what will Vietnam be-----Asia Ukraine?

[Viet]

Thank you man!
But do you read newspaper daily? Many big projects of our nation are belong to China company. Almost of our agricultural products are exported to China, bla bla...
I have a dream, but not a daydream.

No, chinese investments account for about 1% of FDI. it is virtually non-existent.
yes, there are some increase of chinese investments recently, but the level is low if compared to for example singapore.
Yes, a lot of Taiwanese companies operating in VN employ ten thousands of chinese workers because of cheap labor costs. they work mostly in constructions projects.
yes, we rely on cheap raw materials from china, such as fabrics for garment products.
yes, we export a lot to china for example agriproducts such as rice and fish, and now more electronic components.
we suffer a huge deficit in bilateral trades. if trades come to a standstill, chinese would lose more.
yes, we benefit from chinese tourism.

the overall picture is the dependence on chinese investment and trade exists, but not like we won´t survive if chinese close the border.

 

[vtnsx]

You need us for everything. You need our investments, our market, our technology. Viet men work for Chinese companies while we bang your women.

lol, did your father taught you to say that? I guess he worked for the Westerners and they banged ur mom right? You must felt the pain watching your mother getting raped by the westerners hey? I feel sorry for you buddy. Maybe you should jump off the bridge and commit suicide like the Chinese peeps that work for Apple.

 

[xesy]

You need us for everything. You need our investments, our market, our technology. Viet men work for Chinese companies while we bang your women.

What are you? A pussy? Leave the woman alone and fight like a man.

I was banging a Vietnamese girl a couple of weeks ago. I was dry humping her at her apartment while her dumb Vietnamese husband was working for a Chinese company.

You'll have to troll harder. Too bad I realize that after posting the above post.

 

[Viet]

The thing is, my story is something that actually happened.

The Vietnamese girl was introduced to me by a mutual friend and she took me back to her apartment, I realised her husband was working and I ended up banging her.

good for you

 

[Viet]

Viet friend, i know you love your country, love you people.
but Vietnam and China are there, i don't think you can get rid of China, today no county on this planet can get rid of China. and more over we have tangled for more than thousand years. we should find solutions that satisfy both countries, i believe we can.
don;t be so emotional, let the problems to these wiser leaders.

as everybody can see it: the vietnamese appeasement policy in the last 2 decades toward china has failed. you have seen our peaceful approach as weakness. you misuse your weight and power.
your oil rig provocation has damaged the relationship forever. even senior members of the communist party have realised it.

 

[William Hung]

I'll make some comments.

First, there are no real pro-china leaders in VCP. They have been purged long ago since the 70s. Even "pro-China" people like Nguyen Phu Trong are only, in Hilary Clinton's word to describe Australia in similar situation, DOUBLE-CROSSING. These "pro-China" leaders are not 100% sincere in having good relationship with China but only want to get as much benefits from both China AND US.

Both China and US are not stupid, they know when their "friend" double-cross them, or what I called earlier play the two-face game. Clinton openly rebuked Australia for doing it and China also did the same recently. But Viet members twist the story and spread lies that Vietnam was acting a good friend to China, why China act so harsh blah blah.

The truth is that China has finally spoken up about VN double-crossing game and their leaders got shocked. China said you either with us or you are against us. This is funny because the US also has the same attitude, either you're with us or you are against us, you want weapons and support from us? change your politics. So VN is check-mated. They taught they clever by double-crossing with the US and China but they lose at the end.

Now the legitimacy of the VCP, or any government, lies in their ability to develope the country and security. We've seen plenty of news that their economic reform is a FAILURE with underforming growth rates, huge public debt, bad data, etc. Simply, they've failed their target by a big margin. The only area left to prove themselves is the security of their country. But as the recent SCS dispute shows, they got exposed as impotent. On the one hand, they want to instigate the anti-China sentiment in the Viet civilians and promote the China-threat propaganda because this is their only place left to prove their legitimacy (and distraction from poor economy). But on the other hand, they got exposed as being weak and impotent against the China. The US tempted them to come on their side but the US won't fully support them until they change their politics, as usual. So now, its like they got check-mated. All those time playing the two-face game, and promoting anti-china sentiment, returned to kick them in the @ss.

The pro-US leaders don't have much to fear, because most of their friends and family are probably in powerful position in various state companies and industries. So if there is a revolution and a change of politics, they will do fine, because even the US can't just restructure those industry overnight. So these people, like Tan Dung, don't care about revolution and maybe welcome it. I also think that the military will also be safe because they have experiences and leadership and the US seem to have good relationship with them.

The leaders that are "pro-China", like Phu Trong, will lose the most because they probably have no more place after the revolution. They will lose their position and influences. So surely they don't want a revolution or change of politics. So this is why I think there is an internal conflict.

