What's new

War crimes against Russians by Japan. It began with Unit 731 for Russians leaving Harbin.

yes, especially considering the advance fighters were Japanese, oh wait, it was Soviet. No, it was Soviet. Japanese weapons were maybe great on the sea but on land and in the air, the Soviets was head and shoulders above pretty much everyone.

And we were the little brother of the Soviets at the time.

So no, PLAAF was built with the Soviets and KMT defectors.

To be fair, the soviet probably contributed more to the PLA in its early history, but the captured japanese equipment cannot be understated.

How else would Mao have ended up arming his million man army after the war? There was no industrialization in China at that time, and USA has been supplying the KMT.
 
.
poor Russians Unit 731 evillllllllll
but also poor German woman and children when the Red Army took Berlin
 
.
So the Japanese soldiers contributed very little in the end and how much of help was it for the development of PLAAF?

not much at all, some engineers stayed, and a few men here and there, that's about it, the PLAAF is almost entirely contributed by the Soviets.
To be fair, the soviet probably contributed more to the PLA in its early history, but the captured japanese equipment cannot be understated.

How else would Mao have ended up arming his million man army after the war? There was no industrialization in China at that time, and USA has been supplying the KMT.

About three divisions of communist forecs marched to DongBei, where these equipments were, two of them left everything even winter coats, cause they thought they would get all the captured equipments, but they didn't, when Lin got to DongBei he had to fight with the one division not stupid enough to drop their weapons.

Most of the Japanese gear went to the KMT, a secret deal Japanese generals made with KMT to keep their heads.

CCP got their weapons mostly from KMT, the Soviet took a lot of the stuff back with them.
 
.
not much at all, some engineers stayed, and a few men here and there, that's about it, the PLAAF is almost entirely contributed by the Soviets.


About three divisions of communist forecs marched to DongBei, where these equipments were, two of them left everything even winter coats, cause they thought they would get all the captured equipments, but they didn't, when Lin got to DongBei he had to fight with the one division not stupid enough to drop their weapons.

Most of the Japanese gear went to the KMT, a secret deal Japanese generals made with KMT to keep their heads.

CCP got their weapons mostly from KMT, the Soviet took a lot of the stuff back with them.

@cnleio guess the father of PLAAF isn't Japanese lol
 
.
About three divisions of communist forecs marched to DongBei, where these equipments were, two of them left everything even winter coats, cause they thought they would get all the captured equipments, but they didn't, when Lin got to DongBei he had to fight with the one division not stupid enough to drop their weapons.

Most of the Japanese gear went to the KMT, a secret deal Japanese generals made with KMT to keep their heads.

CCP got their weapons mostly from KMT, the Soviet took a lot of the stuff back with them.

The KMT mostly took the Japanese weapons from the Japanese that surrendered everywhere outside of Manchuria.
They never had control of Northern China, so CCP took the Japanese equipments from Manchuria.
 
.
By: Shigehiro Yuasa


Following the Pacific War, Japan lost all the colonies or occupied areas and all military units in Japan and elsewhere were officially disarmed. Under these circumstances, the Japanese government did not have the ability to formulate a new China policy. But some Japanese stayed in China and collaborated with the Nationalist Army. I will examine those activities mainly in Shanxi province and point out some aspects which were different from the logic of the Cold War.

In the last stage of the war, the First Army, under the command and control of the China Expeditionary Army, stayed at Taiyuan, a major city in Shanxi. In May 1945, in the face of Nazi Germany’s defeat, a group of the First Army’s staff developed the idea of preserving the force for Japanese reconstruction. This idea, according to Hiroshi Jono, a political adviser to the government of Shanxi province, meant that some Japanese forces should remain outside Japan, maintain their organizations, and preserve their power for the purpose of reconstructing Japan. Besides Jono, the leading members advocating this idea included General Yamaoka and Major Iwata. General Raishiro Sumita, commander of First Army, seemed tacitly to approve this idea.

The staff group, Jono recalled, predicted that Japan’s defeat was inevitable and that Japan would be occupied and disarmed by the Allied Powers after the surrender. However, the staff group thought, if Japanese independence were restored, the new Army would be necessary for new Japan. Therefore, some troops deployed in foreign countries and their equipment should be retained for that purpose. Those who advocated this idea considered Shanxi the most suitable place to implement their plan.

