

Precisely why Islam is needed in India especially for Hindu communities who practice female infanticide on the large scale, and dowry to put burden on the girl or girl's guardians for that matter.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

That has nothing to do with Islam- more to do with ancient cultures. Mutilation is African culture predated Islamic era.

They just happen to be Muslims following the trend of ignorances that exists in the nation such as India, Africa and some Muslim countries that follows predated Islamic era even though Islam has come to put an end to all those ignorances.

Precisely why Islam is needed in India especially for Hindu communities who practice female infanticide on the large scale, and dowry to put burden on the girl or girl's guardians for that matter.

I would concur up to a point that female genital mutilation is not a requirement for Islam, but it does let a 56-year-old man to wed a 6-year-old girl. Niqah e mutah, niqah e missiyar halala, etc. are permissible in Islam; this is something that your scholars have stated, not me.

 

[Meengla]

The failure to achieve a comprehensive population exchange between India and Pakistan can be considered a grave oversight, as it continues to generate challenges even today. The substantial presence of radicalized Muslim communities in India has further exacerbated the already strained relations between India and Pakistan. Instances of terrorism and derogatory rhetoric against the Hindu religion by certain segments of the Muslim population in India have fueled polarization among non-Muslim voters, leading to increased support for right-wing political parties. Given the association of Indian Muslims with Pakistan, which already has contentious relations with India, these right-wing parties, once in power, tend to view Pakistan through the lens of Indian Muslims as well. Consequently, this complex interplay of demographics, religious sentiments, and geopolitical tensions has contributed to the ongoing hostility between the two nations.

Bolded Part: Indian Muslims DO have a soft corner for Pakistan from what I have seen.
But I can't say about 'radicalized Muslim communities' in India. I thought the role of religion in India is less and less for all communities, barring BJP's Hindutva agenda, which is basically an electoral ploy? But I don't know.

 

[Meengla]

Partition is a good thing that has happened to both of us. That does not mean, we can not leave in peace. But an undivided India with a 180 Crore population where Hindus and Muslims would be fighting for political supremacy, could have caused greater pain on both sides. Although we are too focussed on the partition, but our problem primarily started later on where trust between the political leadership of both nations are always low.

I think this sums up my thoughts.
About the Partition of 1947, it was inevitable then because of the divide between Hindus and Muslims then. No one likes colonialists but let's not go too far in blaming the Colonialists for the divide between Hindus and Muslims of the Subcontinent: There were always huge frictions before the Brits conquered the Moghul Empire and those frictions existed during the British rule. Yes, there was the good old 'Divide and Rule', but the 'Divide' always existed. Always! In 1947 the Partition was necessary. In 2023, the continued Partition is necessary. But the divide between the Hindus and the Muslims of the Subcontinent went WAY before 1857--the year when the Brits crushed the War of Independence launched by the natives of the Subcontinent. A cursory reading of the history would tell you the divide between the two major religious communities going all the way back to when the Muslims first established a beachhead in the Subcontinent. They were very different civilizations! Socially similar, as far as the eastern Pakistanis were concerned, but religion played a huge rule in both communities and became a divide.
The Partition was inevitable.

 

[Finer]

I would concur up to a point that female genital mutilation is not a requirement for Islam, but it does let a 56-year-old man to wed a 6-year-old girl. Niqah e mutah, niqah e missiyar halala, etc. are permissible in Islam; this is something that your scholars have stated, not me.

Again, not true. You are picking up controversial points that is not relevant to the Islam.

Aisha (R.A) was already engaged to someone before. She was smart and grown enough to voice for her political opinions. She was physician.

Anyway, her engagement was broken off, and then she was offered to marry Prophet of Islam. After that, her father who succeeded the Prophet led the wars against those who betrayed Muslim empires in regards to avoidance of tax. And Aisha (R.A) played vital roles for women empowerment, political activist and physician.

Does that sound like 6 years old to you? For once, use your own brain. Some of examples you picked are from Shia that is not 100% correct of Islam.

