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Is PDF helping bring people of Pakistan and India Closer

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@haviz any decent human being would standup and call right , right and wrong, wrong.

I have pointed out that pushtoon are a federation of tribes and people of different races whose views and values were same and thus lead to kinship. it doesn't mean that you are not a pushtoon, pushtoon is values and ethics and good vs bad nothing to do with race.

I am a Muslim i am a Pakistani i am a turk i am a ghilzai, the most important thing in all this is me being a Muslim and Pakistani.

Many historians say that ghiljays are actually khiljis who were pashtunized turks of afghanistan, the same khiljis who ruled delhi. But you are perhaps the first ghiljay who is calling himself a turk...are you a supporter of pan-turkism?
 
I read some of the posts, seems like Pakistanis need to start getting closer together among themselves before trying to come close to Indians :lol:
 
I read some of the posts, seems like Pakistanis need to start getting closer together among themselves before trying to come close to Indians :lol:

We are close to eachother

No one really wants to be close with Indians
 
I will give you an example of the mistake we nationalists have made. When Pakhtunkhwa was getting a name change we severely opposed it-at least the majority of nationalist factions around tried to hamper it saying that a name change was bad and an anti-federation move as provinces on the basis of ethnicity are wrong. Even Pashtuns were part of it. However we did not see that 3 provinces are already named in this way. ANP came and took the fish from the mouth of the shark that promoted concepts such as honor and nationalism-which is so ghairatmand but we failed to have a single political movement yet. So it is a failure on our part to understand the ethnic issue. If a pro-federation party had renamed the place we could have stopped a party with questionable background and very questionable supporters like Luffy from coming to power.

The Pakistaniyat approach to ethnic issues has failed @KingMamba93 and it is time to face this reality. This is why this debate is now open.

Pakistaniyat made us give a general order that all Nationalists were not to share their ethnicity with anyone. It didn't work-people would still figure out from where we lived and the language we spoke. We tried to teach our members another language to obfuscate it-this is how far we went. The only way is to break the shackles of identity is-

1) challenge why it is taken so seriously-by abandoning muhajir identity I give the message that this is not a necessity... it is not necessary to have an ethnic identity to survive.
2) By merging as a Pashtun I give a message of unity and respect of Pashtuns. I will help promote the culture, the language the ways. The offer of 500 Dhs is still on for anyone who can prove he will promote Pashtun culture and history. These parts of history we should know so Luffy cannot mislead us.
3) I also challenge muhajir identity itself. If you read all the posts on the muhajir identity thread you will be convinced. There is no one who cannot be. Migrants were supposed to merge with the ethnic groups where they came. In Pakhtunkhwa and Balochistan this happened and even @Monkey D Luffy admitted this but now finds the need to bash me as he does everyone else. It only failed in Karachi because muhajir population overwhelmed the local one and now makes up 70% of Karachi. This made it difficult for them to merge with the Sindhis other than their own attitudes.
4) You might ask why not sindhis. One is my attraction to Pashtuns. Two is demographics of karachi (25% Pashtuns and 7% Sindhis) so they are the logical choice. Most of all there is my background and my links to Pashtuns.
5) To promote self-criticism. I am from birth a muhajir and that identity though I realize it is a failure was imposed on me at birth and am trying to break it-but maybe me criticizing how my family behaved can result in a mass movement of this scale and result in the breaking of the ethnic identities itself as they become inconsequential.

I thank you @ghilzai and @Armstrong for supporting me when everyone else calls me an idiot. It is an honor. But I believe the debate has gone to a different tangent by Luffy responding and me responding back. :D

So king mamba I will not do something that is against my country-be sure of it. This is in its benefit that I take this stand. Furthermore yes I do love Pashtun culture, ways history and language. But there is nothing wrong with that. It does not make me a racist nor do I have to bash anyone to maintain this identity unlike Luffy. Also do remember I may have some heritage.

Bro the Pakistaniyat option has not failed because if it had there would be no Pakistan.

I read some of the posts, seems like Pakistanis need to start getting closer together among themselves before trying to come close to Indians :lol:

Since being close to India was out of the question, the thread turned into way that Pakistanis themselves can get closer. :cheers:

Many historians say that ghiljays are actually khiljis who were pashtunized turks of afghanistan, the same khiljis who ruled delhi. But you are perhaps the first ghiljay who is calling himself a turk...are you a supporter of pan-turkism?

Even if they were "pashtunized" they would still be Turks.
 
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I read some of the posts, seems like Pakistanis need to start getting closer together among themselves before trying to come close to Indians :lol:

Who is trying to come close to indians?? And we Pakistanis are close to ourselves.
 
@luffy d monkey, no personal theory on origins of pushtoon then?.

Boy you are so quiet today and we all wait for your masterpiece on origins if pushtoon.

There is the bani israel theory, the turk theory, Qias Abdur Rashid theory and dozens of others. It proves that no one knows exactly. So people's ethnicity changes over time. Luffy admitted this himself. I will show you the post:

There are many indian mohajirs settled in Peshawer, most of them identify themeselves as hindkowans and some of them identify themeselves as pashtuns and punjabis.
In my home town, lakki marwat, there are biharis who settled there after 1971, their pakorras, samosas and similar foods that they sell are very tasty, they speak perfect pashto and are integrated fully.

