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HISTORY OF MALABAR :DISCUSSIONS.

...but today south travancore regions like neyattinkara,poovar,parasala has fairly good amount of Christians,overhemly NADARS and in kannyakumari district(44-47% Christian population,3rd highest in India after ernakulam,kottayam of Kerala)....

In Travancore, Cochin and Malabar, no female was allowed to cover their upper part of the body in front of Upper castes of Kerala until the 19th century. Under the support of Ayya
Vaikundar ,[1] some communities fought for their right to wear upper clothes and the upper class resorted to attacking them in 1818. In 1819, the Rani of Travancore announced that the lower castes including the
Nadar climber women have no right to wear upper clothes like most lower non-Brahmin castes of Kerala. [However, the aristocratic Nadar women of the region were exempted
from this restriction. Violence against Nadar climber women who revolted against this continued and reached its peak in 1858 across the kingdom, notably in southern taluks of
Neyyattinkara and Neyyur. ....

The trouble started with Christian converted were allowed to cover their breasts and others were not. There was long protracted rioting in which even lower caste and muslims attacked Nadars. The caste system ensured that when two people met the lower caste had to bear his/her breasts to the one with the higher caste.

You can argue that caste was wrong, but the law was same for everyone before the british started conversion and introduced social imbalance to promote conversions.
 
but they used to speak Tamil?? In fact Tamil is more older than Sinhalam....
First of all you can't specify ethnicity based on language.
They claim to be from Kshatriya origin and Kauravas were Indo-Aryans. Hence, they used to speak Tamil is contradictory.
This is some from their timeline of migration over the centuries. Karava of Sri Lanka - Karava timeline

The 'Kuru kingdom' - the original kingdom of the Kauravas. It was one of the 16 Mahajanapada (States) of ancient India.
Ancient Period- Kuru Kingdom in India with its capital at Hastinapur, inhabited by the Kauravas and thePandavas from the royal line of King Bharata. The Mahabharata war between the Kauravas and their cousins the Pandavas at Kurukshetra and the dispersal of Kauravas in the Asian region.

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550 BC– Buddha visits the Kuru Kingdom, which is by then nothing like the powerful and extensive Kuru kingdom of the Mahabharata. By then it is just another Mahajanapada of India but famed as a kingdom inhabited by an extremely intelligent and clever race. The Buddha preaches the profound Satipattana Sutta, Maha Nidana Sutta, Aneñjasappaya Sutta, Magandiya Sutta, Rattapala Sutta, Sammasa Sutta and Ariyavasa Sutta. to the Kauravas as they were intelligent and clever enough to understand these higher doctrines.
The Buddha has referred to himself as ‘the kinsman of the Sun (ie. that he is a descendant of the Solar Dynasty Kshatriya Caste) in the Atanatiya Sutta, Upakkilesa Sutta, Phena Sutta and several other Suttas, emphasizing his Kshatriya caste. The Five precepts practised in the Theravada world is founded on the 'Kuru Dharma' of the Kauravas. See Kuru Dharma Jataka.
In the the Agganna Sutta, Ambattha Sutta, Madura Sutta and several other Suttas the Buddha says : “the Kshatriya caste is the highest caste”

500 BC Migration of a community of Kauravas to Sri Lanka with prince Karavanti, a minister of prince Vijaya (Janavamsa ola manuscript) . The putative port of landing of the prince is in north-west Sri Lanka contiguous with the region later known as Kuru Rata with a city named Hastinapura (Kurunegala) named after Hasinapur, ( The ruins of Hastinapur have been unearthed within the ramparts of Purana Quila near Delhi) the Mahabharata capital of the Kauravas. This tradition of early migration of Kaurava royalty explains the prevalence of the 'Pandu' prefix in the names of early Sri Lankan kings such as Panduvasadeva and Pandukabhaya.