Halala is something both couple divorced each other and married others. And then, that didn't work out. Then those couple who divorced each other in the past can marry each other again to do so. It is process. That is why in Islam that divorce is last resort to ensure it doesn't come down to halala if they repent later.

And Islam is needed in India to prevent female infanticide on large scale and eliminate rape capital using capital punishments as deterrent for the protection of defenceless women and lend support for minority such as Dalits that are often considered as subhuman- to the demeaning practices.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

Again, not true. You are picking up controversial points that is not relevant to the Islam.

Aisha (R.A) was already engaged to someone before. She was smart and grown enough to voice for her political opinions. She was physician.

Anyway, her engagement was broken off, and then she was offered to marry Prophet of Islam. After that, her father who succeeded the Prophet led the wars against those who betrayed Muslim empires in regards to avoidance of tax. And Aisha (R.A) played vital roles for women empowerment, political activist and physician.

Does that sound like 6 years old to you? For once, use your own brain. Some of examples you picked are from Shia that is not 100% correct of Islam.

Halala is something both couple divorced each other and married others. And then, that didn't work out. Then those couple who divorced each other in the past can marry each other again to do so. It is process. That is why in Islam that divorce is last resort to ensure it doesn't come down to halala if they repent later.

And Islam is needed in India to prevent female infanticide on large scale and eliminate rape capital using capital punishments as deterrent for the protection of defenceless women and lend support for minority such as Dalits that are often considered as subhuman- to the demeaning practices.

Read about India's history of female infanticide. It's widespread in the regions of India where Islamic culture has polluted the local way of life.
Based on your argument that India is often labeled as the rape capital of the world due to its high reported cases, it's important to consider the significant challenges faced by women in the Islamic world when it comes to reporting rape. While I acknowledge that India is not a perfect country, I do know that it’s a heaven compared to Islamic countries, with the exception of Turkey.

 

[Kaniska]

I think this sums up my thoughts.
About the Partition of 1947, it was inevitable then because of the divide between Hindus and Muslims then. No one likes colonialists but let's not go too far in blaming the Colonialists for the divide between Hindus and Muslims of the Subcontinent: There were always huge frictions before the Brits conquered the Moghul Empire and those frictions existed during the British rule. Yes, there was the good old 'Divide and Rule', but the 'Divide' always existed. Always! In 1947 the Partition was necessary. In 2023, the continued Partition is necessary. But the divide between the Hindus and the Muslims of the Subcontinent went WAY before 1857--the year when the Brits crushed the War of Independence launched by the natives of the Subcontinent. A cursory reading of the history would tell you the divide between the two major religious communities going all the way back to when the Muslims first established a beachhead in the Subcontinent. They were very different civilizations! Socially similar, as far as the eastern Pakistanis were concerned, but religion played a huge rule in both communities and became a divide.
The Partition was inevitable.

One of the major issues between us is when we see each other as brothers who are separated from each other. I think that mindset has to change. Let us admit at the political level that we are distinct civilizations and thought process between us and treat each other as national entities. Till the point, we are not eliminating too many of these emotional attachments, our political and national relationships would improve.

Both of us have to be pragmatic and understand the need not to meddle with each other's affairs. We may not be friends. But let us try to behave if we are not enemies either. That would be the 1st step for our future generation to see a meaningful way out in the relationship between India and Pakistan.

 

[leonblack08]

Read about India's history of female infanticide. It's widespread in the regions of India where Islamic culture has polluted the local way of life.
Based on your argument that India is often labeled as the rape capital of the world due to its high reported cases, it's important to consider the significant challenges faced by women in the Islamic world when it comes to reporting rape. While I acknowledge that India is not a perfect country, I do know that it’s a heaven compared to Islamic countries, with the exception of Turkey.

Are these broad statements coming out of BJP gobar academy?

Do you even know where Islam stands on female infanticide?

