Why are Muslim nations behind the West and the Far East?

[FuturePAF]

Yes, I am not saying to conquer Afghanistan. I am saying lets unite with them to form a more powerful country.
Yes I too want to see development in Afghanistan. Their people deserve it now.

But most of them don’t want to be united with us. The best we can hope for is a productive relationship, and to develop our Pashtun majority areas, to create an alternative governance example. Over the next 2-3 generations (which is only 40-60 years considering the average age of marriage in Afghanistan) the culture of KPK will influence Afghanistan, not least because of the larger Pashtun population in Pakistan.

This is also why we need IK back in power. Cultural and governance changes under his (not just his party, but him particularly) premiership can set a new trends in motion.

For example, if we spend more on education, ensuring all boys and girls are in school throughout Pakistan, and even illiterate adults (men and women) are getting a well rounded education so that they are better in farming or skilled labor, it will set the benchmark, the Afghans will have to meet.

For the time being, for at least the next 5-10 years, we need to be conservative with foreign policy and focus on our domestic reforms. Once we are on track, we will be able to “walk and chew gum” at the same time.

Malaysia and Brunei are quite developed as well.

They are integrated into the global economy to a greater extent than we are, and have avoided foreign policy problems. This is why our primary foreign policy /security policy issue of Kashmir has to be fought using more lawfare and economic development than defense spending. At the very least; 1. With a larger economy we will be able to buy technology and arms when and if we need it. 2. The people we are trying to win over will know they will be struggling to join a prosperous and just society.

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

But most of them don’t want to be united with us. The best we can hope for is a productive relationship, and to develop our Pashtun majority areas, to create an alternative governance example. Over the next 2-3 generations (which is only 40-60 years considering the average age of marriage in Afghanistan) the culture of KPK will influence Afghanistan, not least because of the larger Pashtun population in Pakistan.

This is also why we need IK back in power. Cultural and governance changes under his (not just his party, but him particularly) premiership can set a new trends in motion.

For example, if we spend more on education, ensuring all boys and girls are in school throughout Pakistan, and even illiterate adults (men and women) are getting a well rounded education so that they are better in farming or skilled labor, it will set the benchmark, the Afghans will have to meet.

For the time being, for at least the next 5-10 years, we need to be conservative with foreign policy and focus on our domestic reforms. Once we are on track, we will be able to “walk and chew gum” at the same time.


They are integrated into the global economy to a greater extent than we are, and have avoided foreign policy problems. This is why our primary foreign policy /security policy issue of Kashmir has to be fought using more lawfare and economic development than defense spending. At the very least; 1. With a larger economy we will be able to buy technology and arms when and if we need it. 2. The people we are trying to win over will know they will be struggling to join a prosperous and just society.

Yes, but I have talked to many Afghanistani people, they see Pakistan favourably.

 

[FuturePAF]

Yes, but I have talked to many Afghanistani people, they see Pakistan favourably.

That goodwill should not be taken for granted and needs to be build upon.

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

That goodwill should not be taken for granted and needs to be build upon.

True, that is why I do not mind Afghanistanis in Pakistan and giving them dual citizenship or sole citizenship as well.

 

[FuturePAF]

True, that is why I do not mind Afghanistanis in Pakistan and giving them dual citizenship or sole citizenship as well.

43/44 years after the Soviet invasion, Afghans have defacto benefits of citizenship in Pakistan, but that doesn’t mean it should be formalized without safeguards. Ease of travel and identity papers are fine but many Pakistanis would want to ensuring Pakistan and Pakistanis benefits from the relationship as well.

Btw, the Afghans already educate their young children, but Pakistan getting its act together will raise the expectations in Afghanistan, due in large part to the movement of people. Pakistan is the most cultural influential country vis a vi Afghanistan, but that doesn’t mean it can be impose. It has to be by osmosis and over time.

Another characteristic successful nation share is they have stable borders and have neighbors that are also interested in economics and human development.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1660685786948202496

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

43/44 years after the Soviet invasion, Afghans have defacto benefits of citizenship in Pakistan, but that doesn’t mean it should be formalized without safeguards. Ease of travel and identity papers are fine but many Pakistanis would want to ensuring Pakistan and Pakistanis benefits from the relationship as well.

Btw, the Afghans already educate their young children, but Pakistan getting its act together will raise the expectations in Afghanistan, due in large part to the movement of people. Pakistan is the most cultural influential country vis a vi Afghanistan, but that doesn’t mean it can be impose. It has to be by osmosis and over time.

Another characteristic successful nation share is they have stable borders and have neighbors that are also interested in economics and human development.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1660685786948202496

Agreed, that Pakistan must benefit as well. Pakistan has the largest population of Pathans, Karachi having the most of them. While Afghanistan Pathans make up 75% of the country. We have every to claim Afghanistan as our own.

 

[FuturePAF]

We have every to claim Afghanistan as our own.

America has the power to claim Mexico, but should it? This is something else prosperous nations don’t do.

In Game theory there are finite games and infinite games. Claiming territory is a finite goal, what then? While Afghans make fighting anyone that “claims” them their way of life.

Let’s just say, we need to maintain and deepen a mutual beneficial relationship. Talk of claiming territory will rile up ethnic-nationalists to claim the land up to the Indus/Attock as part of Afghanistan. Better to let the Durand line become in one way culturally accepted and as well as irrelevant as national borders have become in the EU.

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

America has the power to claim Mexico, but should it? This is something else prosperous nations don’t do.

In Game theory there are finite games and infinite games. Claiming territory is a finite goal, what then? While Afghans make fighting anyone that “claims” them their way of life.

Let’s just say, we need to maintain and deepen a mutual beneficial relationship. Talk of claiming territory will rile up ethnic-nationalists to claim the land up to the Indus/Attock as part of Afghanistan. Better to let the Durand line become in one way culturally accepted and as well as irrelevant as national borders have become in the EU.

Yes but Mexicans are mostly Spanish speaking and Catholics, while Americans are mostly Protestant and Lutheran and speak English. You can't compare.

You comparing apples and oranges, bro.

 

[FuturePAF]

Yes but Mexicans are mostly Spanish speaking and Catholics, while Americans are mostly Protestant and Lutheran and speak English. You can't compare.

You comparing apples and oranges, bro.

The American population, more so than perhaps any other nation is not a monolithic, not by a long shot. Many of the border regions are populated by Mexicans or their descendants. I spend a lot of my day speaking Spanish, and that is becoming more and more a reality for many Americans.

As for religion, most people aren’t “practicing” either, and Latinos have one of the highest rates of intermarriage.

America has a way of assimilating immigrants or their descendants eventually, to one degree or another. Another characteristic of a successful and prosperous society.

 

[Hellfire2006]

Look i wanted to be diplomatic before, but Iran is the best, top #1 among the whole muslim countries, sorry to say you. Iran is the only country US army fears on the region, to put it simple,folks can say whatever...but it is.

And about Turkiyeh being secular i think it s a flaw you have reason here on my view, but i think next generation of turkiyesh leadership wants to change this. We will see.

How's being secular bad ? Without it turkey would just become a complete copy of Pakistan

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

The American population, more so than perhaps any other nation is not a monolithic, not by a long shot. Many of the border regions are populated by Mexicans or their descendants. I spend a lot of my day speaking Spanish, and that is becoming more and more a reality for many Americans.

As for religion, most people aren’t “practicing” either, and Latinos have one of the highest rates of intermarriage.

America has a way of assimilating immigrants or their descendants eventually, to one degree or another. Another characteristic of a successful and prosperous society.

View attachment 931140

Yes, but Pakistanis and Afghanistanis have more in common, than say USA and Mexico.

 

[MMM-E]

Turkiye has one of the best Naval Industry in the World




Turkish shipbuilding industry

The number of shipyards has risen from 37 to 83 in Turkey between 2003 and 2020
Turkey has 585 places for boat production, with a capacity to produce 700,000 tons of steel every year and to build 4.5 million deadweight tons of ships


there are 34 Freight and Container Ships ( 1,6 million DWT ) orders to Turkish shipyards from worldwide ... ( Turkiye ranks 4th after China,S.Korea and Japan )


Turkiye produce Ships up to 300 m
Turkish RMK Marine built 7,000 dwt Chemical Tanker fot The UK

Turkish Kuzey Star Shipyard built Russia's first LNG-powered RO-RO Ship for FSUE Rosmorport in Tuzla, Istanbul
The 200 m long Ship named Marshal Rokossovsky

Khan Class Powerships are 300 meters long and 50 meters wide with a capacity of 470 MW

240 m Shark Class Powerships, with a maximum capacity of 240 MW, are designed with the highest technology.