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Above: King Dhananjaya Koravya of the Kuru kingdom in an old painting from a temple in Kurunegala, Sri Lanka

300 BC- Emperor Ashoka .( 304 BC – 232 BC) was the son of Mauryan emperor Bindusara and while in exile Ashoka married a fisher woman named Kaurwaki(Maharani Devi) who converted to Buddhism. Their children Mahindra andSanghamitra establishes Buddhism in Sri Lanka.
Migration of more Kauravas to Sri Lanka with Theri Sanghamitta, who brought the sacred Bo sapling to Sri Lanka. The Bodhiyabaduge and several other Karava clans ascribe their migration to this event.

The pre-christian rock inscriptions of the Kataragama Kshatriyas always bear the Fish symbol. These Kataragama Kshatriya kings describe themselves in their pre Christian inscriptions as " Gamini puta dasa kathikana Kedhate ..." (Bovattegala inscription Inscr of Ceylon part I p 41 # 549) Kedhate was the early form of Kevatta meaning 'mastery over water'. Over a thousand years later, when Kevatta also meant a fisherman, chroniclers have used prefixes to distinguish Dunu-kevatta vamsa warrior royalty (Ariyapala p 113) from Vedi-kevatta tribal fishermen.

The word Dheega meaning water is frequently used by these kings in their personal names such as Dheegha-Gamini, Dheega-Jantu etc. and in place names such as Dhiga-Vapi, Dhiga-Mandala etc. The word Kataragama too in its original form wasKachara (Ka +Chara) where Ka meant water and Chara meant 'travelling on', meaning sailing and naval power. (Yatala Vehera p 18)
- Recent excavations in the south have uncovered many types of coins from the same period with the Fish symbol. The Fish symbol and the Ship symbol are recurrent symbols on Karava Heraldry.

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Pre Christian inscriptions from Sri lanka with the ship symbol (left) and fish symbol

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The Sun & Moon flag of Sri Lankan royalty

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Karava Main Flag
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@ShreddeR

Since this is off topic I will keep it brief.

You need to look closely at your relationship with the Pandya Empire and you will be surprised to find the answers to your question.

This is the map of their kingdom,

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This is the approximation of their Flag,

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This was their Coin dated 300-100 BC. Notice the Fish, Elephant, Moon, Sun, Stars, fire, shells etc ?

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Again Pandya dynasty coin from the 11th century. Notice the fish ?? it was the symbol of their dynasty.

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This is their coin found in Sri Lanka. Notice the elephant.

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Finally Pandyan symbol found in SL. Double fish Pandyan carving.

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Its better if you open a new thread on SL history.
 
If kerala is 100% literate it is because of the Travancore kings and queens.
Not at all true. past was poverty everywhere; diseases, human corpes on the road sides were not a rarity. no treatment existed for No clothes, no luxuries. where were the so called Travancore rulers? you have no idea except the narrow strip of past history of which these rulers are glorified. Those from the old generations knows that even buying a shirt is hard back 5 decades. when the average people in Bombay or Madras can afford that! who contributed this regression? the rulers of Travancore primarily. People are misled till this day that they are benevolent rulers which is outright wrong. For accepting this truth, you have to face a hard truth - The caste sytem - Rajah's give land to Namboodiri Mana's in most places. then, Nairs who were the warrior class although considered shudra in varna system. So, who will love to have Rajah's rule? Brahmins and Nairs primarily? appeasement of majority by Travancore Rajahs. from my own childhood days, which is not so long back, I remember Mappila Muslims and Ezhavas and other SC/ST's suffering under poverty living in thatched roof huts. these all points NOT towards current Indian democracy, but the remnants of bad rulers particularly Travancore. who can expect good rule from monarchy? Under so called sickular democracy, Ezhavas, Muslims, Christians and all others flourished while traditional land owning groups are shocked to see what sickular democracy has made Kerala into!

