Replacement of Pakistan Army's G-3 Rifles.

[Amaa'n]

g

.

These two things are
1) Gyms, body-building, and work-out for soldiers/officers!!!!

Look at Western soldiers. They very presence makes you 'feel' their presence. Strong, muscled, sleek, and FIT! Clearly above the rest.

Our soldiers look tiny, weak boys in comparison to them...

Pakistan Army soldiers must also be fit, strong, and tough men...a whole level above than the civilians!

some what i disagree with you on above part - Muscles and heavy built is one thing while Endurance and Fitness level is another....
What I know is for a Solider you need a person with good mental capacity, Endurance, & body fitness.
Don't forget all those muscles will add extra weight for the soldiers to carry - can restrict the movements to a point too.

 

[AUz]

g

some what i disagree with you on above part - Muscles and heavy built is one thing while Endurance and Fitness level is another....
What I know is for a Solider you need a person with good mental capacity, Endurance, & body fitness.
Don't forget all those muscles will add extra weight for the soldiers to carry - can restrict the movements to a point too.

Well, I am not arguing to make every Pakistani soldier a mega 'buff'...but there should be minimum level of body buildup required for all soldiers.

This is necessary. Gym only helps endurance and fitness

 

[Informant]

Pakistan must learn from Israel when it comes to making firearms.

Look at Israelis, they manufacture probably THE best modern assault rifles and fire-arms for their military and special forces.

While we are still stuck with stone-age G3 that was being used in World War 2 era !!!

Pakistan Army needs two things that might not look that important in over-all military calculus, but will give Pakistan Army a real face-lift as a powerful force to recon with..

These two things are
1) Gyms, body-building, and work-out for soldiers/officers!!!!

Look at Western soldiers. They very presence makes you 'feel' their presence. Strong, muscled, sleek, and FIT! Clearly above the rest.

Our soldiers look tiny, weak boys in comparison to them...

Pakistan Army soldiers must also be fit, strong, and tough men...a whole level above than the civilians!

2) Have our soldiers carry a kick-*** modern assault/battle rifle!

Again, this is psychologically very important! Abhi to you feel bad for Pakistani soldiers since they carry weapons that are inferior to weapons carried by many people in Karachi..lol..

If I was a general assigned to re-vitalized the image of Pakistan Army...I would've done these two things immediately. I know it takes time and can't be done over-night....but still..there should be urgent steps in these regards, transforming your military in coming years.

Side note: I didn't include uniform b/c I think the new uniform is pretty O.K



Pakistan Military Forces are a massive machine..We aren't like Israelis who faced urban warfare on day to day basis.

Our forces are deployed in plains, deserts, and mountains to face conventional thread of a million man military to our east...

short-barrel guns are in Special Services already...

Size of barrel isn't much of problem for us.

While your points hold water, but you have to realise each US soldier is a million dollar machine. That's right, it takes 1 million dollar for a US soldier to train them with up to date military tactics and latest weapons handling training. Plus The average height in the US army during Iraq war theater was 5'10. Ours is about 5'7 - 5'8. Plus their built is wide and huge as you have seen race factor does come into play. No wonder the US soliders look like men with "tore". Plus the gear they are afforded is untouchable, air cover/air support at a short notice. If you have seen their videos of battles the Talibans have RARELY killed any US soldier in an open gun battle. It's only IEDs that have caused so many casualties. Their doctrine is followed all over and we are following it since after their experience in so many wars it is impeccable, loving or hating their policy is different, but one cannot deny their prowess.

Now the main issue is we are a poor nation, the army has a budget of $3 B. Now factor in the costs for nuclear arsenal and weapons development. Then the ongoing WOT operations. So everything takes a hit and the development and training costs. So the new gear will take some time, rest assured the army does realise the need for a new weapon/requirements. G3 is a battle rifle suited for plains open areas. Since our new war is Counter Terrorism the rifle isnt suited at all. It's big, a meter long, heavy and the caliber is not suited at all. So i see your issue with it. The G3M/S has been developed keeping in mind these issues.

Rest assured the direction is right but funds for us have always been an issue.

 

[Armstrong]

@Oscar - Are we incapable of producing a proper Designed & Manufactured in Pakistan Battlerifle/Assault Rifle or are we just not bothered about doing that ?

 

[SQ8]

@Oscar - Are we incapable of producing a proper Designed & Manufactured in Pakistan Battlerifle/Assault Rifle or are we just not bothered about doing that ?

