jammersat
BANNED
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2014
- Messages
- 2,691
- Reaction score
- -8
- Country
- Location
in the middle east it usually doesn't cost much , but in turkey it does
Russia to deploy S-400 defense missile system to Khmeimim airbase in Syria: Defence Minister
- Thread starter TaiShang
- Start date
in the middle east it usually doesn't cost much , but in turkey it does
Hypersonicmissiles
FULL MEMBER
- Joined
- Jan 21, 2014
- Messages
- 683
- Reaction score
- -2
- Country
- Location
Ihtasham ahmed
FULL MEMBER
New Recruit
- Joined
- Jul 23, 2014
- Messages
- 38
- Reaction score
- 0
- Country
- Location
bad news for NATO , they must bring su30 and -35 to escort bombers
Speeder 2
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- Mar 24, 2010
- Messages
- 2,391
- Reaction score
- -10
- Country
- Location
This news shows 1 thing even much clearer that unlike Turkey, Russia is a first rate military power after all, not only on hardware but also, perhaps more importantly, on tactical excellency:
I would have deployed S-300 right away and didn't expect Putin would field much more powerful S-400 on one-go. Good move!!
This whole "incident" can be turned around helping Russia immensely if Putin reacts well tactically, and so far so good:
1. it will further convince the world popular opinion that Russia is on the moral high ground against ISIL
2. It will further draw support and sympathy to Russia from European masses and increasingly main stream European politicians - this will paralyse NATO
3. it exposes to the world for the first time in public and full 24*7 network headlines that who is/are the supporters of ISIL behind the scene. It directly let the world know that Turkey is a key ally of ISIL. The world is not a fool regardless what some main stream media say.
4. it offers a legit excuse to Russia of enforcing an unspoken "non-fly-zone" between Syria and Turkey border by deploying S-300 or S-400, which, with the proper support of ground forces, will cut off the Turkish lifeline of ISIL ( as identified by Beast above). This move will not only threanten Turkish F-16, but also essentially put on an effective shield againt any NATO aircraft - a further likely move by Obama
5. once having completely controled in the air, Putin can just bomb them into the stone age and cut ISIL etc apart on the ground before devouring them piece by piece, with the ground support by the Syrian Army and the Kurds.
6. Under above 1, 2, 3 , 4 and 5 , the US can not do ANYTHING (except oral protest) to protect its Middle East "attack dog" ISIL carefully-trained, armed, and financed by CIA, Mossad, Saudi, Qatar and Turkey, but essentially start to loss this invaluable asset. Otherwise, the whole world will start to see the double-faced US morality in plain daylight.
7. as for the revenge of Su-24, no big deal as with above goals settled Russia then can do it any time , anywhere as it sees fit.
As a matter of a fact, at some proper time Russia can then even choose to bomb the hell out of some Turkish military bases inside Turkey with an excuses of their role of training ISIL. What can Turkey do ? Nothing. because neither the US nor NATO/EU will take the risk of a full-scale nuclear war with Russia , for the sake of Turkey's stupid first provocation. Then UNSC 5 will then have an overnight close-door meeting to interviene to stop the fight... So Russia in the end could come out as a big winner out of this mess, with Turkey sacrificed and being roasted as a "Xmas gift" amongst the big boys behind the door.
I would have deployed S-300 right away and didn't expect Putin would field much more powerful S-400 on one-go. Good move!!
This whole "incident" can be turned around helping Russia immensely if Putin reacts well tactically, and so far so good:
1. it will further convince the world popular opinion that Russia is on the moral high ground against ISIL
2. It will further draw support and sympathy to Russia from European masses and increasingly main stream European politicians - this will paralyse NATO
3. it exposes to the world for the first time in public and full 24*7 network headlines that who is/are the supporters of ISIL behind the scene. It directly let the world know that Turkey is a key ally of ISIL. The world is not a fool regardless what some main stream media say.
4. it offers a legit excuse to Russia of enforcing an unspoken "non-fly-zone" between Syria and Turkey border by deploying S-300 or S-400, which, with the proper support of ground forces, will cut off the Turkish lifeline of ISIL ( as identified by Beast above). This move will not only threanten Turkish F-16, but also essentially put on an effective shield againt any NATO aircraft - a further likely move by Obama
5. once having completely controled in the air, Putin can just bomb them into the stone age and cut ISIL etc apart on the ground before devouring them piece by piece, with the ground support by the Syrian Army and the Kurds.
