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PAF J-10C News, Updates and Discussion

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Ethics. As the question was in English and there are international journalists as well.
When we are in England do they change the language for us? My point was we should be proud of urdu and speak in urdu. If that puts international media at a disadvantage so be it. They are not our friends anyways
 
Normal Proceeding in regard to national debate. We are not India to make it a mountain and spend days like their media does so. It is just Military thing. However, Forum is available and for the same reason to discuss all the way till eternity. However those comments were in regard to members want this news from PAF press conference, DGISPR taking 15 minutes to address, media houses keep talking about, talk shows and what not; is totally like a childish behaviour and on professional. Agar Raphayl hota, is not us.
All I wanted to hear from the DG ISPR was, "Yes, we have purchased the J-10 aircraft from China and it will be arriving in Pakistan this year."

Doesn't matter whether it's 1 or 25 aircraft. The gentleman just needed to confirm with a, "Yes" and I would've been relieved.

Instead he was saying, we are evaluating, we monitor what the enemy acquires, we are working on indigenous programs, we will enhance capacity, we are taking necessary steps.

This tension and uncertainty not knowing whether the production of JF-17 Thunders for PAF has now been or will be capped due to J-10s is not helpful.
 
All I wanted to hear from the DG ISPR was, "Yes, we have purchased the J-10 aircraft from China and it will be arriving in Pakistan this year."

Doesn't matter whether it's 1 or 25 aircraft. The gentleman just needed to confirm with a, "Yes" and I would've been relieved.

Instead he was saying, we are evaluating, we monitor what the enemy acquires, we are working on indigenous programs, we will enhance capacity, we are taking necessary steps.

This tension and uncertainty not knowing whether the production of JF-17 Thunders for PAF has now been or will be capped due to J-10s is not helpful.

I don't think that it matters that much to update civvies on everything. And also, it is not related in any means whether Thunder is or will be capped. For all your such kind of questions; you will have to keep reading and see how the developments come forward. You can't get everything on platter my friend. Stay tuned and keep reading.

Whatever he says, was due to the SOPs and norms of secrecy that yet need to be maintained for internal reasons. What do you think that he wasn't sure of anything or nothing? But there are means & reasons as what to be told and how few things should kept for later.
When we are in England do they change the language for us? My point was we should be proud of urdu and speak in urdu. If that puts international media at a disadvantage so be it. They are not our friends anyways

تنقید برائے تنقید
 
ISPR response to the question is exactly as expected. No boosting, no drum beating.. The politicians like Shiekh Rasheed unnecessarily hyped it, also mentioning Rafale was totally unnecessary.

So ISPR is just telling the nation, its just another acquisition, its not extra ordinary in magnitude. Having already block 52s and block IIIs the J-10s will further add to our strength. We have had various extra ordinary defence projects which had much more impact in the past like. For-example, the first time Pakistan conducted test of IRBM test in 1998. Gave us the reach and capability that was completely absent before. The cruise missile technology was another capability addition, The JF-project was extra ordinary at time when there were sanctions and none of PAF aircrafts had BVR capability. The AEW&Cs provided massive capabilities.. It doesn't mean J-10C is ordinary aircraft. Its 4++ with AESA / great payloads / performances and is another step to boost our already in place capabilities and will further supplement the advance fleet of PAF F-16 block 52's and upcoming JF block IIIs.

I think the event got extra hype because of statements as in response to Rafale. In reality, in a full scale war, no one can manage 100% which aircrafts will be facing off which ones. At times the JF-17s could be facing Rafales, at times our Block 52s will be feasting upon mig-29s, or J-10s could face other older platforms of IAF. So adding another platform is not specifically to counter only 1 platform of opponent. It always add overall capabilities to the force.
 
ISPR response to the question is exactly as expected. No boosting, no drum beating.. The politicians like Shiekh Rasheed unnecessarily hyped it, also mentioning Rafale was totally unnecessary.

We don't know, whether "Sheeda Tully" did it, on his own, or was instructed to do so.
 
May be, he is less informed than Sheikh Sahib. :lol:
I have always felt that DG ISPR should be a civilian employee of the defense dept. A person well versed in the science of PR and knows the value of the social media etc.
It is a terrible waste of military resources to have a person of a rank of Maj gen to be doing pr for the armed forces. Let him lead the troops, that's what he is trained to do. Besides this present ispr spokesperson is a dud.
Which makes me wonder what qualifies as an abnormal acquistion?
The one where kickbacks are involved. Hope it helps.
 