Karpowership | Home

karpowership.com

Seismic Vessel

and It is a little known fact that Turkey ranks 4th among the world’s luxury yacht producers with 10% of the large yacht production

Turkiye produce its own Warships

Patrol Boat
Fast attack Missile Boat
Corvette
Frigate
Offshore Patrol Vessel
LCT
LST
Submarine Rescue Mother Ship (MOSHIP)
Sea Supply Combat Support Ship

Under development
-- TF-2000 class Destroyer
-- MILDEN class AIP Submarine

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

Turkiye has one of the best Naval Industry in the World




Turkish shipbuilding industry

The number of shipyards has risen from 37 to 83 in Turkey between 2003 and 2020
Turkey has 585 places for boat production, with a capacity to produce 700,000 tons of steel every year and to build 4.5 million deadweight tons of ships


there are 34 Freight and Container Ships ( 1,6 million DWT ) orders to Turkish shipyards from worldwide ... ( Turkiye ranks 4th after China,S.Korea and Japan )


Turkiye produce Ships up to 300 m
Turkish RMK Marine built 7,000 dwt Chemical Tanker fot The UK

Turkish Kuzey Star Shipyard built Russia's first LNG-powered RO-RO Ship for FSUE Rosmorport in Tuzla, Istanbul
The 200 m long Ship named Marshal Rokossovsky

View attachment 931141


Khan Class Powerships are 300 meters long and 50 meters wide with a capacity of 470 MW

240 m Shark Class Powerships, with a maximum capacity of 240 MW, are designed with the highest technology.
View attachment 931146
View attachment 931143

Karpowership | Home

karpowership.com

Seismic Vessel
View attachment 931152


and It is a little known fact that Turkey ranks 4th among the world’s luxury yacht producers with 10% of the large yacht production

Turkiye produce its own Warships

Patrol Boat
Fast attack Missile Boat
Corvette
Frigate
LCT
LST
Submarine Rescue Mother Ship (MOSHIP)
Sea Supply Combat Support Ship

Under development
-- TF-2000 class Destroyer
-- MILDEN class AIP Submarine

View attachment 931151
View attachment 931148
View attachment 931149
View attachment 931150

Mash'Allah, these are good achievements. May Turkey prosper.

 

[MMM-E]

How's being secular bad ? Without it turkey would just become a complete copy of Pakistan

Super Power Ottoman Empire was not secular

Mash'Allah, these are good achievements. May Turkey prosper.

Turkiye built Ships for Pakistan , Indonesia , Turkmenistan , Qatar , Ukraine and India

The deliveries of 4 Corvettes will be completed by 2025 for the Pakistan Navy

Turkiye built 16.400 tons Tanker for the Pakistan Navy

Turkish shipbuilders to build 5 fleet support Vessels for the Indian Navy ( $2.3 billion )
The 230-meter Ships with a displacement of 45,000 tons can carry fuel and other supplies for warships

 

[Indos]

Super Power Ottoman Empire was not secular




Turkiye built Ships for Pakistan , Indonesia , Turkmenistan , Qatar , Ukraine and India

The deliveries of 4 Corvettes will be completed by 2025 for the Pakistan Navy

Turkiye built 16.400 tons Tanker for the Pakistan Navy

Turkish shipbuilders to build 5 fleet support Vessels for the Indian Navy ( $2.3 billion )
The 230-meter Ships with a displacement of 45,000 tons can carry fuel and other supplies for warships

Dude, our defense minister plan to order Fast Attack Ship from Turkey is not materialized as I have long predicted since we can make similar ship ( KCR 40 and KCR 60 ) and even we have built Stealthy one. Our planning minister and finance minister dont approve the acquisition