6. Under above 1, 2, 3 , 4 and 5 , the US can not do ANYTHING (except oral protest) to protect its Middle East "attack dog" ISIL carefully-trained, armed, and financed by CIA, Mossad, Saudi, Qatar and Turkey, but essentially start to loss this invaluable asset. Otherwise, the whole world will start to see the double-faced US morality in plain daylight.
7. as for the revenge of Su-24, no big deal as with above goals settled Russia then can do it any time , anywhere as it sees fit.
As a matter of a fact, at some proper time Russia can then even choose to bomb the hell out of some Turkish military bases inside Turkey with an excuses of their role of training ISIL. What can Turkey do ? Nothing. because neither the US nor NATO/EU will take the risk of a full-scale nuclear war with Russia , for the sake of Turkey's stupid first provocation. Then UNSC 5 will then have an overnight close-door meeting to interviene to stop the fight... So Russia in the end could come out as a big winner out of this mess, with Turkey sacrificed and being roasted as a "Xmas gift" amongst the big boys behind the door.
Last edited:
nForce
ELITE MEMBER
- Joined
- Apr 26, 2010
- Messages
- 8,910
- Reaction score
- -1
- Country
- Location
entire ME is so messed up.
TaiShang
ELITE MEMBER
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2014
- Messages
- 27,848
- Reaction score
- 70
- Country
- Location
Downing of Russian Su-24 looks like a planned provocation - FM Lavrov in Q&A session
Published time: 25 Nov, 2015 11:34 Edited time: 25 Nov, 2015 12:41
Russian Foreign Affairs Minister Sergei Lavrov. © Iliya Pitalev / Sputnik
“We have serious doubts that this act was unintentional. It looks very much like a preplanned provocation,” Lavrov said, citing Turkey’s failure to maintain proper communication with Russia, the abundance of footage of the incident and other evidence.
Lavrov added that many Russian partners called the incident “an obvious ambush.”
Earlier in the day, Turkish Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu slammed Russia for "attacks on Turkmen" in Syria, which according to Ankara preceded the incident with the downed Su-24.
The Russian FM said the region where the incident happened is not just home to Turkmen people. There are also hundreds of foreign fighters affiliated with known terrorist groups and elements of their infrastructure such as weapons depots and command points there, he said.
“I asked [Turkish FM Çavuşoğlu] whether Turkey’s close attention to this region, including the calls to create a buffer zone there, was motivated by a desire to protect this infrastructure from destruction. I didn’t receive any reply to this question,” Lavrov said.
READ MORE: Ankara defends ISIS, Turkish officials have financial interest in oil trade with group - PM Medvedev
He added the downing of the Russian warplane occurred shortly after a series of airstrikes on terrorist oil convoys and facilities by the Russian Air Force. The incident “sheds new light” on the issue, according to the Russian foreign minister.
The Russian diplomat criticized NATO for failing to express condolences to Russia over the loss of its troops lives.
“Very strange statements were voiced after a NATO meeting called by the Turks, which didn’t express any regret or condolences and in effect were aimed at covering up what the Turkish Air Force did yesterday,” Lavrov said. “A similar reaction came from the European Union.”
Lavrov reiterated the statements of the Russian Defense Ministry, which denied Ankara’s allegations that the Russian warplane had violated Turkish airspace.
He added that even if Turkey’s words were taken on face value, its actions contradict its own position expressed in 2012, after Syria took down a Turkish military plane. At the time, then-Prime Minister Erdogan told the Turkish parliament that a short incursion into another nation’s airspace cannot justify an attack on it.
Russia’s relations with Syria will change after the attack on the Russian plane, Lavrov said, adding that Turkey, which is now calling for dialogue, should have done more to communicate with Russia prior to and right after the incident.
Moscow will measure its response to limit the harm done to Turkish and Russian businessmen, who had nothing to do with the incident, and would decide on a proper action, Lavrov said.
“We cannot fail to react to what happened. Not because we must retaliate. It’s just that there are too many issues in Turkey that pose a direct terrorist threat to our citizens. And not only ours,” he said.
