What Did the U.S. Get for $2 Trillion in Afghanistan?

[gambit]

****For the rest of the world, the US military is an expeditionary force never seen before in history.*********

RE: Yes and you still lost.....like the Red Army

BTW Interesting comment for a losing side... reminds me of our Mullah Diesel...

Let US know when your Pakistani military changed its structure to that of the Taliban's, starting with getting rid of your air force.

 

[PradoTLC]

Let US know when your Pakistani military changed its structure to that of the Taliban's, starting with getting rid of your air force.

no idea.... ask our GHQ boys ....

it seem you guys gave them a 21 gun solute... no idea why... may be to the real victors of the Afgan war?

 

[Taimoor Khan]

Camp Afghanistan , target Pakistan.

2 Trillions lost of economy + 2500 Deaths on American side, 130 Billion $ lost to economy and 70K (mostly civilians) dead on Pakistani side.

Pakistan has somehow managed to shrug off the losses and regain its control over the region and beyond but America has been reduced to just another super power along side China and Russia. Afghan war has given birth to the multipolar world. The only beneficiaries among Americans camp are India and Israel , at the expense of America own interests.

Sooner the American establishment realise that India and Israel are liabilities, the better.

 

[graphican]

They allowed Al-Qaeda to use their land as a base for a global Islamic war.

Sir, can this be any more absurd? You are referring to "they" as who? Osama bin Ladin? Mullah Omer? Haqqanis? Like the entire Afghan Nation was the host except for the Government of Afghanistan who you fund, back and support? Or was it Taliban who you are requesting Pakistan to help you negotiate? our description of the allegation on Afghanistan reveals how disoriented your Nation stance is.

Every force that has magnitude will stand out. USA because of its economy and focus has developed it and this development is not the moment of pride as any country with better economy and focuses towards military would do that - the real test was what you do with that force - and time showed you failed yourself there. You do not deserve to hold a power like that as you have shown how abusive you are within. Your National character has discredited itself.

 

[jamahir]

Smart people would ask: 'What did the US learned from Afghanistan?' And they worries for their countries.

Smart people would ask : "Who created or facilitated the creation of Taliban and al-Qaeda ??"

Never mind the fact that Osama bin Laden, in an interview with Robert Fisk, said he never took anything from the US during the Cold War.

 

[gambit]

Sir, can this be any more absurd?

No, it is not absurd.

You are referring to "they" as who?

The 'they' meant Afghanistan in entirety. You got no problems referring to US as a collective, so do not complain if I return the same.

..and time showed you failed yourself there.

I got no problem with that. But then again, the US can call upon at least half of Europe, South Korea, and JPN as 'wins' and those are spectacular wins.

You do not deserve to hold a power like that as you have shown how abusive you are within. Your National character has discredited itself.

Abusive? That is hilarious. We done more for the world than yours have.

no idea....

Whaddaya mean 'no idea'? I thought that when you said the US was 'defeated' in Afghanistan by a bunch of rag-tag tribesmen, you were speaking from an experienced combat veteran and that such an armed force -- the Taliban -- should be emulated the world over because they 'defeated' the mighty US. But now you are telling me that your Pakistan is NOT going to convert to the Taliban military structure?

 

[Old School]

Many people became billionaires including local Afghans, many deaths, destruction and sufferings. Pakistan also suffered a huge socio-economical damage in such a scale that it can never be repaired. Afghanistan is a curse for all. I blame the Afghans for everything ranging from communist experiments, Russian invasion to the current NATO occupation. This country not only ruined itself but everything in the surrounding. The Afghans are simply not capable of governing themselves.
Therefore, the only option of peace is to partition and annex Afghanistan among Pakistan, Iran, Uzbekistan and Tajikistan along ethnic lines.

 

[925boy]

If the Taliban rejected Osama bin Laden and Al-Qaeda in the first place, then most likely the world would still remain ignorant of Afghanistan. Learn anything?

"IF THE" = HYPOTHETICAL. you cannot make a real world argument off of a hypothetical scenario which only happened in your mind and not in real life. SO NO, i've not learned anything except the fact that this argument you used is a big fallacy. try again please.

