US should give up the idea of cold war 2.0 with China. Because there will never be a good end for it

[kankan326]

Reasons why US should give up the new cold war with China. My personal views. Not from expert.

1, Hard to win the new cold war for US.

Soviet Union was just a military super power, far from economic/technology/science power. It's a natural resources supplier in global market, not so different role than Saudi Arabia. Soviet Union is an overrated country. Soviet Union's failure gave US too much credit and confidence on their ideology(democracy and freedom) and too much war dividend, which formed today's reckless and arrogant US. Honestly to say, US doesn't deserve all these.

When US started the cold war with Soviet Union in 1947, 90% Chinese were illiterate. Today the number of annual STEM graduates in China is more than US+EU+India+Japan combined( No need to suspect China's education quality if you know how Chinese students have been dominating all kinds of international competitions). China alone created an economic pole that in many fields can almost compete with rest world. "China VS other countries" status occurs in many economic items. We know US is luring or forcing its allies to decouple China. Like how it tried to isolate Soviet Union. Put the slim feasibility aside, things are very different this time. It is not only China is isolated from "other countries", also "other countries" is isolated from China. It will not be like "Soveit Union loses, US wins" any more. It would be both sides lose. And China will survive because China's huge talents pool and domestic market can sustain its progress technologically and economincally. One thing is for sure, compared to China, US has weak edurance to bad economy.

2,China will never surrender like Soviet Union did.

As I said, Soviet Union's economy had never been in a good position. Before their country collapsed, most Soviet Union people believed only west model could save them from the dire economy. Some of them even believed US was to help them, as VOA broadcasting narratives described. It is not possible to believe Chinese people would have same feeling toward US when their country is in prosperity and likely to be biggest economy in near future while the US is trying everything to stop all of these. US doesn't have any moral ground to start cold war 2.0, not even the fake ones in the cold war 1.0.

When Trump started the trade war, the most popular comment from Chinese netizens was "赢了吃肉，输了吃屎”（Eat meat if we win. East shit if we lose). There is no decent surrender for big scale countries like China and Russia. Surrender from a cold war is no better than surrender from a hot war. The difference is, the former is one side loss and one side win, and the latter is two sides loss. Personally to say, I think Soviet Union's fall is the most humiliating loss in the human history. It surrendered without firing a single bullet to its enemy. Even though Soviet Union was a military super power, it never tried to use its power to make an adventure to break the iron curtain. Just silently watched the west became richer and richer. Never tried to stop or disturbed their development.

So far China is very self-restrained to all US anti-China measures. Which is quite different from Soviet Union's drastic reactiions when the cold war just started. It means China is far more confident, patient and rational than Soviet Union. Is US hoping China will follow the "US wins, China loses" pass? Let's say it this way, if the worst scenario happens, if China falls, China will drag US to fall together. China has the economic power and military power to do that. And Chinese people will support that.

 

[Viet]

Reasons why US should give up the new cold war with China. My personal views. Not from expert.

1, Hard to win the new cold war for US.

Soviet Union was just a military super power, far from economic/technology/science power. It's a natural resources supplier in global market, not so different role than Saudi Arabia. Soviet Union is an overrated country. Soviet Union's failure gave US too much credit and confidence on their ideology(democracy and freedom) and too much war dividend, which formed today's reckless and arrogant US. Honestly to say, US doesn't deserve all these.

When US started the cold war with Soviet Union in 1947, 90% Chinese were illiterate. Today the number of annual STEM graduates in China is more than US+EU+India+Japan combined( No need to suspect China's education quality if you know how Chinese students have been dominating all kinds of international competitions). China alone created an economic pole that in many fields can almost compete with rest world. "China VS other countries" status occurs in many economic items. We know US is luring or forcing its allies to decouple China. Like how it tried to isolate Soviet Union. Put the slim feasibility aside, things are very different this time. It is not only China is isolated from "other countries", also "other countries" is isolated from China. It will not be like "Soveit Union loses, US wins" any more. It would be both sides lose. And China will survive because China's huge talents pool and domestic market can sustain its progress technologically and economincally. One thing is for sure, compared to China, US has weak edurance to bad economy.

2,China will never surrender like Soviet Union did.

As I said, Soviet Union's economy had never been in a good position. Before their country collapsed, most Soviet Union people believed only west model could save them from the dire economy. Some of them even believed US was to help them, as VOA broadcasting narratives described. It is not possible to believe Chinese people would have same feeling toward US when their country is in prosperous and likely to be biggest economy in near future while the US is trying everything to stop all of these. US doesn't have any moral ground to start cold war 2.0, not even the fake ones in the cold war 1.0.