Lavrov said after canceling his planned visit to Istanbul that Moscow doesn’t indent to send any senior officials to Turkey or receive any senior Turkish officials. At the same time, phone channels remain open, as evidenced by the call with Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu.
The Russian minister said there was a question of American involvement in the downing of the Russian plane. According to his sources, the US demands all members of the anti-IS coalition led by Washington, who use US-made military aircraft, coordinate all deployments with the US military.
“I wonder if this demand of the Americans covers… Turkey. If it does, I wonder whether Turkey asked permission from the US to fly its US-made planes and take down – let’s say 'an unidentified' – plane over Syrian territory,” Lavrov said.
The senior Russian diplomat said the problems at the Turkish-Syrian border could be solved by simply closing it, as suggested by French President Francois Hollande during his meeting with US President Barack Obama in Washington.
“President Hollande suggested measures to close the Turkish-Syrian border to stop the flow of militants and finances to terrorists. It’s remarkable that President Obama didn’t react to it. I believe it’s a good suggestion and that during the visit tomorrow President Hollande will tell us details. We are prepared to consider these measures in earnest. Many people say that sealing the border would effectively eliminate the terrorist threat in Syria,” Lavrov said.
***
Interesting to see how many times Turkey has violated Greek airspace over the years...
2044 registered violations in 2014 alone.
Russian Embassy in UK warned its citizens against travel to Turkey.
Russian Embassy, UK @RussianEmbassy 17 minutes ago
Russian nationals advised against all travel to Turkey, threat to their security is significant.
Published time: 25 Nov, 2015 11:34 Edited time: 25 Nov, 2015 12:41
Russian Foreign Affairs Minister Sergei Lavrov. © Iliya Pitalev / Sputnik
“We have serious doubts that this act was unintentional. It looks very much like a preplanned provocation,” Lavrov said, citing Turkey’s failure to maintain proper communication with Russia, the abundance of footage of the incident and other evidence.
Lavrov added that many Russian partners called the incident “an obvious ambush.”
Earlier in the day, Turkish Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu slammed Russia for "attacks on Turkmen" in Syria, which according to Ankara preceded the incident with the downed Su-24.
The Russian FM said the region where the incident happened is not just home to Turkmen people. There are also hundreds of foreign fighters affiliated with known terrorist groups and elements of their infrastructure such as weapons depots and command points there, he said.
“I asked [Turkish FM Çavuşoğlu] whether Turkey’s close attention to this region, including the calls to create a buffer zone there, was motivated by a desire to protect this infrastructure from destruction. I didn’t receive any reply to this question,” Lavrov said.
READ MORE: Ankara defends ISIS, Turkish officials have financial interest in oil trade with group - PM Medvedev
He added the downing of the Russian warplane occurred shortly after a series of airstrikes on terrorist oil convoys and facilities by the Russian Air Force. The incident “sheds new light” on the issue, according to the Russian foreign minister.
The Russian diplomat criticized NATO for failing to express condolences to Russia over the loss of its troops lives.
“Very strange statements were voiced after a NATO meeting called by the Turks, which didn’t express any regret or condolences and in effect were aimed at covering up what the Turkish Air Force did yesterday,” Lavrov said. “A similar reaction came from the European Union.”
Lavrov reiterated the statements of the Russian Defense Ministry, which denied Ankara’s allegations that the Russian warplane had violated Turkish airspace.
He added that even if Turkey’s words were taken on face value, its actions contradict its own position expressed in 2012, after Syria took down a Turkish military plane. At the time, then-Prime Minister Erdogan told the Turkish parliament that a short incursion into another nation’s airspace cannot justify an attack on it.
Russia’s relations with Syria will change after the attack on the Russian plane, Lavrov said, adding that Turkey, which is now calling for dialogue, should have done more to communicate with Russia prior to and right after the incident.
Moscow will measure its response to limit the harm done to Turkish and Russian businessmen, who had nothing to do with the incident, and would decide on a proper action, Lavrov said.
“We cannot fail to react to what happened. Not because we must retaliate. It’s just that there are too many issues in Turkey that pose a direct terrorist threat to our citizens. And not only ours,” he said.