I have always felt that DG ISPR should be a civilian employee of the defense dept. A person well versed in the science of PR and knows the value of the social media etc.
It is a terrible waste of military resources to have a person of a rank of Maj gen to be doing pr for the armed forces. Let him lead the troops, that's what he is trained to do. Besides this present ispr spokesperson is a dud.

The one where kickbacks are involved. Hope it helps.

Strangely, after operation Swift Retort, the Indians were complaining that they needed a DG ISPR level position for information dissemination and control. They felt that such a role was important in projecting single narratives around the war.

I see the merits of a civilian control over the DG ISPR, but I also think it should be left to the military to tell their story. Unless the fundamental military-civil divide in Pakistan is resolved, it is meaningless to attempt such a pivot. In fact, even after this military-civil divide is addressed, the position of DG ISPR should remain with the military. My only concern is that the DG ISPR, just like the ISI and the Chairman Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee, has turned into an army domain where the navy and Air Force have no say. Due to the evolving nature of the modern war, I think the Air Force and navy should be given their due respect. The era of vast armies rolling into enemy territory are over. Today it is about air and naval projections.

Pakistan’s understanding of the military hierarchy should also evolve. In fact, such an evolution will go a long way in resolving the military-civil divide itself, and probably help create a more professional, depoliticized and result oriented army instead of the current DHA land grabbing mafia and egotistical overlords they have now turned into.
 
He is suggesting for Naval role. Until and Unless Russia has agreed to put AESA radar in SU 35 along with other features, not happening. Also our induction of twin seater jet for Navy would be purely based on whether Indian Navy chooses F-18 BLOCK III or not. If they do then either J-15 or SU-35 if Russia agrees to put AESA can't be ruled out.
Putting a Russian AESA in the Su-35 shouldn't be a big deal but I believe the the major learning curve and possible hinderances would be the induction of a twin engined fighter, developing new doctrines around it and the whole saga of maintenance, spares, logistics, training of pilots & ground crew etc, affordability being expensive and ensuring availability as everyone is aware of the availability rates for Russian hardware

Even for the MKI, we were only able to bring it up after we started producing many of those spares locally. As for IN opting the F-18, that's an unlikely possibility and is all speculation since we're well aware of the issues pak or turks have faced if we're not in the good graces of Uncle Sam. IAF infact received some of the most extremely favorable terms for F-16s' localized production but it was still a no-go. IN is satisfied with the current Mig-29Ks' for now and until MoD approves a 3rd carrier, they're unlikely to push for another fighter and wait for the TEDBF. Even if they do, Rafale-M has a better chance to maintain commonality and uniformity with IAF with the later potentially ordering another 36 Rafales
 
Strangely, after operation Swift Retort, the Indians were complaining that they needed a DG ISPR level position for information dissemination and control. They felt that such a role was important in projecting single narratives around the war.

I see the merits of a civilian control over the DG ISPR, but I also think it should be left to the military to tell their story. Unless the fundamental military-civil divide in Pakistan is resolved, it is meaningless to attempt such a pivot. In fact, even after this military-civil divide is addressed, the position of DG ISPR should remain with the military. My only concern is that the DG ISPR, just like the ISI and the Chairman Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee, has turned into an army domain where the navy and Air Force have no say. Due to the evolving nature of the modern war, I think the Air Force and navy should be given their due respect. The era of vast armies rolling into enemy territory are over. Today it is about air and naval projections.

Pakistan’s understanding of the military hierarchy should also evolve. In fact, such an evolution will go a long way in resolving the military-civil divide itself, and probably help create a more professional, depoliticized and result oriented army instead of the current DHA land grabbing mafia and egotistical overlords they have now turned into.
You raise valid points. Just like the cjcsc post automatically goes to the army. It needs to be made rotational. The ispr spokesperson should be a junior officer. A maj gen should have better things to do than to address the news media.
Haaretz published an article about J10C being Israeli technology based on their Lavi combat aircraft which was scrapped under American pressure in mid 1980s.

Does anyone else here know more details?

Article reference: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ha...d-on-scrapped-israeli-lavi-fighter-1.10510613
Zionists got a lot of nerve calling it their technology. It was US funded project, in collaboration with US firms. US shut it down because it was US tax payer money illegally being used to create a competitor to the US fighters. China has taken the basic design a lot further and with improvements to hardware etc. It is not a lavi anymore.
 

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