Well, it depends on if there are mechanical engineers who actually come up with something creative. Not too many Mikhail Kalashinkovs out there in Pakistan as such and copying without getting the IP rights will lead to bad reputation and mistrust from arms manufacturers. However, taking existing designs and finding improvements in them is not a bad idea and is done on various levels. One option is to research and note down the various tweaks and modifications done by troops or Ord guys at grass roots level and incorporate those improvements into the original rifle.. this is done to a certain extent at POF.
A new rifle can be manufactured but the basic requirement is that it must perform better than the last one. As such, the Army seems satisfied with the AK(PK-10) as its new preferred weapon. The AK is a fairly modified design though and not much can be done with it that has not already been done.
So it just depends on the requirement... worst case.. one can hire a few ex-USSR east european engineers and have them design something.

 

[Informant]

Well, it depends on if there are mechanical engineers who actually come up with something creative. Not too many Mikhail Kalashinkovs out there in Pakistan as such and copying without getting the IP rights will lead to bad reputation and mistrust from arms manufacturers. However, taking existing designs and finding improvements in them is not a bad idea and is done on various levels. One option is to research and note down the various tweaks and modifications done by troops or Ord guys at grass roots level and incorporate those improvements into the original rifle.. this is done to a certain extent at POF.
A new rifle can be manufactured but the basic requirement is that it must perform better than the last one. As such, the Army seems satisfied with the AK(PK-10) as its new preferred weapon. The AK is a fairly modified design though and not much can be done with it that has not already been done.
So it just depends on the requirement... worst case.. one can hire a few ex-USSR east european engineers and have them design something.

POF has let us down with their bullet's quality lately, especially the 9mm rounds.

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

1) Gyms, body-building, and work-out for soldiers/officers!!!!......
2) Have our soldiers carry a kick-*** modern assault/battle rifle!
...

........... Your joking right?

1) You want to compare a Dal & Roti diet with a Red Steak Meat, mash Potato, Hamburger infused diet?

Sure look at the Hollywood movies featuring Arnold Schwarzenegger throwing a Tomahawk missile with one hand or you could come back to reality and see the actual US Soldier.

The average US Spec Operator isn't your brawn for show bodybuilder, hell most of the guys are built but lean.

Its Psychological factor that motivates a man to march 25km in 15 hours. The ability to Disassociate from the pain, uncomfortable, and grueling scenarios. Is what makes the best soldier.

Whether you say genetics has more influence on body shape than diet or vice versa, its not about the body structure. A good soldiers knows how to use what he/she's got.

I'm close to 5.8ish" 152 lb, (that's about 15 Km for you metric users Skinny but lean. Come see me flip over dumb idiots who are 6.4" 190 lb.

2) "You know, the enemy's always been terrified of noise" go compare a G3 to the M16.

 

[RescueRanger]

What is this I am reading about GYM's and Bodybuilding and Big Guns?

 

[Armstrong]

I'm close to 5.8ish"

Shorty !

I'm 5'8 too !

But try flipping over the 6'3 200lb juggernaut that @RescueRanger is !

 

[Informant]

Lots a manlets here.

5'11 checking in

 

[farhan_9909]

Well i second AUZ.

soldier should atleast keep themselves fit.But in Pak army anyone who reaches major rank.His belly starts getting bigger and bigger

 

[Armstrong]

Lots a manlets here.

5'11 checking in

@RescueRanger - Did this guy just imply that I'm a midget ?

 

[Informant]

Well i second AUZ.

soldier should atleast keep themselves fit.But in Pak army anyone who reaches major rank.His belly starts getting bigger and bigger

Bi money big plots big tidd

 

[RescueRanger]

@RescueRanger - Did this guy just imply that I'm a midget ?

Sir

• Manny Pacquiao is 5ft 6"
• Jay dee Penn (one of the greatest MMA fighters) is 5.9
• Sean Sherk (UFC Hall Of Fame) 5ft.6"
• Jet Li (Not a full fighter) but he was Grand Master Champion Of Tumbling Fist Martial Art ( 5ft 5")

Height is not everything, tall guys need to protect them knees..

 

[Armstrong]

Sir

• Manny Pacquiao is 5ft 6"
• Jay dee Penn (one of the greatest MMA fighters) is 5.9
• Sean Sherk (UFC Hall Of Fame) 5ft.6"
• Jet Li (Not a full fighter) but he was Grand Master Champion Of Tumbling Fist Martial Art ( 5ft 5")

Height is not everything, tall guys need to protect them knees..

I say the same thing to myself 'its alright....its alright' when my 6'7 cousin takes the basket ball & just stands there as I flap around like an idiot trying to barely reach his elbow let alone the ball !

But then I even the odds whenever we play Rugby - The taller you are the higher your center of gravity & the easier is it to tackle you !