Vietnam Defence Forum

[cochine]

Vietnam Communists and Vietnam Nationalists, pls take a relax,

 

[Farhan Bohra]

Explain to me how does making the US not so 'holier than thou' helps Viet Nam ?

People saw nothing wrong with North Viet Nam got into alliances with communist China and the Soviet Union. But getting involve with the US ? Oh my God...!!! The horrors...!!!

Please tell me what was the "Treaty of Westphalia"? Why US trying to help Vietnam? US was chosen by GOD to help Vietnam. Are you serious?

What interest had US in 1950s in Vietnam. Obviously China had interest as neighbor?
But surely US is holier than thou which was not serving interest in Asia. But protecting Human Rights.

Thats why Nixon totally ignored genocide in Bengal,,, and sent 7th fleet to attack India? Right. US is totally innocent in Asia, I believe you.

Thats why in 80s, US used petro dollar to fund Islamist to protect Human Rights in Afghanistan against evil USSR? Right? Indeed US is chosen by god to protect humanity.

Nixon: This is just the point when she [Indira Gandhi] is a bitch.

Kissinger: Well, the Indians are bastards anyway. They are starting a war there. It’s—to them East Pakistan is no longer the issue. Now, I found it very interesting how she carried on to you yesterday about West Pakistan.

So much innocence of US.

But little advice, never take higher moral ground when debating. It never work . All countries serve its interest and do misdeeds.

I am not saying US was wrong, but what you saying is totally Bullshit.

All of the solutions that you mentioned is like an ugly woman who puts on some makeup to make her look less uglier, it does not make her a pretty woman.

Lol.

You need to understand the viet military doctrine. They are not allowed to shoot back at the Chinese no matter what. The viet already dig their own grave by not having the balls to do preempt strike.

Have you read Rules of Engagement of Vietnam Army. Or War Directives issued by Vietnam's Ministry of Defence. If you not then you firing shots in air.

If war breaks out, it is the Chinese who will do preempt strike. 72 Chinese jets and 9 bombers on their artificial islands will bombard the viet garrison to smithereen before the viet can react and launch any counter attack on the artificial islands' runways.

Like they launch a EMP attack? And all missiles, defence systems of Vietnam go haywire?

How can Vietnam relieve a Chinese naval blockade in the spratly? Vn has no solution. Vietnam only has 30 something sukhoi planes for anti-shipping mode to attack the Chinese navy. Those 30 something viet planes have no chance against the air defense destroyers, Chinese jets deployed on the spratlys and from the woody islands.

How they do so?

Blockading Spartly while trailed by US, UKs and French SSN and SSGN?


Meanwhile, the Chinese can bombard the viet garrison on the spratly by launching ballistic missiles and land attack cruise missiles. [/QUOTE]

And Vietnam dont retaliate. Never consider Chinese as some 9 feet tall.

 

[TenLua]

I do not think he had much of a choice. Bow to the French or face invasion.

In the unlikely chance that Viet Nam become an exceedingly capable nation, should she colonize France as a token of her appreciation?

 

[xiao qi]

I do not think he had much of a choice. Bow to the French or face invasion.

In the unlikely chance that Viet Nam become an exceedingly capable nation, should she colonize France as a token of her appreciation?

He became king when the country was already occupied, Among princes , he was coward and submissive so France chooses him. He didn't dare to oppose France like his uncle and father, their fate made him scare and no gut to face France. He has a lot of choices and chances, but he chooses a worse choice for Vietnam and himself.

 

[Silent Knight]

Have you read Rules of Engagement of Vietnam Army. Or War Directives issued by Vietnam's Ministry of Defence. If you not then you firing shots in air.

Butthurt RVN residents have been and will always talk like they're deep inside the current Vietnamese government, while blaming everything on the communist.

The ROE is pretty simple. We don't open fire FIRST, and the Chinese are applying the same ROE.

 

[Viet]

revealed to the public few years ago, Vietnam made M18 assault rifle with 5.56 x 45 mm NATO calibre

 

[TenLua]

He became king when the country was already occupied, Among princes , he was coward and submissive so France chooses him. He didn't dare to oppose France like his uncle and father, their fate made him scare and no gut to face France. He has a lot of choices and chances, but he chooses a worse choice for Vietnam and himself.

What were his options? It was clear the French enjoyed superiority on many fronts.

 

[xiao qi]

What were his options? It was clear the French enjoyed superiority on many fronts.

Superior? No, I read some documents for this time. I was surprised when i know Vietnamese soldiers wasn't inferior compared to France soldiers for their assets and weapon, also exceed the number of soldiers. We were defeated, there are many factors, but the main reason is Nguyen Tri Phương. Read more: http://lichsuvn.net/forum/showthread.php?t=19762 I can't find some information to prove France's weapon isn't better than our. I saw from two years ago ( before I also think France is stronger too much than our, but not true) We can win and defeat them. You see the " Dark Flag) . They were a small group and weaker than regular Nguyen soldiers. But why did they defeat France in CauGiay? We could, but our king like KhaiDinh couldn't. We had more than 20 million people at that time. Why did we scare to fight with France? They had only 10000. KhaiDinh was a puppet. he could build his secret army to grab for his reign. We had many young patriot men from " Can Vuong rebel". He had enough advantage conditions to fight with France. But he didn't

 

[Silent Knight]

What were his options? It was clear the French enjoyed superiority on many fronts.

The Nguyen dynasty did make the army weaker overtime. Back to the Quang Trung era, Vietnamese troops were well-armed with rifles/muskets and howitzers, well-trained and the navy could be on par with some European countries.

Things went down hill since most of the Nguyen kings were to passive and afraid to fight, while the one that had the will to fight was isolated and deported by the French.

 

[xiao qi]

The Nguyen dynasty did make the army weaker overtime. Back to the Quang Trung era, Vietnamese troops were well-armed with rifles/muskets and howitzers, well-trained and the navy could be on par with some European countries.

Things went down hill since most of the Nguyen kings were to passive and afraid to fight, while the one that had the will to fight was isolated and deported by the French.

it isn't exactly, should remember our king like Minh Mang, Tu Duc or Thieu Tri, especially Minh Mang, Most of them has the strong policy toward our neighbors like Cam and Thailand, We even fought in Cam more than 10 years and encountered many times with Thais, Maybe our weapon and military is weak compared to Quang Trung or Nguyen Anh time, but isn't too bad to fight with France. Nguyen Tri Phương was sent by Tu Duc to fight not to surrender. But he is useless and untalented. I don't understand why could he attack and win Thai in a long time. Thai even is weaker than

 

[Silent Knight]

it isn't exactly, should remember our king like Minh Mang, Tu Duc or Thieu Tri, especially Minh Mang, Most of them has the strong policy toward our neighbors like Cam and Thailand, We even fought in Cam more than 10 years and encountered many times with Thais, Maybe our weapon and military is weak compared to Quang Trung or Nguyen Anh time, but isn't too bad to fight with France. Nguyen Tri Phương was sent by Tu Duc to fight not to surrender. But he is useless and untalented. I don't understand why could he attack and win Thai in a long time. Thai even is weaker than

Nguyễn Tri Phương and his action during the war was still a matter for debate imo.

But relatively speaking, the Nguyen dynasty pretty much demolished a powerful army and became too weak to resist the French, not to mention the effectiveness of Christian priests and their followers.

But history was made and nothing could change.

 

[Carlosa]

India and Vietnam: Time for Trilaterals With the US and Japan
http://thediplomat.com/2016/09/india-and-vietnam-time-for-trilaterals-with-the-us-and-japan/

During Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit to Vietnam, the bilateral relationship between the two countries needs to be elevated to a comprehensive strategic partnership. The evolving security dynamic in the Indo-Pacific region mandates that both countries should collaborate with greater intensity. Furthermore, while substantive attention needs to be focused on bilateral defense and economic cooperation, the need for expanded partnerships or minilaterals should be given serious consideration by India and Vietnam.

Currently, India is involved in trilateral frameworks such as the U.S.-India-Japan Ministerial Trilateral and India-Japan-Australia trilateral at the official level. It should be noted that in the minilateral frameworks involving India, Japan, and the United States, none of the Southeast Asian countries have been represented. Minilateral frameworks involving India and Vietnam look plausible as there are growing convergences in the regional approaches of both the countries.

At the bilateral level, over the decades, India and Vietnam have shared similar views and interests on the global stage. Immediately after independence, both countries worked for decolonization and shared similar conceptions of Asian Solidarity. Today, both countries are interested in a multipolar Asia. This shared interest in multipolarity was reflected in the joint statement issued during the visit Vietnam’s then prime minister, Nguyen Tan Dung, to Delhi in October 2014. The statement referred to “the necessity of maintaining peace in Asia” and called for continued coordination in regional and international fora. Further, Vietnam has consistently supported India’s quest for membership in the United Nations Security Council. There is also a significant commonality in the regional approaches of India and Vietnam specifically with reference to the policies toward the United States and Japan.

India-Japan relations witnessed significant improvements in the recent past. In 2014, Japan promised to invest $35 billion in India over the next five years and in 2015 a Make in India Special Finance Facility with $12 billion was also initiated. Japan is now a regular participant in the Malabar exercises with India and the United States. India is negotiating with Japan to procure US-2 amphibious aircraft from Japan, and reports suggest that this cooperation may take place under the Make in India initiative.

Similarly, Vietnam has been engaging with Japan under the rubric of “multilateralization and diversification” of its foreign relations. Japan is Vietnam’s biggest bilateral donor, a large trading partner, and the third largest foreign investor in Vietnam. In 2014, Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe and Vietnam’s then-President Truong Tan Sang upgraded the bilateral relationship to an “Extensive Strategic Partnership for Peace and Prosperity in Asia.” Japan has provided six vessels to Vietnam to boost maritime security and Japan’s Self Defense Forces recently docked at Vietnam’s Cam Ranh naval base. Japan is planning to increase the number of defense attaches in Vietnam to facilitate greater cooperation in the security realm between the two countries.

India, Vietnam, and the United States

Given the prolonged war that ended in 1975, Vietnam’s relations with the United States have witnessed a remarkable turnaround. President Bill Clinton and President George W. Bush each visited Vietnam (in 2000 and 2006, respectively). More recently, in 2016, current President Barack Obama visited Vietnam and completely lifted the arms embargo, enabling Vietnam to purchase military equipment such as drones, radars, and P-3 Orion surveillance aircraft from the United States. While there is growing discussion on whether the United States should be provided access to Cam Ranh naval base, it should be noted that access is different from establishment of a foreign military base, which Vietnam may not entertain. Further, Vietnam has signed up to participate in the U.S.-led Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP). Vietnam’s participation in the TPP is based on the premise that the benefits, especially enhanced access for its textile exports, far outweigh the costs associated with this high-standard regional framework.

Similarly, in the recent past, India-U.S. relations have been on an upswing, and there is growing strategic convergence between the two countries. India-U.S. defense trade, which was near zero in 2005, today stands at approximately $10 billion. The countries recently concluded a modified logistic support agreement and have articulated a joint vision for the Indo-Pacific region. India and the United States consider each other as “closest partners” in the realm of defense cooperation.

These strategic convergences make a strong case for India-Vietnam-Japan and India-Vietnam-U.S. trilaterals. Further, the power dynamic in the Asia-Pacific region should not be merely a consequence of machinations of the big powers. India, Japan, and Vietnam should become active players in shaping the power politics in the region and trilaterals are an important platform to effect such changes.

Like India, Vietnam is uncomfortable with military alliances and allowing foreign military powers to operate bases in its territory. These trilateral partnerships are not alliances, but they constitute frameworks of cooperation for enhancing domestic capacities in the realm of economy and defense preparedness. Therefore, they merit serious consideration.

Sanjay Pulipaka works as a Senior Consultant at the Indian Council for Research on International Economic Relations (ICRIER), New Delhi. The views expressed here are personal.

 

[Viet]

What were his options? It was clear the French enjoyed superiority on many fronts.

while the western powers as England, Germany and France made great advances in the military after the years of industrial revolution, Vietnam was virtually stuck in the darkness. Backwardness. We had a large number of warships and artillery but our technology, firepower and tactics lagged light years behind the French.

 

[Silent Knight]

Happy Independence Day

 

[Viet]

Your South Vietnamese compatriot is right, today's China can easily blitz Vietnam in an aerial/naval battle.

So your government is now trying to mend the relationship between the two communist parties, so it is a wise move for Vietnam's national interests. China will keep extending its grip on the SCS to secure its strategic naval assets, while Vietnam keeps the remaining reefs as the status quo.

Even your government has still to recognize CPC as its big brother. And your government is doing what the best to your country accordingly.


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I know it tiger. Our military expert hoangsa must know it. You know it. we lag years behind the army of Thailand and hopeless behind China imperial army. I wonder when we will begin to pay tribute to you