 

[ice bomb]

No, chinese investments account for about 1% of FDI. it is virtually non-existent.
yes, there are some increase of chinese investments recently, but the level is low if compared to for example singapore.
Yes, a lot of Taiwanese companies operating in VN employ ten thousands of chinese workers because of cheap labor costs. they work mostly in constructions projects.
yes, we rely on cheap raw materials from china, such as fabrics for garment products.
yes, we export a lot to china for example agriproducts such as rice and fish, and now more electronic components.
we suffer a huge deficit in bilateral trades. if trades come to a standstill, chinese would lose more.
yes, we benefit from chinese tourism.

the overall picture is the dependence on chinese investment and trade exists, but not like we won´t survive if chinese close the border.

It is not about your survival, but the fact that you need China more than she needs you.

After all it is a 1,3 billion market vs yours.

 

[JSCh]

Here comes voice of America,

Vietnam Defends Foreign Policy, China Ties

Vietnam Defends Foreign Policy, China Ties

Marianne Brown
July 31, 2014 1:15 PM

HANOI —
Vietnam said Thursday that its foreign policy is aimed at protecting the country’s independence. The comment follows a letter from prominent members of the Communist Party to the country’s top leaders calling for political and economic reforms to end the country’s “reliance” on China.

Vietnam’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs on Thursday defended Hanoi’s foreign policy following a question related to an open letter from prominent members of the Communist Party that urged the country to end its close relationship with China.

Speaking at a regular press briefing in the capital, spokesman Le Hai Binh said Vietnam’s current policy aims to “protect the independence, reliance and diversification” of international relations.

He said the implementation of Vietnam’s foreign policy has “greatly contributed to heightening the position of Vietnam on the global stage as well as contributing to the development and depiction of the country,” said Hai.
......

===========================================================


So far this letter is not making news in western media beside voice of America.

Once it did, it would give the impression that there is potential political trouble brewing in Vietnam, and Vietnam could kiss those FDI goodbye.

 

[Viet]

I'll make some comments.

First, there are no real pro-china leaders in VCP. They have been purged long ago since the 70s. Even "pro-China" people like Nguyen Phu Trong are only, in Hilary Clinton's word to describe Australia in similar situation, DOUBLE-CROSSING. These "pro-China" leaders are not 100% sincere in having good relationship with China but only want to get as much benefits from both China AND US.

Both China and US are not stupid, they know when their "friend" double-cross them, or what I called earlier play the two-face game. Clinton openly rebuked Australia for doing it and China also did the same recently. But Viet members twist the story and spread lies that Vietnam was acting a good friend to China, why China act so harsh blah blah.

The truth is that China has finally spoken up about VN double-crossing game and their leaders got shocked. China said you either with us or you are against us. This is funny because the US also has the same attitude, either you're with us or you are against us, you want weapons and support from us? change your politics. So VN is check-mated. They taught they clever by double-crossing with the US and China but they lose at the end.

Now the legitimacy of the VCP, or any government, lies in their ability to develope the country and security. We've seen plenty of news that their economic reform is a FAILURE with underforming growth rates, huge public debt, bad data, etc. Simply, they've failed their target by a big margin. The only area left to prove themselves is the security of their country. But as the recent SCS dispute shows, they got exposed as impotent. On the one hand, they want to instigate the anti-China sentiment in the Viet civilians and promote the China-threat propaganda because this is their only place left to prove their legitimacy (and distraction from poor economy). But on the other hand, they got exposed as being weak and impotent against the China. The US tempted them to come on their side but the US won't fully support them until they change their politics, as usual. So now, its like they got check-mated. All those time playing the two-face game, and promoting anti-china sentiment, returned to kick them in the @ss.

The pro-US leaders don't have much to fear, because most of their friends and family are probably in powerful position in various state companies and industries. So if there is a revolution and a change of politics, they will do fine, because even the US can't just restructure those industry overnight. So these people, like Tan Dung, don't care about revolution and maybe welcome it. I also think that the military will also be safe because they have experiences and leadership and the US seem to have good relationship with them.

The leaders that are "pro-China", like Phu Trong, will lose the most because they probably have no more place after the revolution. They will lose their position and influences. So surely they don't want a revolution or change of politics. So this is why I think there is an internal conflict.

BRAVO! great analysis...but it sucks.

following your logic, china plays a policy of double-crossing as well. chinese hate japanese but keep bilateral tradings. how about america? when china begins to stop everything wih uncle sam. if you haven´t noticed, we still have a non-aligment policy.

 

[Raphael]

This thread degenerated into the usual China v. Vietnam ruckus. Let's try to stay on topic.

I think the comparison between Ukraine and Vietnam is quite apt.