In addition, those staff officers were concerned about the economic implications of the forces preserved for reconstruction, thinking that a prosperous market and access to natural resources would be indispensable for recovery. The First Army force should thus secure a suitable area: Shanxi. Hiroshi Jono pointed out in his memoir some reasons why Shanxi was the best area. While Shanxi province was theoretically under the Nationalist government, it was actually ruled almost independently of Chiang Kai-shek by Governor Yan Xishan, who was pro-Japanese. The Japanese staff officers, therefore, expected that Yan would allow the Japanese Army to stay in Shanxi because he needed its help for his battle against the Communists.

Yan Xishan actually tried to utilize the Japanese forces, weapons, and materials. Just after the war’s end, Yan asked General Sumita to transfer Japanese equipment to him and that Japanese troops remain in Shanxi under his command. Sumita initially refused, saying that it was senseless for the Army to engage in hostilities without the Japanese government’s order. Yan pressed Sumita strongly, however, and the general finally agreed, provided that Japanese soldiers were first discharged from military service and then volunteered to serve under Yan. About two thousand Japanese soldiers took part in this program when it was established in the spring of 1946; the last unit fought against the Communists in Shanxi until April 1949. By the spring of 1949, the number of Japanese soldiers had decreased to one hundred, and many of them lost their lives in the final battle.

Although the original idea had been that the Japanese volunteer force in Shanxi would assist Japan’s reconstruction, it was destined to be a deserted force. Neither the Japanese government nor the senior officials of the former Japanese First Army would accept the volunteer activities in Shanxi, because it was a violation of the Potsdam Declaration. One junior officer who refused to participate in the new army recalled that the staff recruited soldiers systematically, giving enlisted men an exaggerated picture of the misery that awaited them if they returned to Japan. They even created a false pamphlet saying that if the soldiers returned to Japan, they would be sent to a prison in New Guinea as war criminals.

The Japanese government knew of the activity in Shanxi and opposed the volunteer army plan. The First Ministry of Repatriation (formerly the Army Ministry) several times ordered the activities in Shanxi halted and sent an officer, Shun’ichi Miyazaki, to investigate the situation. Miyazaki reported in April 1946 that Yan Xishan was aiming at establishing his own independent kingdom with the help of his Japanese volunteer army. Miyazaki opposed this use of Japanese forces and recommended that the staff officers who insisted on remaining in Shanxi should be transferred elsewhere and that repatriation of Japanese soldiers in Shanxi begin as soon as possible, with the cooperation of U.S. troops. Even Yasuji Okamura, the former commander of the China Expeditionary Army, who advocated cooperation with the GMD army after the Nationalist government moved to Taiwan, objected to the Shanxi project.

United States leaders were also aware, to some extent, of the events in Shanxi province, and regarded it as injurious to the American program in China and to the Marshall Mission. Governor Yan was an obstacle to U.S. policy in China, in part because he did not obey the cease-fire that Marshall had helped to negotiate and continued to battle against the Communists, and in part because he was violating the Allied Powers’ order for disarming Japanese troops. When General Marshall visited Taiyuan 3–4 March 1946, he and the other members of the Committee of Three met some generals in Yan’s army and demanded the disarmament of the Japanese troops. Yan needed the Japanese forces, however, so he and his Japanese officers ignored Marshall’s request. The Japanese troops were camouflaged by officially disbanding them and hiding them in mountainous areas and retaining their organization.

The Nationalist government not only did not support Yan Xishan, it strongly opposed his use of Japanese troops. When Shun’ichi Miyazaki, the Japanese officer investigating the Shanxi issue, met Yan, he found that Yan had refused to implement the directives from Chinese Army Headquarters ordering the disarmament of his Japanese troops. Colonel Ulmont W. Holly, American member of Field Team 3, reported that Yan “repeats the orders received from[Marshall Mission] Executive Headquarters to his Field Commanders, but does not issue directives of his own to see that they are carried out.”This was not the first time that Yan had ignored orders from the national government or Executive Headquarters. The national government had a long history of trouble in dealing with him. Yan, while anti-Communist, was an old-style warlord and not a man who understood the local situation in terms of U.S.-Soviet international rivalry; he merely wished to secure Shanxi.

Yan’s ambitions might fit the old-fashioned Japanese view of “weak and divided China,” but the Imperial Japan that had invaded China with this view no longer existed, and the postwar Japanese government could not recognize his Japanese troop project, making it an abandoned army. Possibly the Japanese officers who advocated this project could have exploited the U.S.-Soviet conflict, but they had no long-range vision of the Cold War and their plan was thus destined to failure. Moreover, the whole concept of the force preserved for Japanese reconstruction was vague and unjustifiable, ignoring as it did Japanese responsibility for the Asian war.