When Trump started the trade war, the most popular comment from Chinese netizens was "赢了吃肉，输了吃屎”（Eat meat if we win. East shit if we lose). There is no decent surrender for big scale countries like China and Russia. Surrender from a cold war is no better than surrender from a hot war. The difference is, the former is one side loss and one side win, and the latter is two sides loss. Personally to say, I think Soviet Union's fall is the most humiliating loss in the human history. It surrendered without firing a single bullet to its enemy. Even thought Soviet Union was a military super power, it never tries to use its power to make an adventure to break the iron curtain. Just silently watched the west became richer and richer. Never try to stop or disturb their development.

So far China is very self-restrained to all US anti-China measures. Which is quite different from Soviet Union's drastic reactiions when the cold war just started. It means China is far more confident, patient and rational than Soviet Union. Is US hoping China will follow the "US wins, China loses" pass? Let's say it this way, if the worst scenario happens, if China falls, China will drag US to fall together. China has the economic power and military power to do that. And Chinese people will support that.

Could Athens and Sparta coexist? The rise of Germany collided with English empire. Would the latter accept the defeat without a war?
the world is not big enough for two elephants my chinese friend.
As for chinese education, one of my family members was studying in Shanghai she was disappointed I believe I told here several times.

 

[Beast]

Could Athens and Sparta coexist? The rise of Germany collided with English empire. Would the latter accept the defeat without a war?
the world is not big enough for two elephants.

That is right so it can only be China the sole survivor after the conflict is over.

 

[Viet]

That is right so it can only be China the sole survivor after the conflict is over.

Good luck

 

[Beast]

Reasons why US should give up the new cold war with China. My personal views. Not from expert.

1, Hard to win the new cold war for US.

Soviet Union was just a military super power, far from economic/technology/science power. It's a natural resources supplier in global market, not so different role than Saudi Arabia. Soviet Union is an overrated country. Soviet Union's failure gave US too much credit and confidence on their ideology(democracy and freedom) and too much war dividend, which formed today's reckless and arrogant US. Honestly to say, US doesn't deserve all these.

When US started the cold war with Soviet Union in 1947, 90% Chinese were illiterate. Today the number of annual STEM graduates in China is more than US+EU+India+Japan combined( No need to suspect China's education quality if you know how Chinese students have been dominating all kinds of international competitions). China alone created an economic pole that in many fields can almost compete with rest world. "China VS other countries" status occurs in many economic items. We know US is luring or forcing its allies to decouple China. Like how it tried to isolate Soviet Union. Put the slim feasibility aside, things are very different this time. It is not only China is isolated from "other countries", also "other countries" is isolated from China. It will not be like "Soveit Union loses, US wins" any more. It would be both sides lose. And China will survive because China's huge talents pool and domestic market can sustain its progress technologically and economincally. One thing is for sure, compared to China, US has weak edurance to bad economy.

2,China will never surrender like Soviet Union did.

As I said, Soviet Union's economy had never been in a good position. Before their country collapsed, most Soviet Union people believed only west model could save them from the dire economy. Some of them even believed US was to help them, as VOA broadcasting narratives described. It is not possible to believe Chinese people would have same feeling toward US when their country is in prosperous and likely to be biggest economy in near future while the US is trying everything to stop all of these. US doesn't have any moral ground to start cold war 2.0, not even the fake ones in the cold war 1.0.

When Trump started the trade war, the most popular comment from Chinese netizens was "赢了吃肉，输了吃屎”（Eat meat if we win. East shit if we lose). There is no decent surrender for big scale countries like China and Russia. Surrender from a cold war is no better than surrender from a hot war. The difference is, the former is one side loss and one side win, and the latter is two sides loss. Personally to say, I think Soviet Union's fall is the most humiliating loss in the human history. It surrendered without firing a single bullet to its enemy. Even thought Soviet Union was a military super power, it never tries to use its power to make an adventure to break the iron curtain. Just silently watched the west became richer and richer. Never try to stop or disturb their development.

So far China is very self-restrained to all US anti-China measures. Which is quite different from Soviet Union's drastic reactiions when the cold war just started. It means China is far more confident, patient and rational than Soviet Union. Is US hoping China will follow the "US wins, China loses" pass? Let's say it this way, if the worst scenario happens, if China falls, China will drag US to fall together. China has the economic power and military power to do that. And Chinese people will support that.

But one thing u need to take note. There is no way for Soviet to start a war with US nor US against Soviet. If started, it will be end of mankind. The thousands of nuke throw away is gonna destroy the whole globe.

The Soviet knows that. Why US still recognized one China policy and refuse to push towards Taiwan independent? There is the red line for China to start war. A war nobody is winner if US interferes.

Good luck

We don't need luck, we got it by hardwork.

Now what u see China achieved is by the labour of our hard work.

 

[kankan326]

But one thing u need to take note. There is no way for Soviet to start a war with US nor US against Soviet. If started, it will be end of mankind. The thousands of nuke throw away is gonna destroy the whole globe.

The Soviet knows that.