SC/ST's are considered animals. till 5-6 decades back, Pulaya, Pariahs and such people are considered "Samanya buddhi illathavar"(lacking average intelligence). Minorities have very less rights. But, I agree lesser of the evil is Kochi Rajah.
whatever way you try justify Kingdom's(not alone Travancore), monarchy of previous centuries are primitive to the core. Travancore or Kochi are nothing. far worse exists. they are glorified for some policies or some achievements.

Rajavinte pallakku varunnundennu kettal aalkkar pennungale kondu sthalam vidumaayirunnu..athaanu Rajakkanmarum avarude bharanavum.
 
You need to look closely at your relationship with the Pandya Empire and you will be surprised to find the answers to your question.
We haven't denied the relationship with Pandyas. From King Vijaya's era, Sinhalese Kings took their wives from Madurai.
Vijaya's ministers in the meanwhile had set about securing a princess for their leader to marry, and found one in the form of the daughter of the Pandyan King of Madurai in Southern India. Not only did the King dispatch his daughter, but he also decreed that 'Those men here who are willing to let a daughter depart for Lanka shall provide their daughters with a double store of clothing and place them at the doors of their houses. By this sign shall we (know that we may) take them to ourselves'. Thus every male in Vijaya's crew received a wife (their original wives had been separated from them on their voyage to Sri Lanka, and according to legend they were sent to the Maldivian Islands.
The Mahavamsa describes the Pandyan ladies as originating from "Dakshina Madura" or "Southern Madura", which most Sinhala scholars have interpreted as modern-day Maduraiin the state of Tamil Nadu, "Northern Madura" being the city of Mathura in Uttar Pradesh. This is a solid evidence of the relationship that Sri Lanka and South India have shared for long. There are several such recorded instances of intermarriage between ruling families of Sri Lanka and the major royal South Indian Dynasties, in particular, the Pandyas and the Cheras.
Prince Vijaya - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Because of these interrelationships, Sinhalese Kings always biased towards Pandyans when there was a Chola-Pandya war. The history proves it. The modern genetic studies on Sinhalese point towards a predominantly Bengali contribution and a minor Tamil and North Western Indian contribution. I think, minor Tamil admixture is mainly due to Pandyan contribution.
Genetic studies on Sinhalese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Genetic admixture of Sinhalese by Dr. Saha Papiha
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Its better if you open a new thread on SL history.
I will consider it.
 
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Not at all true. past was poverty everywhere; diseases, human corpes on the road sides were not a rarity.

Poverty ? sure. Who was responsible ? The British, not the Travancore kings.

Both Kochi and Travancore abolished nearly 240 taxes, citing unjust way back in 1840s, including tax levied on roof etc, whereas many such existed in British India, e.g Salt Tax was abolished in 1846, when rest of India still had even in 1920's.

All these taxes were imposed by the British and the kings fought back and removed them for the benefit of the people. Still if there was poverty, it was because the british did not allow free trade and monopolized everything.

No treatment existed for

Nonsense :lol: ...... Ayurveda survived and thrived in kerla while it died in the rest of India primarily due to the patron support of the kings of Kerala.

No clothes, no luxuries. where were the so called Travancore rulers? you have no idea except the narrow strip of past history of which these rulers are glorified. Those from the old generations knows that even buying a shirt is hard back 5 decades. when the average people in Bombay or Madras can afford that! who contributed this regression? the rulers of Travancore primarily.

LOL. This is a picture of 1930 and I see plenty of clothes :lol: ....... FAR better than what the rest of India had at that time.

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Here is another picture from 1901, I still see plenty of clothes AND railway lines which the rest of India did not have, funded and built by the king.

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Again kerala pictures from 1901, I continue to see PLENTY of clothes :lol: .... now compare that with the rest of India who went around naked. Know why Gandhi did not wear clothes ? :lol:

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People are misled till this day that they are benevolent rulers which is outright wrong. For accepting this truth, you have to face a hard truth - The caste sytem - Rajah's give land to Namboodiri Mana's in most places. then,

Any proof of that ? :cheesy: .... or do we take the worlds of a bigot and christian supremacist at face value ?