As it became clear to Yan’s Japanese mercenaries that their idea of assisting Japan’s reconstruction was irrelevant, the officers sought to redefine their role. Hiroshi Jono, the troops’ political adviser, sought to revive the empty argument of an Asian anti-Western coalition. In his memoir, Jono wrote that the Japanese in Shanxi should help to strengthen Yan’s regime first, then let Yan persuade the Nationalists to cooperate with Japan, and subsequently Japan and China could form an anti-Western third-force coalition to exploit the Soviet-American conflict. A reflection of obsolete anti-Western sentiments, his plan was doomed to failure. Philosophically the Japanese effort in Shanxi was a backward-looking amalgam of obsolete views.



Japanese volunteers Shanxi,

4999c1a019e859cb959495f20755b380._.jpg


d26b3b78948d0c8e89799c132df285d0._.jpg


1ad84716fe7bf928751e59371a8d4260._.jpg


not much at all, some engineers stayed, and a few men here and there, that's about it, the PLAAF is almost entirely contributed by the Soviets.


About three divisions of communist forecs marched to DongBei, where these equipments were, two of them left everything even winter coats, cause they thought they would get all the captured equipments, but they didn't, when Lin got to DongBei he had to fight with the one division not stupid enough to drop their weapons.

Most of the Japanese gear went to the KMT, a secret deal Japanese generals made with KMT to keep their heads.

CCP got their weapons mostly from KMT, the Soviet took a lot of the stuff back with them.


I recommend the following : A book on Japanese troops that fought against the Chinese communists in the Shanxi Prefecture

'The Army of Ants-Truth of 2600 Japanese Soldiers who remained in the Shanxi Prefecture' ('蟻の兵隊―日本兵2600人山西省残留の真相') by Ikeya Kaoru (池谷薫)

http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/4103051310/?tag=ex-book-22

蟻の兵隊
 
.
By: Shigehiro Yuasa


Following the Pacific War, Japan lost all the colonies or occupied areas and all military units in Japan and elsewhere were officially disarmed. Under these circumstances, the Japanese government did not have the ability to formulate a new China policy. But some Japanese stayed in China and collaborated with the Nationalist Army. I will examine those activities mainly in Shanxi province and point out some aspects which were different from the logic of the Cold War.

In the last stage of the war, the First Army, under the command and control of the China Expeditionary Army, stayed at Taiyuan, a major city in Shanxi. In May 1945, in the face of Nazi Germany’s defeat, a group of the First Army’s staff developed the idea of preserving the force for Japanese reconstruction. This idea, according to Hiroshi Jono, a political adviser to the government of Shanxi province, meant that some Japanese forces should remain outside Japan, maintain their organizations, and preserve their power for the purpose of reconstructing Japan. Besides Jono, the leading members advocating this idea included General Yamaoka and Major Iwata. General Raishiro Sumita, commander of First Army, seemed tacitly to approve this idea.

The staff group, Jono recalled, predicted that Japan’s defeat was inevitable and that Japan would be occupied and disarmed by the Allied Powers after the surrender. However, the staff group thought, if Japanese independence were restored, the new Army would be necessary for new Japan. Therefore, some troops deployed in foreign countries and their equipment should be retained for that purpose. Those who advocated this idea considered Shanxi the most suitable place to implement their plan.

In addition, those staff officers were concerned about the economic implications of the forces preserved for reconstruction, thinking that a prosperous market and access to natural resources would be indispensable for recovery. The First Army force should thus secure a suitable area: Shanxi. Hiroshi Jono pointed out in his memoir some reasons why Shanxi was the best area. While Shanxi province was theoretically under the Nationalist government, it was actually ruled almost independently of Chiang Kai-shek by Governor Yan Xishan, who was pro-Japanese. The Japanese staff officers, therefore, expected that Yan would allow the Japanese Army to stay in Shanxi because he needed its help for his battle against the Communists.

Yan Xishan actually tried to utilize the Japanese forces, weapons, and materials. Just after the war’s end, Yan asked General Sumita to transfer Japanese equipment to him and that Japanese troops remain in Shanxi under his command. Sumita initially refused, saying that it was senseless for the Army to engage in hostilities without the Japanese government’s order. Yan pressed Sumita strongly, however, and the general finally agreed, provided that Japanese soldiers were first discharged from military service and then volunteered to serve under Yan. About two thousand Japanese soldiers took part in this program when it was established in the spring of 1946; the last unit fought against the Communists in Shanxi until April 1949. By the spring of 1949, the number of Japanese soldiers had decreased to one hundred, and many of them lost their lives in the final battle.