Thanks to hundreds of years under Islam, you lot learnt to be somewhat civil. Or else you would still be doing human sacrifice and animal worship.

Oh forgot, you still do worship animals.

 

[fitpOsitive]

View attachment 936946
Ishtiaq Ahmed, Swedish political scientist and author of Pakistani descent who is on a visit to Bengaluru, speaks on a wide range of subjects in an interview with N B Hombal of DH. The Professor Emeritus of Political Science at Stockholm University gives his take on partition, Pakistan’s economy and how relations can be normalised between India and Pakistan. Excerpts:

●How has been your India tour?

Fantastic. It’s been so good that I actually run the risk of forgetting names of people who have been kind to me, because I am meeting so many people and so many on the same day. It seems that I came here many, many moons ago, whereas I have been here since May 7.

●What are your views on partition?

I strongly believed that partition was a blunder by many and its consequences have been devastating to the social understanding and building trust, which reflects in the politics of India and Pakistan. I am not too sure, but strongly hope that at some point, borders may disappear in this region too, like in the European Union.

●What are the ways to help improve the relations?

Coming to India has greatly reinforced my belief that we people (peace lovers) will certainly isolate those who oppose these kind of activities (building relationships) in the years to come. I think both nations can take risks, allowing people from both sides to mingle with each other, by relaxing the present Visa regimes. This will greatly benefit Pakistan, as India has already proved that it can do without Pakistan.

●Prior to the India visit, you had been to Pakistan. How do you analyse the socio-economic development of both countries.

India is doing good on most fronts, though it might be lagging in some areas. What India I have seen, it is progressing rapidly. On social parameters, women here are dressing freely, roaming around freely on motorbikes and public transport. But in Pakistan, it is still not the case, only the elite who can afford cars can roam around freely. But ordinary girls/women need to be very careful and always face hostile situations wherever they go. It is highly impossible for them to go out alone after 10 pm.

●What is the biggest mistake Pakistan committed post-partition?

I think the 1965 war with India was in some ways responsible for what Pakistan is today. Soon after partition, USA and World Bank invested heavily there, which helped the country achieve a certain degree of progress. But post the 1965 war with India, investment slowed down drastically. From then on, Pakistan was never able to recover economically. The textile industry, which was once flourishing, has now shifted to Bangladesh, where cotton is not even grown. Presently, the Pakistani economy is so bad that it can’t even raise a billion dollars to manage loans. It’s a failing state.

●How can both countries handle the Kashmir issue?

Pakistan must abandon terrorism completely. Only then both countries can come to terms for real peace. Both countries accepting Line of Control as international border might help resolve the issue.

●What does the future holds for Wahhabism?

I don’t think Wahhabism has any future, as Saudi Arabia itself is doing all it can to end Wahhabism. Someone needs to tell them what the real story is. Perhaps Saudi Arabia has taken the first step towards this. Hopefully, others will follow. I only hope they don’t assassinate the Saudi crown prince who has begun the reform process. There must be forces working within to ensure he doesn’t succeed.

●What is your opinion about Uniform Civil Code?

I strongly believe in UCC. I believe in equality and everyone to gain from the same laws.

1965 war with India was Pakistan's biggest blunder, says Ishtiaq Ahmed

www.google.com

The biggest blunder of Pakistan was the imported bureaucracy of early Pakistan who were though patriotic and hardworking, infact they made Pakistan the Asian tiger of those days, but, they were unable to connect with local people. And then came Ayub and Bhutto who rooted out those bureaucrats and never replaced them with local equivalent.

Hordes and hordes of pendos joined offices, destroyed those offices and ran away with lot of money. Sub nain mil Ker khaya.

We need a central or national power, like east India company, who will regulate things in Pakistan, from army to milk mongerer. This force should rise as non political power, work on grassroot level, and then start controlling and regulating things from behind the scenes.


And btw, no blunder becomes blunder till we really insist to make it so.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

Are these broad statements coming out of BJP gobar academy?

Do you even know where Islam stands on female infanticide?

Thanks to hundreds of years under Islam, you lot learnt to be somewhat civil. Or else you would still be doing human sacrifice and animal worship.

Oh forgot, you still do worship animals.

The act of venerating animals can be regarded as a civilized practice, whereas the act of taking the life of an animal is commonly associated with religions of a demonic nature. Marrying a 6-year-old, treating women as commodities for purchase, and engaging in practices such as Halala, Nikah-e-Misyar, or Nikah-e-Mutah are not considered civilized behaviors. Furthermore, the terms "Niqah" and "Aurat" themselves carry derogatory connotations and lack civility.

 

[arjunk]

The disharmony between Muslims and non Muslims in India is often attributed to the actions of some individuals within the Muslim community

Really?

. Incidents of religious abuse or acts of violence carried out in the name of Islam by a few Muslims in India, as well as in other places like Myanmar,

Myanmar is your new Abby after Israel? How do you hindus have such little shame to support genocide while at the same time pull the victim card.

can provoke a retaliatory response from non-Muslim communities.

Ah yes, like being suspected of eating Beef or a Muslim kid walking with his Hindu female friend gets him arrested or killed by Hindu terrorist milita groups.

 

[arjunk]

The act of venerating animals can be regarded as a civilized practice, whereas the act of taking the life of an animal is commonly associated with religions of a demonic nature.

Vegetarians never cease to amaze me with their insufferable personality. The vast majority of humans have been eating meat since forever.

Marrying a 6-year-old,

She was 16-19, marrying before puberty is prohibited in Islam. Lowest estimate of age 9 is based off a weak Hadith, and if that is true she did not live in His house until she was of age.

treating women as commodities for purchase

How???

, and engaging in practices such as Halala, Nikah-e-Misyar, or Nikah-e-Mutah

Halala is considered Haram by the majority of Islamic scholars

are not considered civilized behaviors. Furthermore, the terms "Niqah"

Literally means marriage

and "Aurat" themselves carry derogatory connotations and lack civility.

So being a woman or married is derogatory?

You are simply projecting how women are mistreated in Hinduism, and the demonic child sacrafice rituals of Hinduism.

Like most Hindu Indians, you have a severe inferiority complex and use your own traits as an insult against others.


@waz @The Eagle Please deal with this venom spewing Hindutva.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

Vegetarians never cease to amaze me with their insufferable personality. The vast majority of humans have been eating meat since forever.

She was 16-19, marrying before puberty is prohibited in Islam. Lowest estimate of age 9 is based off a weak Hadith, and if that is true she did not live in His house until she was of age.

How???

Halala is considered Haram by the majority of Islamic scholars

Literally means marriage

So being a woman or married is derogatory?

You are simply projecting how women are mistreated in Hinduism, and the demonic child sacrafice rituals of Hinduism.

Like most Hindu Indians, you have a severe inferiority complex and use your own traits as an insult against others.


@waz @The Eagle Please deal with this venom spewing Hindutva.

I encourage you to explore the precise meanings of terms like "Aurat," "Niqah," and "Mehar." It is important to note that all of these words have their origins in Arabic, and you can readily discover their definitions in an Arabic-to-English dictionary.

 

[waz]

The act of venerating animals can be regarded as a civilized practice, whereas the act of taking the life of an animal is commonly associated with religions of a demonic nature. Marrying a 6-year-old, treating women as commodities for purchase, and engaging in practices such as Halala, Nikah-e-Misyar, or Nikah-e-Mutah are not considered civilized behaviors. Furthermore, the terms "Niqah" and "Aurat" themselves carry derogatory connotations and lack civility.

All what you wrote about above can be found in Hindu scripture and practices.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

All what you wrote about above can be found in Hindu scripture and practices.

The Hindu Code Bill in India prohibits the practices mentioned above, while Islamic Shariah law allows for them, leading some Indian Muslims to follow Shariah while concealing their actions from Indian authorities due to its illegality in India.