Nairs who were the warrior class although considered shudra in varna system. So, who will love to have Rajah's rule? Brahmins and Nairs primarily? appeasement of majority by Travancore Rajahs.

LOL again. Every body loves their king if they are good. From the british to the Indians.

from my own childhood days, which is not so long back, I remember Mappila Muslims and Ezhavas and other SC/ST's suffering under poverty living in thatched roof huts. these all points NOT towards current Indian democracy, but the remnants of bad rulers particularly Travancore.

Blame your elected govt. especially the Communist and CONgress for that poverty :lol: ....No the old rulers. The old kings were INFINITELY better than the present day govt.

who can expect good rule from monarchy? Under so called sickular democracy, Ezhavas, Muslims, Christians and all others flourished while traditional land owning groups are shocked to see what sickular democracy has made Kerala into!

LOL. again. Malayalees expected and got a fantastic govt. under the Kerala kings. Education was given to all and had penetration at village level. Standard of living was MUCH higher than the rest of British India.

See how even the poor had clothes back then ? Look below.

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An picture from 1940. See how the common folks are dressed ? See how good the roads are ? now compare that with the rest of India in those days. :sick:

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SC/ST's are considered animals. till 5-6 decades back, Pulaya, Pariahs and such people are considered "Samanya buddhi illathavar"(lacking average intelligence). Minorities have very less rights.

LOL. Again.

This is a picture of a school in kerala village in 1936. You know who funded these schools at each village levels ? ...the kings of kerala, especially the Rani of Travancore.

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Below is Image from 1930 of village school and school children havign MID DAY MEAL. Yes you heard me right. You know who paid for those schools and the means ? ..the king of kerala :cheesy:

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Again village school from 1930.

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Again school from 1928. She the girls getting educated ? See how the chiildren are dressed ? Now compare this to the rest of British India :lol:

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But, I agree lesser of the evil is Kochi Rajah.
whatever way you try justify Kingdom's(not alone Travancore), monarchy of previous centuries are primitive to the core. Travancore or Kochi are nothing. far worse exists. they are glorified for some policies or some achievements.

Who cares what you think or agree with.

The Fact is that Kerala had their First TRAM system in 1907 :cheesy: ...... you know who used it ? That's right, the general PUBLIC.

The total length of tramway was 49.5 miles. Considering the double lines between certain points, the total length of rails laid is 56 miles.

The govt completed the construction within 6 years and total investment for this project was rupees 18.5 lakhs and the state treasury had incurred a total expenditure of Rs. 24 lakhs including maintenance till 15th August 1910. The state was able to generate a revenue of 17.5 lakhs of rupees from this tramway. The operating profits to the state treasury form this tramway is around 2 lakhs rupees per annum on an average.

IT was the SIKULAR newly formed Thirukochi Government who abolished this wonder in 1952 :lol:

Rajavinte pallakku varunnundennu kettal aalkkar pennungale kondu sthalam vidumaayirunnu..athaanu Rajakkanmarum avarude bharanavum.

LOL again. This is the 1914.GIRLS SCHOOL in KOZHIKODU

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Time to destroy the lies of "seculars" permanently.

Pictures of the kerla Tramway being build in 1905.

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1957 KOCHI CITY TRAMWAYS Co - TRAM No212

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Switchbacks and zig zags in the Cochin State Forest Tramway. Modern day engineers wonder how their predecessors of the early 1900's constructed such an elaborate railway system deep in the Kerala forests.

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This photo gives you an idea on the inclines that the Cochin State Forest Tramway once worked. If working now, this railway system would have been one of the industrial marvels of earlier times.