Although the original idea had been that the Japanese volunteer force in Shanxi would assist Japan’s reconstruction, it was destined to be a deserted force. Neither the Japanese government nor the senior officials of the former Japanese First Army would accept the volunteer activities in Shanxi, because it was a violation of the Potsdam Declaration. One junior officer who refused to participate in the new army recalled that the staff recruited soldiers systematically, giving enlisted men an exaggerated picture of the misery that awaited them if they returned to Japan. They even created a false pamphlet saying that if the soldiers returned to Japan, they would be sent to a prison in New Guinea as war criminals.

The Japanese government knew of the activity in Shanxi and opposed the volunteer army plan. The First Ministry of Repatriation (formerly the Army Ministry) several times ordered the activities in Shanxi halted and sent an officer, Shun’ichi Miyazaki, to investigate the situation. Miyazaki reported in April 1946 that Yan Xishan was aiming at establishing his own independent kingdom with the help of his Japanese volunteer army. Miyazaki opposed this use of Japanese forces and recommended that the staff officers who insisted on remaining in Shanxi should be transferred elsewhere and that repatriation of Japanese soldiers in Shanxi begin as soon as possible, with the cooperation of U.S. troops. Even Yasuji Okamura, the former commander of the China Expeditionary Army, who advocated cooperation with the GMD army after the Nationalist government moved to Taiwan, objected to the Shanxi project.

United States leaders were also aware, to some extent, of the events in Shanxi province, and regarded it as injurious to the American program in China and to the Marshall Mission. Governor Yan was an obstacle to U.S. policy in China, in part because he did not obey the cease-fire that Marshall had helped to negotiate and continued to battle against the Communists, and in part because he was violating the Allied Powers’ order for disarming Japanese troops. When General Marshall visited Taiyuan 3–4 March 1946, he and the other members of the Committee of Three met some generals in Yan’s army and demanded the disarmament of the Japanese troops. Yan needed the Japanese forces, however, so he and his Japanese officers ignored Marshall’s request. The Japanese troops were camouflaged by officially disbanding them and hiding them in mountainous areas and retaining their organization.

The Nationalist government not only did not support Yan Xishan, it strongly opposed his use of Japanese troops. When Shun’ichi Miyazaki, the Japanese officer investigating the Shanxi issue, met Yan, he found that Yan had refused to implement the directives from Chinese Army Headquarters ordering the disarmament of his Japanese troops. Colonel Ulmont W. Holly, American member of Field Team 3, reported that Yan “repeats the orders received from[Marshall Mission] Executive Headquarters to his Field Commanders, but does not issue directives of his own to see that they are carried out.”This was not the first time that Yan had ignored orders from the national government or Executive Headquarters. The national government had a long history of trouble in dealing with him. Yan, while anti-Communist, was an old-style warlord and not a man who understood the local situation in terms of U.S.-Soviet international rivalry; he merely wished to secure Shanxi.

Yan’s ambitions might fit the old-fashioned Japanese view of “weak and divided China,” but the Imperial Japan that had invaded China with this view no longer existed, and the postwar Japanese government could not recognize his Japanese troop project, making it an abandoned army. Possibly the Japanese officers who advocated this project could have exploited the U.S.-Soviet conflict, but they had no long-range vision of the Cold War and their plan was thus destined to failure. Moreover, the whole concept of the force preserved for Japanese reconstruction was vague and unjustifiable, ignoring as it did Japanese responsibility for the Asian war.

As it became clear to Yan’s Japanese mercenaries that their idea of assisting Japan’s reconstruction was irrelevant, the officers sought to redefine their role. Hiroshi Jono, the troops’ political adviser, sought to revive the empty argument of an Asian anti-Western coalition. In his memoir, Jono wrote that the Japanese in Shanxi should help to strengthen Yan’s regime first, then let Yan persuade the Nationalists to cooperate with Japan, and subsequently Japan and China could form an anti-Western third-force coalition to exploit the Soviet-American conflict. A reflection of obsolete anti-Western sentiments, his plan was doomed to failure. Philosophically the Japanese effort in Shanxi was a backward-looking amalgam of obsolete views.



Japanese volunteers Shanxi,

View attachment 58292

View attachment 58293

View attachment 58294




I recommend the following : A book on Japanese troops that fought against the Chinese communists in the Shanxi Prefecture

'The Army of Ants-Truth of 2600 Japanese Soldiers who remained in the Shanxi Prefecture' ('蟻の兵隊―日本兵2600人山西省残留の真相') by Ikeya Kaoru (池谷薫)

http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/4103051310/?tag=ex-book-22

蟻の兵隊

This is exactly what I talked about, Yan Xishan is not CCP and he's certainly no airforce general. Also Not everyone read Japanese.

