What devoured glamorous Pakistan?

[PakiiZeeshan]

Well mate don't take it to heart but i was just saying wat i saw OTOH i am a marathi livining in haryana (jaatland) for 20 or so years on marathi's i ill say they are most miserly people you ill ever see n the most introvert or i ill say they don't mix with anybody or kuan ka maindhak kinda thing

Marathis are miserable?, Why do you say that?

 

[niaz]

There is a difference between glamorous Pakistanis and glamorous Pakistan. To be honest, Pakistan as a country was never glamorous. Hailing from that land, I can tell you that only two cities (Lahore and Karachi) could be termed glamorous by any stretch of imagination. However neither of these cities was even close to Bombay oops! Mumbai.

Most of the ordinary folks in Punjab were quite poor. Even though only 6 miles from the city of Sargodha, until 1958 my chak or village had ‘kachcha’ road, virtually impassable whenever it rained and until 1967 no electricity. Even Lyallpur (oops Faisalabad) had no decent air-conditioned hotel as late as 1974.

As Sales Development Manager for Esso (before it became PSO) I had a reason to visit every city in Pakistan which boasted an Esso retail outlet and in most cities we stayed at the ‘Dak Banglow’ or the Canal Rest House for the lack of decent living accommodation. So much for the glamorous Pakistan.There were no doubt a very small number of very wealthy families, mostly product of the rapid growth of the Ayub era.

Imran Khan and Benazir donot represent ordinary Pakistani or Pakistan. Even during those times Ian Bothom had remarked that Pakistan is a place where you send your mother in law. The article under discussion is nothing but a peace of journalism carefully spun to make it an interesting read. However, it has little relationship with the truth.

Despite all of the above Pakistan was a peace loving and decent place where as kids we used to cycle around for miles without the slightest fear of anything untoward. IMO the title of the article should be “What devoured a peaceful Pakistan?”

The root cause goes back to 1965 war which eroded prosperity of the Ayub regime. Then the 1971 war which shattered MA Jinnah's Pakistan. Nationalization program of the ZA Bhutto regime sent the entrepreneurs packing out of Pakistan. Final straw was the bigot Zia and the Afghan war which brought in Kalashnikov and drug culture. Two terms each of the BB and Nawaz Sharif created sectarianism, taliban and unbridled corruption and destroyed what was left of peaceful Pakistan.

One would have thought that things could not get any worse. Aftermath of 9/11proved everyone wrong. Now any poor man leaving his house to earn his daily bread, is unsure that he will come back home safe in the evening. Mosques and shrines have become death traps. Even yesteday 16 people died in Karachi!

Alas we have no one to blame for most of this but Pakistanis themselves. Elsewhere in this forum there is a thread about Lt Gen Azam Khan; a true man of honor. Had it not been for him; JI bigots would have created a mess of Pakistan as early as 1953.

Call me what you like, but I would put blame of the backward march of Pakistan’s economy as well as society values one hundred percent on the religious forces. Having failed to stop the creation of Pakistan 63 years ago; these are now hell bent to destroy it by dragging it back to seventh century. Naturally, our big neighbor is giving them a helping hand.

 

[barcelona]

Marathis are miserable?, Why do you say that?

Hey man i m not sayin they r miserable but they don't spend much miserly kanjus got that mate

 

[Blue Sword]

It is not a question of ignoring them. It is the question of wanting to develop. Look at Calcutta - till the 1960s - Bombay and Cal were on par as important business centers of India. Look at it now. It is a joke. Who is to blame for it but the people and the administration? Everytime I go to Goa, people there seem to work only grudgingly. If Assam or Bengal or any part of India wants to develop, there is nothing to stop them but their own shackles of caste and laziness.

I can understand that those states should do hard work.. your point is all true in the present scenario.!

But if not .. you can not keep them aside .. the center as well as the state government need to do 200% if their present effort is not successful.

Look at J&K and Assam can you tell me any industry there.. but still there is potential to grow industry. People can argue that there is militant problem. But unless you devise some meaningful formula nothing will happen.

If we don't same thing will happen again and again and it will be worse than ever.


Assam has recently progressed but look at J&K.. and now the Naxal problem in few other states e.g. Orissa, Jharkhand Chhattisgarh . they are the pure example of uneven development...

Because lack of education, the unavailability of good hospital, school making those people in wrong direction. Need to do more towards employment for those youth. if not for this generation for the next generation that are going to come need to drag to mainstream called INDIA.



Finally my point is that "If one person is handicap don't neglect,
Take extra care and walk with Hand in Hand".

 

[k_n]

Hey man i m not sayin they r miserable but they don't spend much miserly kanjus got that mate

Yea , they are very careful with money .
But that doesnt mean they are short of it , I often ask my father about this habbit of the Marathis as he visits Bombay often

 

[WAQAS119]

I am not pessimist but the intention of this guy behind this article doesn't look good! I don't know we were glamorous or not but one thing is for sure that if we were as glamorous as has been told by writer then this was not a good thing!
This article seems to be saying to young Pakistanis as if 'Hey Pakistanis, you were so glamorous but not now, you should be glamorous'. IMO this is like killing a nation.
Recently somebody posted an article on Defence.pk in which Chinese Intellects told Chinese people to keep low profile and I was really impressed with this kind of attitude. I mean we should also learn to live like that. We should keep low profile while working hard and world will themselves consider us a glamorous nation rather than fake glamor.

And finally, I totally agree with Blains that current state of affairs of Pakistan is for shaping Pakistan for the future! Every nation has to pass through this situation before it can become a strong Nation. And I am happy that Pakistanis are facing it like true glamorous nation.

 

[temujin]

Misleading in my opinion.