 

[gambit]

Therefore, the only option of peace is to partition and annex Afghanistan among Pakistan, Iran, Uzbekistan and Tajikistan along ethnic lines.

That is an excellent idea. Here is why...

Nation. A group of people that shares some common bonds, such as language, customs, and even racial characteristics.

State. A governing body over a people.

Country. A geographical locale.

For example: World Jewry was a people but with no state and no geographical area to call their own until the establishment of the state of Israel. And there are still plenty of 'stateless' peoples like the Romani (Gypsies) in Europe.

The word 'country' is used interchangeably with 'state' but can also be used to describe a region. Africa is a 'country' that contains many 'states'. Same with Europe and the Americas. So whenever we use the word 'country' we are describing a union of all three concepts.

So in the event where there is a breakdown or when there is not a long term cohesion of all three components, we really have no 'country' in popular language. The best word is simply 'country' in the most basic context: a geographical locale.

This is not radical. Taiwan is de facto an independent country in the fullest context of 'country' despite having common ancestral ties with mainland China. The Korean peninsula is a 'country' with two politically distinct states, North Korea and South Korea. So at least an administrative partition of Afghanistan is definitely doable and I would argue desirable for the many peoples in that region.

A major concern is responsibility. An administrative partition among ethnic lines would burden the various governments with final responsibility on what goes on inside their respective regions. Al-Qaeda flourished in Afghanistan because of no central government. No REAL central government. If any version or offshoot branch of Al-Qaeda or IS lives and breathes inside a region and wages jihad externally, that government will bear the brunt of retaliation.

 

[Old School]

That is an excellent idea. Here is why...

Nation. A group of people that shares some common bonds, such as language, customs, and even racial characteristics.

State. A governing body over a people.

Country. A geographical locale.

For example: World Jewry was a people but with no state and no geographical area to call their own until the establishment of the state of Israel. And there are still plenty of 'stateless' peoples like the Romani (Gypsies) in Europe.

The word 'country' is used interchangeably with 'state' but can also be used to describe a region. Africa is a 'country' that contains many 'states'. Same with Europe and the Americas. So whenever we use the word 'country' we are describing a union of all three concepts.

So in the event where there is a breakdown or when there is not a long term cohesion of all three components, we really have no 'country' in popular language. The best word is simply 'country' in the most basic context: a geographical locale.

This is not radical. Taiwan is de facto an independent country in the fullest context of 'country' despite having common ancestral ties with mainland China. The Korean peninsula is a 'country' with two politically distinct states, North Korea and South Korea. So at least an administrative partition of Afghanistan is definitely doable and I would argue desirable for the many peoples in that region.

A major concern is responsibility. An administrative partition among ethnic lines would burden the various governments with final responsibility on what goes on inside their respective regions. Al-Qaeda flourished in Afghanistan because of no central government. No REAL central government. If any version or offshoot branch of Al-Qaeda or IS lives and breathes inside a region and wages jihad externally, that government will bear the brunt of retaliation.

State sponsored terror proxies are undeniable facts. No real work has been done to address this global issue so far. Once we make it difficult for states to sponsor terrorism without serious consequences, most of AQ/IS type outfits will go away. However, this is something easier said than done. Most regional and global powers are guilty of practicing this dirty assymetrical warfare tactic which poses more threats to global peace than WMD.

 

[Avicenna]

A vital component of 'smart' is experience.

Watch from 9:34 and especially from 12:20 and again at 12:54.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

IK knew this. I guess US leadership didn't.

@925boy

 

[H. Dawary]

target among many targets. Ideologically speaking, they were correct.

Today, because of that great lie, the Muslim world is in complete turmoil. You are divided into factions that are seemingly irreconcilable even at the ideological level. You squabble among yourselves like children over who gets the last cookie. Your leaderships are corrupt to the core. Other than oil production, you contribute practically nothing to mankind's progress. Your most beautiful cities are built on providing financial services to foreigners and not of industries.