Lavrov said after canceling his planned visit to Istanbul that Moscow doesn’t indent to send any senior officials to Turkey or receive any senior Turkish officials. At the same time, phone channels remain open, as evidenced by the call with Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu.
The Russian minister said there was a question of American involvement in the downing of the Russian plane. According to his sources, the US demands all members of the anti-IS coalition led by Washington, who use US-made military aircraft, coordinate all deployments with the US military.
“I wonder if this demand of the Americans covers… Turkey. If it does, I wonder whether Turkey asked permission from the US to fly its US-made planes and take down – let’s say 'an unidentified' – plane over Syrian territory,” Lavrov said.
The senior Russian diplomat said the problems at the Turkish-Syrian border could be solved by simply closing it, as suggested by French President Francois Hollande during his meeting with US President Barack Obama in Washington.
“President Hollande suggested measures to close the Turkish-Syrian border to stop the flow of militants and finances to terrorists. It’s remarkable that President Obama didn’t react to it. I believe it’s a good suggestion and that during the visit tomorrow President Hollande will tell us details. We are prepared to consider these measures in earnest. Many people say that sealing the border would effectively eliminate the terrorist threat in Syria,” Lavrov said.
***
Interesting to see how many times Turkey has violated Greek airspace over the years...
2044 registered violations in 2014 alone.
Russian Embassy in UK warned its citizens against travel to Turkey.
Russian Embassy, UK @RussianEmbassy 17 minutes ago
Russian nationals advised against all travel to Turkey, threat to their security is significant.
Last edited:
Stannis Baratheon
FULL MEMBER
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2015
- Messages
- 1,281
- Reaction score
- -2
- Country
- Location
Looks like I was right when I said Russia will deploy S-400 at Syria.
flamer84
BANNED
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2013
- Messages
- 9,435
- Reaction score
- -14
- Country
- Location
Gazprom
FULL MEMBER
- Joined
- Feb 11, 2014
- Messages
- 843
- Reaction score
- -5
- Country
- Location
Hacking , a lot easier than technical know how for making a semiconductor fab for production of processors for computer usage or even software development . But then you are a flag waving nationalist. If Bulgaria and Romania continued development in the right direction they would have been home to competitors of TSMC,Intel and GlobalFoundries.
Bulgaria was the first Eastern European country in the bloc to make personal computer and microtransistors for its Pravetz PC in 70's. Before that Eastern Europe used mainframes from Russia which were bulky.
flamer84
BANNED
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2013
- Messages
- 9,435
- Reaction score
- -14
- Country
- Location
Blame that on the pro Kremlin stooges who ruled Romania after 1990,especially in the 90-96 period when our industry was flattened.
Google Ion Iliescu,Petre Roman,all KGB assets,2nd tier communists who hated the nationalist Ceausescu and who killed him with Moscow backing in 1989.
Jlaw
ELITE MEMBER
- Joined
- Nov 6, 2013
- Messages
- 9,693
- Reaction score
- -22
- Country
- Location
China should have taken more advantage of opportunities but China have weak leaders since Mao.
Gazprom
FULL MEMBER
- Joined
- Feb 11, 2014
- Messages
- 843
- Reaction score
- -5
- Country
- Location
And yet romania joined NATO. Seems to me that the stooges were pro-NATO and sold their fatherland for Dollar. Like Gorbachev and Yeltsin.
Jlaw
ELITE MEMBER
- Joined
- Nov 6, 2013
- Messages
- 9,693
- Reaction score
- -22
- Country
- Location
That is the danger of alliance. If one member is a trouble maker, the others have no choice to go in a fight helping the trouble maker. If not, than the alliance is a failure.
Ind4Ever
BANNED
- Joined
- Jan 20, 2015
- Messages
- 3,579
- Reaction score
- -3
- Country
- Location
Th
Anyways. Now that whom will you support. Turkey or Russia?
That's your own thoughts. Personal opinion. It's not mood of the nation.
Anyways. Now that whom will you support. Turkey or Russia?
Baloch Pakistani
FULL MEMBER
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2015
- Messages
- 760
- Reaction score
- 0
- Country
- Location
There was no need to attack russian plane since it was not threatening turkish planes and also left their space within 17 seconds. I am with russia on this particular incident. It was very uncalled for.
Similar threads