As if all Pakistanis were playboys and flaunting money. The vast majority of the Pakistani diaspora in the West today comprises of hard working folks who toiled as doctors, engineers and in other professions. These were the folks who came to the West in the 50s, 60s, 70s and they have, for the most part, retained their Islamic outlook and have grown more religiously inclined over the years yet they maintain their belief in Quaid's Pakistan.

Secondly, the class that is being discussed in this opinion piece thrives to this day in Pakistan as the so called elite of Pakistan. They have not gone away, they still shop and eat in the West and throw lavish parties. Its just that they do not have as many Westerners visiting them so their glitzy way of life is kept away from the Westerners and Indians. Suffice it to say these very same people live on as they have before and they never represented Pakistan fully, only a part of it thus basing one's opinion on the class or a few of them at Oxford (a school frequented by foreign elite for its name), is a massive stereotype.

Pakistan's Islamization is shaping the country for the future. It won't be without violence and disruption (I tend to believe its probably better that all of this stuff is being sorted out as it had to). However the argument of the Indian side is to always put down the Islamic nature of Pakistan to make a point that Pakistan was not needed. Well you can pick gripes with our Islamization, sooner or later we had to come to terms with it and once all is said and done, it will bring stability to Pakistan.

Yes Pakistanis are a flashy bunch and sometimes this gets the best of them, but looking at today's Indian Bollywood and cricket, one can say the same that the hubris may get the better of them one day too.

Not true..Pakistanis are among the poorest and most underacheiving immigrant groups in the UK and most likely in the rest of Europe. I have come across a few Pakistani professionals but most are employed in unskilled/semi skilled occupations or on welfare..Please check the figures from the following report by a left leaning think tank(and therefore likely to be an underestimate) which shows that only 39% of Pakistanis of working age in the UK are employed (third worst after Bangladeshis and Somalians)

ippr - Institute for Public Policy Research

WRT to the article, I wonder where the author got this highly romanticised notion of Pakistanis in the West from..Having lived in the West for most of my life, I have rarely come across anyone who regards Pakistan (or, until recently, India) as vaguely glamorous (as evidenced by use of the P word as the slur of choice in relation to South Asians)

 

[notsuperstitious]

Yea , they are very careful with money .
But that doesnt mean they are short of it , I often ask my father about this habbit of the Marathis as he visits Bombay often

Thats changing fast. Recently Aurangabad took delivery of 150 Mercs on one day, many of the owners must be marathi from a small city. Also, my neighbor in Mumbai bought a merc few months back.

Many marathi weddings nowadays hold sangeet and mehndi functions, so what used to be a half a day wedding is now 2-3 days long.

The punjabis are ruining us

 

[PakiiZeeshan]

Not true..Pakistanis are among the poorest and most underacheiving immigrant groups in the UK and most likely in the rest of Europe. I have come across a few Pakistani professionals but most are employed in unskilled/semi skilled occupations or on welfare..Please check the figures from the following report by a left leaning think tank(and therefore likely to be an underestimate) which shows that only 39% of Pakistanis of working age in the UK are employed (third worst after Bangladeshis and Somalians)

ippr - Institute for Public Policy Research

WRT to the article, I wonder where the author got this highly romanticised notion of Pakistanis in the West from..Having lived in the West for most of my life, I have rarely come across anyone who regards Pakistan (or, until recently, India) as vaguely glamorous (as evidenced by use of the P word as the slur of choice in relation to South Asians)

Pakistani-Norwegians; "Almost 10% of the medical students in Oslo(Norwegian Capital) are of Pakistani heritage and this figure is increasing [3]. The figure is significant as Pakistani Norwegians only constitute 3.67% of Oslo's population. The share of Pakistani Norwegians, born and raised in Norway, in higher education at university level is higher than the Norwegian national average"

Pakistani Norwegians - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They are mostly ethnic Punjabis of Pakistan

 

[Cityboy]

Hey man i m not sayin they r miserable but they don't spend much miserly kanjus got that mate

no match for us gujaratis. .skeptical abt every paisa. .i bet no other state ppl in india hv as much money as we gujaratis have

 

[nForce]

no match for us gujaratis. .skeptical abt every paisa. .i bet no other state ppl in india hv as much money as we gujaratis have

congrats...but then whats the use of money if you are not planning to spend it???

 

[SMC]

And, far from being glamorous, India's image today is that of the land of cheap IT nerds. Appreciation of Bollywood and yoga are confined to specific niche subcultures.

That's not true man. India by in large is still viewed as a place where vast majority of people live in really poor conditions, a dirty place, along the lines of Africa, with a fraction of the people living in good conditions. Most people realize that these IT nerds are only a small fraction of the population.

 

[KALKI]

@SMC: How do they view Pakistan sir? I'm asking you since I've never been out of the country.

 

[SMC]

@SMC: How do they view Pakistan sir? I'm asking you since I've never been out of the country.

It's been discussed already in post 19 and 20.

 

[Just_another_american]

What a lame discussion - who's viewed in what fashion in the West!!

I'll tell you how. Everyone knows that India is a poor country, but India has a "brand name" of its own. Apart from Yoga, there are things like Bollywood, Indian food (curry and others), exotic mysticism (for some), and of course, the 'Himalayas'.

That was about the "brand". And these days India is well known for taking American jobs (mainly IT, and spreading to other fields). You won't believe the amount of mindshare India has among working professionals (mainly in tech) here. Heck, I myself work in the IT field. Obama's rhetoric on the need for American kids to buck up and compete with kids from Bangalore and Beijing is rubbing the whole thing in - India has a different image now, when compared to a decade back.

Pakistan, unfortunately, has a severe image problem. Pakistan is associated only with terrorism and terrorists, backward Mullahs, tribal wars, and so on. Don't jump all over me for saying this guys, you know this is the truth.