Those guys got wiped out. Not all of them, but most of them.

The KMT mostly took the Japanese weapons from the Japanese that surrendered everywhere outside of Manchuria.
They never had control of Northern China, so CCP took the Japanese equipments from Manchuria.

LinBiao was almost wiped out by the KMT in Dongbei, but then he regrouped and the KMT relented by the Soviets and American pressure and precense.

ChengChen diluted his elites in order to have more men but severly weakened his army, Then through jealousy, the commander of the first army Sun Liren was pulled and given a meaningless post. There were tons of other reasons too.

However in terms of what I said about the Japanese weapons it is accurate, your understanding of the civil war is very basic while I have read 100+ books maybe 200, and seen documentaries that talked about even the most meaningless details.
 
.
The early fathers of the PLAF were actually former Japanese officers and pilots of the Imperial Air Force.

@cnleio , isn't this true?
Former Japanese pilot as teacher in 东北航校, Japanese pilots taught 1st batch of PLA pilots in North China during Civil War. Later Soviet and Chinese pilot officer taught 2nd & 3rd batch of PLA pilots during Korea War, Japanese pilots returned Japan from China during 1950s.
 
Last edited:
.
Can't wait for the day when China and Russia gang up on Japan and bombs that despicable war criminal country out of existence. US won't dare get involved in a war with Russia and China.

US didn't even protect their treaty ally the Philippines when China used military force to take back the Scarborough Shoal from the Philippines. US will always protect itself before protecting its friends.

Japan is totally isolated with enemies in North Korea, Russia and China. All nuclear armed with thousands of missiles aimed straight at Japan.

Japanese economy is shrinking and their population is shrinking and their biggest corporations are going bankrupt.
They mess around again like they did in WW2, they will get wiped off the map in double quick time.

Japan is asking to be nuked once again, only this time it will be nukes dropped on every Japanese city. If they thought the Earthquake, Tsunami and Fukushima nuclear radiation was bad, then they haven't seen anything yet :coffee:
 
.
This is exactly what I talked about, Yan Xishan is not CCP and he's certainly no airforce general. Also Not everyone read Japanese.
Those guys got wiped out. Not all of them, but most of them.

No, the article i posted was an illustration of the Japanese involvement in the Chinese Civil War.The volunteers were conscripts from the Imperial Japanese 1st Army. About 2,000 volunteered.

The issue of the Japanese pilot who was involved in the PLAAF is totally different.

5bb0467368594b075c2bd0249ba129e3.jpg


Former Japanese pilot as teacher in 东北航校, Japanese pilots taught 1st groups of PLA pilots in North China during Civil War, later Soviet and Chinese pilot officer.

Ah! Thank You! I had forgotten his name.

Xie Xie!
 
.
No, the article i posted was an illustration of the Japanese involvement in the Chinese Civil War.The volunteers were conscripts from the Imperial Japanese 1st Army. About 2,000 volunteered.

The issue of the Japanese pilot who was involved in the PLAAF is totally different.

View attachment 58338

So we are talking one guy, or a few men, Japan is not the fathe rof PLAAF.

I know the JApanese involvement, and I posted it on page 1 I think. Japanese troops stayed behind, etc, etc.
 
. .
Can't wait for the day when China and Russia gang up on Japan and bombs that despicable war criminal country out of existence. US won't dare get involved in a war with Russia and China.

US didn't even protect their treaty ally the Philippines when China used military force to take back the Scarborough Shoal from the Philippines. US will always protect itself before protecting its friends.

Japan is totally isolated with enemies in North Korea, Russia and China. All nuclear armed with thousands of missiles aimed straight at Japan.

Japanese economy is shrinking and their population is shrinking and their biggest corporations are going bankrupt.
They mess around again like they did in WW2, they will get wiped off the map in double quick time.

Japan is asking to be nuked once again, only this time it will be nukes dropped on every Japanese city. If they thought the Earthquake, Tsunami and Fukushima nuclear radiation was bad, then they haven't seen anything yet :coffee:

LOL buddy, every post that I read from you involves some nuclear threat. Good thing you are not a leader of China.
 
. .
Sincere thanks for the links, my tomodachi.

Not many Japanese know of this, and to be honest, the first time I heard of this was when you mentioned this to me in a thread a while back. So , my sincere thanks and appreciation.
Chinese attitude is fair to the history, Chinese didn't forget Good Japanese like 林弥一郎, also remember those BAD Japanese members like Unit731. To tell our generations if they won't repeat such massacre like their grandpa experiencing 60+ years ago, China need Strong and Chinese need a powerful military strength.
 
.

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom