Whats Wrong with ISPR Press release emphasizing "BETTER GOVERNANCE" from Political Leadership

[Mrc]

Oh come on dude.
It was a military dictator who surrendered pakistan before uncle sam and drag pakistan in to this terrorism fiasco.

Army for ages and ages have patronized the talibans, lashkars and sipahs in Pakistan, who have killed thousand of Pakistanis.

Army used its non state actors in fata areas to settle scores with usa, india and northern alliance in Afghanistan.

And stop giving examples of dog dying due to hunger, in todays pakistani civil military tug of war.

I am really sory but For me people sleeping hungry in my country are important than shouting zinda hay bhutto zinda hay.....

 

[Mrc]

Jis din bhutto maray ga us din is kaum nay zinda hona hay.....

 

[truthseer]

Troops that didn't even acknowledge their dead

Give me Zardari and Nawaz any day

Jis din bhutto maray ga us din is kaum nay zinda hona hay.....

Bhutto kabhi nhi marna, humei khoon yad rhe ga

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

What I think is stopping the elected leadership is exactly what stopped Army to regard the constitution, power it grants and the responsibility it places.

The Army leadership supports the implementation of NAP reforms - so what exactly is preventing the elected representatives from implementing the reforms?

Expecting a donkey to pull one's cart one fine day in spring when one has starved it nearly to death all winter is silly, and then pretending that it is only a light cart is sillier still, and then kicking it when it is down is downright cruel.

That's a rather meaningless statement - what tangible roadblock is preventing the current elected leadership from implementing NAP reforms that have overwhelming military, media and public support?

Bhutto kabhi nhi marna, humei khoon yad rhe ga

Bhutto laid the foundations of the intolerance and bigotry now codified in Pakistan's constitution - his depraved and indefensible actions of codifying second class status for Ahmadis and the destruction of the private sector and economy through nationalization.

You are correct, he isn't dead, because his legacy of intolerance, discrimination and economic damage continues to be felt till this day.

 

[SamantK]

The Army leadership supports the implementation of NAP reforms - so what exactly is preventing the elected representatives from implementing the reforms?


That's a rather meaningless statement - what tangible roadblock is preventing the current elected leadership from implementing NAP reforms that have overwhelming military, media and public support?


Bhutto laid the foundations of the intolerance and bigotry now codified in Pakistan's constitution - his depraved and indefensible actions of codifying second class status for Ahmadis and the destruction of the private sector and economy through nationalization.

You are correct, he isn't dead, because his legacy of intolerance, discrimination and economic damage continues to be felt till this day.

Let me repeat, complete disregard for the constitution and the responsibility it places on the government.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Sir, good governance will take decades to develop if we start now. And we have not even started to do so.

That's the point behind the current criticism of the elected governments - we're not expecting overnight resolution of all issues plaguing the country, but at the very least expectations of action on the 'low hanging fruit', such as implementation of reforms outlined under the NAP, are justified.

Let me repeat, complete disregard for the constitution and the responsibility it places on the government.

First and foremost, given the subject of the thread, why is the elected government not acting to implement reforms outlined under the NAP, that have overwhelming military, media and public support? What specifically is preventing them from implementing these reforms?

 

[VCheng]

That's a rather meaningless statement - what tangible roadblock is preventing the current elected leadership from implementing NAP reforms that have overwhelming military, media and public support?

The mechanisms that could implement the NAP simply do not exist in effective forms anymore, given their long starvation, so the analogy I drew is very apt.

That's the point behind the current criticism of the elected governments - we're not expecting overnight resolution of all issues plaguing the country, but at the very least expectations of action on the 'low hanging fruit', such as implementation of reforms outlined under the NAP, are justified.

Sir, NAP is no low hanging fruit. Consider that countries with good governance have huge issues with security and terrorism, and one can see that it is quite unfair to expect the Pakistani civil government to suddenly wake up from its coma and serve its overlords what they demand, only to be stunned back to another coma after it has done what is being demanded of it. See, it simply cannot work out that way.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

The mechanisms that could implement the NAP simply do not exist in effective forms anymore, given their long starvation, so the analogy I drew is very apt.