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Image from 1908 - RAILWAY STATION ,KOZHIKODU
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Mullaperiyar dam during when it was constructed during Travancore Kingdom era

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Trivandrum Royal General Hospital- India's first free public Allopathic hospital open to all people :coffee:

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Image from 1900.-WOMEN'S HOSPITAL
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Womens hospital in 1926

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OPERATION THEATRE or KOZHIKODU HOSPITAL taken in 1913.

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Alleppy Port, which was Travancore primary port, before development of Kochi Port.

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The Palayam- HQ of Travancore Royal Nair Army. Today its part of Kerala Niyamasabha- Legislature Assembly

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The trouble started with Christian converted were allowed to cover their breasts and others were not. There was long protracted rioting in which even lower caste and muslims attacked Nadars. The caste system ensured that when two people met the lower caste had to bear his/her breasts to the one with the higher caste.

You can argue that caste was wrong, but the law was same for everyone before the british started conversion and introduced social imbalance to promote conversions.
British missionaries were crooks indeed...but who had given them tool??..it was all started when travancore rani denied the permission to wear upper jackets for lower caste women..And the British used it as a golden opportunity for convertion..
BTW-Mullaperiyar dam was a cheated incident..it had nothing to do with Kerala..it was built for Tamilnadu....
 
British missionaries were crooks indeed...but who had given them tool??..it was all started when travancore rani denied the permission to wear upper jackets for lower caste women..And the British used it as a golden opportunity for convertion..
BTW-Mullaperiyar dam was a cheated incident..it had nothing to do with Kerala..it was built for Tamilnadu....

The wearing of the jacket and covering of upper body was a sign of disrespect and allowing it caused more social tension. If it was to be allowed, it had to be allowed for everybody. Not for one specific caste or community.

The tools of the british were not provided by the rulers, it was based on their own Military power and Race and Religious background.
 
The wearing of the jacket and covering of upper body was a sign of disrespect and allowing it caused more social tension. If it was to be allowed, it had to be allowed for everybody. Not for one specific caste or community.

The tools of the british were not provided by the rulers, it was based on their own Military power and Race and Religious background.
Suppose,If Rani wouldn't have made that announcement??...
Kanyakumari is the only district in Tamilnadu that has near Christian majority-47%(kanyakumari was once a part of travancore)..
Nadars are majority in Nellai and tuticorin districts of Tamil(which were out of old travancore) has only 10 & 17% Christian population...
so much for travancore rule..
 
Suppose,If Rani wouldn't have made that announcement??...
Kanyakumari is the only district in Tamilnadu that has near Christian majority-47%(kanyakumari was once a part of travancore)..
Nadars are majority in Nellai and tuticorin districts of Tamil(which were out of old travancore) has only 10 & 17% Christian population...
so much for travancore rule..

what is your point ?
 
We haven't denied the relationship with Pandyas. From King Vijaya's era, Sinhalese Kings took their wives from Madurai.

Because of these interrelationships, Sinhalese Kings always biased towards Pandyans when there was a Chola-Pandya war. The history proves it. The modern genetic studies on Sinhalese point towards a predominantly Bengali contribution and a minor Tamil and North Western Indian contribution. I think, minor Tamil admixture is mainly due to Pandyan contribution.
Genetic studies on Sinhalese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Genetic admixture of Sinhalese by Dr. Saha Papiha
View attachment 67743


I will consider it.
So you are indirectly telling that the ancestors of Sinhalese might have been from Bengal????
Reg-karawa,yes they may be from kshathriya clan but that doesn't means that they didn't spoke Tamil or had Tamil ancestry...Srilankan Tamil speaking karaiyar has also claimed possible kshathriya origin...we couldn't ignore that too.....

Nope, Thnx to British proselytizing missionaries, british funds, power and their agenda.
right..How did they managed to conquer India??same for mughals too...Was it ours or their fault??
 
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If we go further on this, the thread will be flooded with off-topic SLn stuff.
So you are indirectly telling that the ancestors of Sinhalese might have been from Bengal????
Even though genetically proved, It is a debatable matter yet.
 
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