In my opinion mohajirs should not have been allowed to settle in one place e.g karachi, they should have been dispersed through out country.

Its post 63
http://www.defence.pk/forums/nation...iscussion-muhajir-identity-5.html#post3774613

I realized when these guys were bashing me on the other forum (At that time Luffy was better because I didn't say anything about my background. ) i realized what these people were really afraid of was someone challenging their views. If we don't do that Luffy may brainwash many more people which may actually be his purpose.

A question that should settle this debate. @KingMamba93... a month ago I was talking to centcom and my posts were derisive as they usually are about US foreign policy. You took offense and defended USA. Now why do you defend USA. Even if you share some link to Pakistan you feel offended and consider yourself American and have American flags. Your kids will not care about Pakistan at all and you know this is what happens with foreign passports which is why I rejected it for Canada and don't want one. So caught you didn't I. :azn:

Identity changes with time. This is just people who dislike me chasing me around. You should be able to realize that kingmamba. All of the posters who commented negatively dislike me very much. Luffy with that post stands exposed too.
 
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I read some of the posts, seems like Pakistanis need to start getting closer together among themselves before trying to come close to Indians :lol:

well some of the posts you read is because you are in our forum, this is our home and you are our guests in our home, we talk about our arguements here, it doesnt mean we are far away
 
Many historians say that ghiljays are actually khiljis who were pashtunized turks of afghanistan, the same khiljis who ruled delhi. But you are perhaps the first ghiljay who is calling himself a turk...are you a supporter of pan-turkism?

Luffy there was no Afghanistan, it was called khorasan. Afghanistan is a fictional name that came centuries later.
 
Pakistani first, second and last... then a Pashtun. Why do you identify as an American despite being son of a Pakistani? :azn:
Gotcha?

He is a birth citizen of America I think.
 
Its post 63
http://www.defence.pk/forums/nation...iscussion-muhajir-identity-5.html#post3774613

I realized when these guys were bashing me on the other forum (At that time Luffy was better because I didn't say anything about my background. ) i realized what these people were really afraid of was someone challenging their views. If we don't do that Luffy may brainwash many more people which may actually be his purpose.

A question that should settle this debate. @KingMamba93... a month ago I was talking to centcom and my posts were derisive as they usually are about US foreign policy. You took offense and defended USA. Now why do you defend USA. Even if you share some link to Pakistan you feel offended and consider yourself American and have American flags. Your kids will not care about Pakistan at all and you know this is what happens with foreign passports which is why I rejected it for Canada and don't want one. So caught you didn't I. :azn:

Identity changes with time. This is just people who dislike me chasing me around. You should be able to realize that kingmamba. All of the posters who commented negatively dislike me very much. Luffy with that post stands exposed too.

You were making fun of @CENTCOM on the basis that he had a Muslim name. Of which I took offense because my family has also participated as part of US military and one day inshAllah after my studies I will too (as I have told Armstrong already) so it is not so absurd to believe that he is a Muslim in the military. I defend USA where they deserve to be defended, yes the foreign policy of the US is sht I do not deny that however you were bashing US on a thread that had nothing to do with US foreign policy. I believe it was a thread about people helping Pakistanis or something, I do not fully remember what the thread was about. My passport is irrelevant because although I know so little about Pakistan I have made an effort to learn more or else why would I be on this forum to begin with?? I am in a more neutral position when it comes to Pakistan and US because I can identify with both, on this forum the other American posters are usually in a defensive posture because they are outnumbered and so they go into bashing mode. Audio is just an islamophobic imbecile so him aside the others feel they need to be defensive when an anti-US posture is taken in a thread. Also a lot of people here think since the US government has bad foreign policy the people must be just as bad which is also not the case. Talon was calling all Americans racist in naswar corner on the basis that she heard some stories, I however having lived here my whole life can tell you the racism is little and white Americans who are demonized are not so bad. I have a lot of white friends, I have been to the "bible belt", have family is in Texas which is perhaps the most republicanized christian state in the union and have never felt ostracized. So yes I will defend America when they deserve defending, so no you did not catch me anywhere.

Identity and ethnicity is being mixed up here. You can identify with Pashtuns on the basis that they are fellow Pakistanis but cannot become a Pashtun because that is a matter of ethnicity aka genetic.
 
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@luffy since you say with pride that you are a marwat a branch of ghilzais, so tell me how can turk pushtonise a turk?.
 
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Pakistani first, second and last... then a Pashtun. Why do you identify as an American despite being son of a Pakistani? :azn:
Gotcha?

No you did not get me, my father was also an American although not born here. I was born here so I identify with the soil I was born on, raised on, and inshAllah will die on. Being an American means transcending race but that does not mean I am not an ethnic punjabi. However when someone asks me where is your family from I will obviously respond Pakistan, there is no country known as Punjab or is there? :coffee: That is why America is so successful, e pluribus unum. Out of many we are one.
 
@luffy its not too late to swallow that pride.

So have you cooked up your personal theory on the origins or have you just lost the will to think of one, or maybe there wasn't one to start with.

Those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
 
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He is a birth citizen of America I think.

Yes I am. I think I am perhaps the only American on this forum who was actually born here in America. The rest have immigrated years ago.

I may be wrong though. Opinionator maybe, I know he is an elder.
 
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