What 'mechanisms' specifically? Committee and technical-expert proposals on what needs to be done have been documented, multiple times, so a lack of detail is certainly not missing. These proposals need to be debated in parliament, additional feedback from technical experts obtained on any changes desired by law makers, and laws passed to provide any required legal cover for implementation.

What's preventing elected representatives from doing so?

A law to crack down on cyber crime and terror financing has been pending with parliament for a while now, and the only thing that appears to be happening with it (based on the commentary of journalists quoting experts reviewing it) is that the original intent, as proposed by the technical experts, is being cut out, and in its current form it looks more like a law against freedom of speech of the average citizen, designed to protect politicians.

 

[I M Sikander]

I am really sory but For me people sleeping hungry in my country are important than shouting zinda hay bhutto zinda hay.....

And for me people of pakistan are important then strategic depth nonsense policy that has destroyed pakistan and its social fabric.

 

[I M Sikander]

The Army leadership supports the implementation of NAP reforms - so what exactly is preventing the elected representatives from implementing the reforms?


That's a rather meaningless statement - what tangible roadblock is preventing the current elected leadership from implementing NAP reforms that have overwhelming military, media and public support?


Bhutto laid the foundations of the intolerance and bigotry now codified in Pakistan's constitution - his depraved and indefensible actions of codifying second class status for Ahmadis and the destruction of the private sector and economy through nationalization.

You are correct, he isn't dead, because his legacy of intolerance, discrimination and economic damage continues to be felt till this day.

Vow so you are putting all the zia crimes in ZA bhutto pocket.

Go and learn some history.

 

[VCheng]

What 'mechanisms' specifically? Committee and technical-expert proposals on what needs to be done have been documented, multiple times, so a lack of detail is certainly not missing. These proposals need to be debated in parliament, additional feedback from technical experts obtained on any changes desired by law makers, and laws passed to provide any required legal cover for implementation.

What's preventing elected representatives from doing so?

A law to crack down on cyber crime and terror financing has been pending with parliament for a while now, and the only thing that appears to be happening with it (based on the commentary of journalists quoting experts reviewing it) is that the original intent, as proposed by the technical experts, is being cut out, and in its current form it looks more like a law against freedom of speech of the average citizen, designed to protect politicians.

Sir, please keep in mind that the real test of governance is not passing laws but effectively implementing them. What you describe above is simply another proverbial rearranging of the deck chairs on a certain ship. Can you really say that any decision or law can be implemented in Pakistan these days? Please be honest here.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Vow so you are putting all the zia crimes in ZA bhutto pocket.

Go and learn some history.

Did Bhutto not turn Ahmadi's into second class citizens?

Did Bhutto not nationalize major private sector concerns?

 

[Mrc]

And for me people of pakistan are important then strategic depth nonsense policy that has destroyed pakistan and its social fabric.

Well actually no....
For some people dead criminals are more important than starving children

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Sir, please keep in mind that the real test of governance is not passing laws but effectively implementing them. What you describe above is simply another proverbial rearranging of the deck chairs on a certain ship. Can you really say that any decision or law can be implemented in Pakistan these days? Please be honest here.

I agree, implementation is much harder, because implementation requires coordination between political leadership, bureaucrats and specific institutions (and coordination within an institution at various levels).

However, we can't even focus on the implementation phase if we don't have the legislation passed. And with respect to 'lack of implementation' I'll reiterate what I said earlier - we can't given the elected leadership a pass and refuse to criticize their inability to implement for 'the next several election cycles'. Their inability to implement MUST be criticized, while simultaneously also making clear that unconstitutional changes in government are unacceptable.

 

[VCheng]

I agree, implementation is much harder, because implementation requires coordination between political leadership, bureaucrats and specific institutions (and coordination within an institution at various levels).

However, we can't even focus on the implementation phase if we don't have the legislation passed. And with respect to 'lack of implementation' I'll reiterate what I said earlier - we can't given the elected leadership a pass and refuse to criticize their inability to implement for 'the next several election cycles'. Their inability to implement MUST be criticized, while simultaneously also making clear that unconstitutional changes in government are unacceptable.

Like I said before Sir, this donkey is in no shape ready to pull the cart being hitched to it. And it wont be ready for a long time yet. Being kicked when it needs nurturing is not going to help that recovery, either.