• Both countries are just buffer zones/rump states formed from leftover empires.
• Both countries are theaters of rivalry for great powers. They have little control over their own destinies.
• Both countries are beset by extreme internal ideological conflicts about who they should align with/lean towards. They both lack unity and national consciousness.
• Both countries are poor by the neighborhood's standards.
• Both countries are strategically important, which is why so much external attention is lavished on them despite their poverty.

 

[BoQ77]

China is far away to reach the Russia position to Ukraine.
Vietnam defeated any big powers trying to dominate us. How about Ukraine ?
Ukraine still not a member of any community, Vietnam is a stable member of ASEAN, which Vietnam currently keep the top-rank of General Secretary.
So Vietnam belong to ASEAN region, never doubt about any divide or merging ...

 

[William Hung]

BRAVO! great analysis...but it sucks.

following your logic, china plays a policy of double-crossing as well. chinese hate japanese but keep bilateral tradings. how about america? when china begins to stop everything wih uncle sam. if you haven´t noticed, we still have a non-aligment policy.

Of course China and Japan are playing games with each other. Same thing with China and US. They have bilateral trade and economic "co-operation" with each other but all wants to be on top of each other. When you are a big player, you can play this game too. As for Vietnam? your country still too weak to play this game. Thats why your game plan hit you in the butt.

Non-alignment policy? like welcoming a third party like the US into the SCS conflict? shaking hand with Russia and India to come and drill in disputed area? Actually, you are very welcome to do that. But don't pretend it's part of a "non-alignment" policy. And when your game plan kick you in the butt, don't play the victim. If you want to play then just play, but don't complain.

And my analysis is always good. I talked about a possible VN colour revolution a long time ago.

 

[Viet]

Of course China and Japan are playing games with each other. Same thing with China and US. They have bilateral trade and economic "co-operation" with each other but all wants to be on top of each other. When you are a big player, you can play this game too. As for Vietnam? your country still too weak to play this game. Thats why your game plan hit you in the butt.

Non-alignment policy? like welcoming a third party like the US into the SCS conflict? shaking hand with Russia and India to come and drill in disputed area? Actually, you are very welcome to do that. But don't pretend it's part of a "non-alignment" policy. And when your game plan kick you in the butt, don't play the victim. If you want to play then just play, but don't complain.

And my analysis is always good. I talked about a possible VN colour revolution a long time ago.

you don´t get it. we are not in a military alliance yet, that is "non-alignment" policy.

VN cooperates with russia, america, japan or many others in economic, military and other fields like China does. who gives Chinese the right to dictate VN? Chinese can do what they like but we not?

We have the rights to explore our resources in our waters including EEZ. It is not Chinese right to critize if we do alone or with other nations. It is not Chinese rights, either, to critize when we draw other friendly nations to keep the international waters in peace. China is multiple bigger than VN, so it is natural that we seek outside support.

we have 65 military cooperations with other countries. more than any other in the world. who gives Chinese the right to scold we play a double-crossing game? since when do we need permission from china?

Sure, we are much weaker than China, but should that mean we are not allowed to do things that fit our interests? afterall we are a sovereign nation.

last but not least, Chinese main policy is hostile. the recent deployment into the SC Sea, of oil rigs, warships, jets and a new dot on the map reflect it.

 

[historysheeter]

Vietnam's war history since WW-II Between 1940 to 1990:
1. World War - II: Against Japan: Result: VICTORY to Vietnam and independence
2. Indochina War: Against UK, France, Cambodia, Laos; Result: VICTORY to Vietnam
3. US-Vietnam War: Against USA+ 8 to10 Allies; Result: VICTORY to Vietnam, US withdraws
4. Cambodian War: Against Khmer Rouge, Thailand: Result: VICTORY to Vietnam
5. Sino-Vietnam War: Against China: Result: VICTORY to Vietnam, Chinese withdrawal from Vietnam
6. Thai-Laotian Border War: Against Thailand; Result: VICTORY to Vietnam, Thai Withdrawal

With such an unblemished war record of 100% victories, and against nations like US, China, Japan, UK, France, Australia, South Korea,Thailand etc. what will you call a man who compares Vietnam with Ukrain?

 

[yusheng]

as everybody can see it: the vietnamese appeasement policy in the last 2 decades toward china has failed. you have seen our peaceful approach as weakness. you misuse your weight and power.
your oil rig provocation has damaged the relationship forever. even senior members of the communist party have realised it.

for the time being, individuals, nations, countries are selfish, it is unfortunate that many time events donot end up winwin, but winlose; through the history, boundaries of nations, strength of countires are always changing; the only thing that does not change is changing as a chinese sage said more than two thousand years ago whom you may not familiar with.