So do not focus on our lies to ourselves. Look at your own which is far worse.

As much I hate this post, I have to agree with it because it is the truth... When there is no enemy outside, we start fighting ourselves. Aside from the Islamic golden age, which we boast so much of, we have in the present century contributed very little to nothing at all. We need these type of bitter truths so that we can start waking up, thank you for the criticism.

Many people became billionaires including local Afghans, many deaths, destruction and sufferings. Pakistan also suffered a huge socio-economical damage in such a scale that it can never be repaired. Afghanistan is a curse for all. I blame the Afghans for everything ranging from communist experiments, Russian invasion to the current NATO occupation. This country not only ruined itself but everything in the surrounding. The Afghans are simply not capable of governing themselves.
Therefore, the only option of peace is to partition and annex Afghanistan among Pakistan, Iran, Uzbekistan and Tajikistan along ethnic lines.

Don't do it, believe me it's going to bite everyone in arse in the future. If my house is divided by force or through schemes of others, just remember that if ever an opportunity is presented to me to screw the said persons who divided my house then I will take it, even if it means making a deal with the devil himself.

If you don't want your house divided then don't speak of dividing other peoples houses... unless you are hypocrite.

 

[BATMAN]

Never forget to add the $ trillion which Pakistan aided US in terms of transit costs.

 

[gambit]

"IF THE" = HYPOTHETICAL. you cannot make a real world argument off of a hypothetical scenario which only happened in your mind and not in real life. SO NO, i've not learned anything except the fact that this argument you used is a big fallacy. try again please.

Of course I can make a real world argument out of 'What ifs' scenarios.

In science, the speculation and discussion of what if Edison had collaborated with Tesla instead of alienating Tesla is still going on today.

In international politics, states employs psychologists and historians to give leaders precisely those 'What ifs' scenarios. Monarchs and dictators are usually long term and dynastic leaders compares to functional democracies which changes leaderships on a regular basis. So those 'What ifs' scenarios are eminently useful in order to give leaders OPTIONS on how to deal with new incoming leaderships. The method is not perfect but better an educated guess than ignorance.

So yes, what if Afghanistan had not hosted Osama bin Laden and Al-Qaeda? That is the lesson the ME is learning today.

Looks like you did not learned anything, not because there is no lesson, but because you are too absorbed in your own ignorance to learn.

 

[PradoTLC]

No, it is not absurd.



Whaddaya mean 'no idea'? I thought that when you said the US was 'defeated' in Afghanistan by a bunch of rag-tag tribesmen, you were speaking from an experienced combat veteran and that such an armed force -- the Taliban -- should be emulated the world over because they 'defeated' the mighty US. But now you are telling me that your Pakistan is NOT going to convert to the Taliban military structure?

"defeated" ? is there even a doubt?...

if killing more of the enemy is your barometer for success then the german military in WW2 was the winner. bcos they shot more allied planes, tanks etc than any other nation...


the point is you went there, saw and got your arses handed to you on a plate and now you are desperately trying to blame some one else for your failures.

Of course I can make a real world argument out of 'What ifs' scenarios.



So yes, what if Afghanistan had not hosted Osama bin Laden and Al-Qaeda? That is the lesson the ME is learning today.

Looks like you did not learned anything, not because there is no lesson, but because you are too absorbed in your own ignorance to learn.

and if you had not armed and trained the Mujhaidden who latter morphed into the Taliban there would have been no 9-11?...

and if you had not invade Iraq and created ISIS (according to Trump) there would have been less terrorism?

Looks like you did not learned anything, not because there is no lesson, but because you are too absorbed in your own ignorance to learn

Watch from 9:34 and especially from 12:20 and again at 12:54.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

IK knew this. I guess US leadership didn't.

@925boy

a mad man doesnt know he is mad...to the rest of the world americans are mad. to them selves there are perfectly normal

Smart people would ask : "Who created or facilitated the creation of Taliban and al-Qaeda ??"

smart people ask who created the LTTE terrorist of Sri Lanka...and who sent this guy to Pakistan to conduct terrorism?