Z-10 & Z-19 Combat Helicopter News & Discussion

[Beast]

No, the PLA does not have to report to me but it surely does not report to You either ?
In contrast to You however I never said I know everything and I even admit my mistakes, faults and errors, but not everything that is not confirmed has not necessarily to be true only since YOU want so.
So by that logic, the Chinese were already on Mars, but they simply did not report to us.

In reverse, may I remind You on all of @beasts claims his year ... and then let's do a fact-check?

- J-10B + AL-31FN is never operational
- J-20 uses WS-10G
- Y-20 uses WS-18
- Y-20 will be take part on Aviadarts exercise with Russia
- China will never purchase any Russian engines any more
- ...

Shall I continue ??

You claimed J-15 never uses use high thrust AL-31 FM3 series engine but when I challenged you on J-20, you suddenly flip flop and claim AL-31FM3 series engine suddenly exported to J-20. Use twisted theory just to suit your agenda!

You claim aerospace knowledge author who enjoy close ties with PLAAF report of 135 L-15 in service is by Deino who later rejected yourself? So you admit or reject? Why are you flip flopping repeatly?

Y-20 uses WS-18, do you have prove to rebuke it?

J-20 uses definitely not AL-31 engine. Just becos, one external petal looks like mean it is? Then HQ-2J missile looks like Russia SA-7, so inside is all the same component of SA-7 and is actually a SA-7?

 

[Deino]

Ohhh @Beast again ... reading is not Your virtue !? Isn't it?

1. You claimed J-15 never uses use high thrust AL-31 FM3 series engine but when I challenged you on J-20, you suddenly flip flop and claim AL-31FM3 series engine suddenly exported to J-20. Use twisted theory just to suit your agenda!

2. You claim aerospace knowledge author who enjoy close ties with PLAAF report of 135 L-15 in service is by Deino who later rejected yourself? So you admit or reject? Why are you flip flopping repeatly?

3. Y-20 uses WS-18, do you have prove to rebuke it?

4. J-20 uses definitely not AL-31 engine. Just becos, one external petal looks like mean it is? Then HQ-2J missile looks like Russia SA-7, so inside is all the same component of SA-7 and is actually a SA-7?

Just in short since it is off-topic:

1. I never claimed the J-15 uses an FM3 - that was You - and also, following this new theory (which in fact was not mine but from a Big Shrimp ! if You remember correctly) it is uses an FM-2-bsed design. Any way good weather in Germany does not mean good weather in China, so an FM2 on the J-20 is irrelevant to a standard F on the J-15.

The issue again is simply: for the J-20's MF2-connection, there's a report, rumours ... but for the WZ-16 operational or the FM3 used by the J-15 not.

2. again wrong: The fact that I published so far two reports on Aerospace Knowledge does not mean I'm responsible or related to the author who claimed 135 JL-10s are already delivered.

3. again like the China-on-Mars-theory: Do You have proof that it uses ?? All reports - even from AVIC - say it uses an "imported" engine.

4. And this latest report from that Big shrimp - surely much, much more reliable than me - is wrong ?? But You are surely correct: Chinese engineers made the WS-10GX-37's pedals look exactly like an AL-31FN only to fool the stupid foreigners.


By the way, concerning Your reliability:
https://defence.pk/threads/chengdu-j-10-fc-20-multirole-fighter-air-craft.3218/page-542#post-8853360


But I will make it short: I will from now on immediately delete each and every stupid post from You that simply claims anything without a proof ! If You say: "That is my opinion based on this and that rumour", then it's fine ... since so it is not a fact.

Even more each and every blatant lie from You, any personnel accusations in regard to other opinions´s, other nationalities especially if baked with a source and bashing will immediately be rated as a negative rating.

I think in mind of You history here I need to keep it simple for You.

Deino

And now back to the Z-10 ....give any proof or at least report that it uses the claimed high-power WZ-16 already or shut up.

 

[cirr]

A photo of great interest taken on 25.10.2016 at AVIC Changhe

21 Academicians of Chinese Academy of Engineering

Taking a site visit

 

[grey boy 2]

 

[yusheng]

 

[muhammadali233]

View attachment 352547 View attachment 352548 View attachment 352549 View attachment 352550

The main difference i can spot between PAA Zulu's and Chinese Zulu's is that the PLAA's zulus don't have the Armour tub for pilot protection and secondly PLAA's zulus is not fielding HMDS,at least in the pics posted above.

 

[cirr]

A batch of new aircrafts, including a helicopter that exceeds the Z-10 by a large margin in terms of complexity and sophistication, will make their debuts in 2017 and/or 2018

http://digitalpaper.stdaily.com/ ... t_355528.htm?div=-1

Being an article about matters of great significance, the info on new aircrafts was mentioned in passing only at the very end.

 

[Akasa]

A batch of new aircrafts, including a helicopter that exceeds the Z-10 by a large margin in terms of complexity and sophistication, will make their debuts in 2017 and/or 2018

http://digitalpaper.stdaily.com/ ... t_355528.htm?div=-1

Being an article about matters of great significance, the info on new aircrafts was mentioned in passing only at the very end.

What makes you think this new helicopter is a new gunship, especially the one said to enter service by 2020?

 

[Beast]

What makes you think this new helicopter is a new gunship, especially the one said to enter service by 2020?

Becos we can read Chinese article and you cannot. The last sentence mention that.

 

[cirr]

Becos we can read Chinese article and you cannot. The last sentence mention that.

 

[Beast]

What makes you think this new helicopter is a new gunship, especially the one said to enter service by 2020?

I suggest you all who don't understand Chinese or can't speak Chinese show some respect to cirr. I have stay in PDF for quite a few years and see his contribution to PDF by translating many Chinese article accurately for non Chinese speaking members to share from some highly credible Chinese speaking forum. Many of his translation is spot on like 055 cruiser and LRIP J-20.

Instead of using those rude tone and skeptical view to question his translation. Please use 'please' or 'would you mind share where is your source?' to ask or verify with him. Cirr is a highly valuable contributor to PDF Chinese defense section. Unless you all know Chinese, if you do not know. You are not qualify to question his contribution of translation in PDF.

@cirr @ChineseTiger1986

 

[grey boy 2]

Z-10 compared to Z-10K (从正面看Z-10与Z-10K差异不大，二者均配备了新型23mm航炮，只是Z-10K着迷彩涂装，机头两侧雷达告警天线下方的盒状多普勒导弹逼近告警天线被取消。另外Z-10K携挂的新型19管70mm火箭发射巢（类似米军的M261）也较引人注目。)

 

[Deino]

I suggest you all who don't understand Chinese or can't speak Chinese show some respect to cirr. I have stay in PDF for quite a few years and see his contribution to PDF by translating many Chinese article accurately for non Chinese speaking members to share from some highly credible Chinese speaking forum. Many of his translation is spot on like 055 cruiser and LRIP J-20.

Instead of using those rude tone and skeptical view to question his translation. Please use 'please' or 'would you mind share where is your source?' to ask or verify with him. Cirr is a highly valuable contributor to PDF Chinese defense section. Unless you all know Chinese, if you do not know. You are not qualify to question his contribution of translation in PDF.

@cirr @ChineseTiger1986

Why do You took this as offence against cirr ??
IMO it was a plain a simple question surely not connected with the humble You prefer like 'please' or 'would you mind to share your source?" ... but honestly, since You never use such words nor show such a politeness or courtesy especially against members who cannot read Chinese, since You barely give any sources or add Your claims with phrases like "IMO", "I think that" or "based on the info I have via..." I'm indeed surprised.


Deino

 

[Beast]

Why do You took this as offence against cirr ??
IMO it was a plain a simple question surely not connected with the humble You prefer like 'please' or 'would you mind to share your source?" ... but honestly, since You never use such words nor show such a politeness or courtesy especially against members who cannot read Chinese, since You barely give any sources or add Your claims with phrases like "IMO", "I think that" or "based on the info I have via..." I'm indeed surprised.


Deino

it will depend whether that person earn the respect. We have been watching Chinese military development for years and not based on just one conclusion or just started. We watch PLA grow from a 80s armed forces into a sophisticated 3G modern armed that can fought from deep sea to outer space. We have watch Chinese military hardware from buying Israel harpy drone to nowadays exporting fully autonomous large payload long endurance CH-5 UCAV that is sought by many countries.

We watched countless video including many direct interview of the chief designers of the project. Or even director of CASIC, AVIC, Shenyang and Hongdu or even NORINCO. If you think director , high ranking official or chief designer of those hardware words are not credible or simply just becos they are not speaking English that makes their word not credible. Clearly a racist agenda is present. How many Chinese words do you understand from Yang wei or Wu Ximing interview? Zero.

The possibilities are draw from these little clues and info slowly string up. Not based on just hearsay or Tom dick Harry sources.

You foreigner are simply too ignorant on all these. And insists everything need to base on English sources and article to prove it's credibility. I simply find that a joke!

 

[Deino]

it will depend whether that person earn the respect. We have been watching Chinese military development for years and not based on just one conclusion or just started. We watch PLA grow from a 80s armed forces into a sophisticated 3G modern armed that can fought from deep sea to outer space. We have watch Chinese military hardware from buying Israel harpy drone to nowadays exporting fully autonomous large payload long endurance CH-5 UCAV that is sought by many countries.

We watched countless video including many direct interview of the chief designers of the project. Or even director of CASIC, AVIC, Shenyang and Hongdu or even NORINCO. If you think director , high ranking official or chief designer of those hardware words are not credible or simply just becos they are not speaking English that makes their word not credible. Clearly a racist agenda is present. How many Chinese words do you understand from Yang wei or Wu Ximing interview? Zero.

The possibilities are draw from these little clues and info slowly string up. Not based on just hearsay or Tom dick Harry sources.

You foreigner are simply too ignorant on all these. And insists everything need to base on English sources and article to prove it's credibility. I simply find that a joke!

We ?? .. or You ? May I ask how old are You, so to better judge who's watching Chinese military development for longer?

And again, the one who's arrogant is plain and simply You, since You again make false accusations and even if capable to READ Chinese, You often enough made so wrong claims that it seems YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND what You read.

By the way - Your next major mistake - I (or we like You say) do not rely on Western or English sources, but indeed on Chinese ones, which were kindly translated by some very honourable and respectful people here. So even if I don't have the original text at hand, I fully understand the meaning of such translated original sources.

As such You are correct: One has to earn his reputation and others respect ... but the one is surely not You.