That's why Soviet Union was a coward. During China's Three Kindoms period, the weakest kindom, Shu was the most aggressive one. Because Shu knew time was not on its side. It had to constantly invade Wei Kingdom to interupt its development. Soviet Union was in the same position as Shu was. It should be more bolder to start some conventional wars. And I really doubt US would start nuke war with Soviet Union even if Soviet Union invaded Western European countries.

 

[Stranagor]

Reasons why US should give up the new cold war with China. My personal views. Not from expert.

1, Hard to win the new cold war for US.

Soviet Union was just a military super power, far from economic/technology/science power. It's a natural resources supplier in global market, not so different role than Saudi Arabia. Soviet Union is an overrated country. Soviet Union's failure gave US too much credit and confidence on their ideology(democracy and freedom) and too much war dividend, which formed today's reckless and arrogant US. Honestly to say, US doesn't deserve all these.

When US started the cold war with Soviet Union in 1947, 90% Chinese were illiterate. Today the number of annual STEM graduates in China is more than US+EU+India+Japan combined( No need to suspect China's education quality if you know how Chinese students have been dominating all kinds of international competitions). China alone created an economic pole that in many fields can almost compete with rest world. "China VS other countries" status occurs in many economic items. We know US is luring or forcing its allies to decouple China. Like how it tried to isolate Soviet Union. Put the slim feasibility aside, things are very different this time. It is not only China is isolated from "other countries", also "other countries" is isolated from China. It will not be like "Soveit Union loses, US wins" any more. It would be both sides lose. And China will survive because China's huge talents pool and domestic market can sustain its progress technologically and economincally. One thing is for sure, compared to China, US has weak edurance to bad economy.

2,China will never surrender like Soviet Union did.

As I said, Soviet Union's economy had never been in a good position. Before their country collapsed, most Soviet Union people believed only west model could save them from the dire economy. Some of them even believed US was to help them, as VOA broadcasting narratives described. It is not possible to believe Chinese people would have same feeling toward US when their country is in prosperous and likely to be biggest economy in near future while the US is trying everything to stop all of these. US doesn't have any moral ground to start cold war 2.0, not even the fake ones in the cold war 1.0.

When Trump started the trade war, the most popular comment from Chinese netizens was "赢了吃肉，输了吃屎”（Eat meat if we win. East shit if we lose). There is no decent surrender for big scale countries like China and Russia. Surrender from a cold war is no better than surrender from a hot war. The difference is, the former is one side loss and one side win, and the latter is two sides loss. Personally to say, I think Soviet Union's fall is the most humiliating loss in the human history. It surrendered without firing a single bullet to its enemy. Even thought Soviet Union was a military super power, it never tries to use its power to make an adventure to break the iron curtain. Just silently watched the west became richer and richer. Never try to stop or disturb their development.

So far China is very self-restrained to all US anti-China measures. Which is quite different from Soviet Union's drastic reactiions when the cold war just started. It means China is far more confident, patient and rational than Soviet Union. Is US hoping China will follow the "US wins, China loses" pass? Let's say it this way, if the worst scenario happens, if China falls, China will drag US to fall together. China has the economic power and military power to do that. And Chinese people will support that.

I think another significant difference is that, whereas during or in the immediate Cold War, people were readier to believe in a single source of information such as US mouthpiece VOA or CNN, today, media is more diverse globally and no single narrative dominates fully.

Yet another is, during the Cold War and up until 2008, US was a satisfied power. Now, however, all signs suggest the US is unhappy, whining about the rules of game. No one really likes a status-quo disturber. That explains why US often finds itself outnumbered in many international decision making bodies.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Could Athens and Sparta coexist? The rise of Germany collided with English empire. Would the latter accept the defeat without a war?
the world is not big enough for two elephants my chinese friend.
As for chinese education, one of my family members was studying in Shanghai she was disappointed I believe I told here several times.

The US is so divided right now, and they have no chance to beat China with a de facto civil war like this.

 

[SIPRA]

I doubt that US would ever start a direct war against China or Russia. As Cold War 1, Cold War 2 would also be fought through proxies, with the aim of weakening the opponents.

 

[Viet]

The US is so divided right now, and they have no chance to beat China with a de facto civil war like this.

the US comes closer to you with more military equipment by the days, I admire your confidence.
Unless Trump comes back or another fanatics civil war is not going to happen.

 

[Stranagor]

I doubt that US would ever start a direct war against China or Russia. As Cold War 1, Cold War 2 would also be fought through proxies, with the aim of weakening the opponents.

Agree. The winner will be the one which manages to remain interconnected with, open to and relevant for the rest of the world.

By interconnectedness and openness, I do not only mean economic ties and trade volume.

the US comes closer to you with more military equipment by the days, I admire your confidence.
Unless Trump comes back civil war is not going to happen.

If those equipment are not meant to be used (Otherwise means nuclear exchange), then they are only meant to subdue small weak countries or just to satisfy military lobbies at home.

 

[Dungeness]

the US comes closer to you with more military equipment by the days, I admire your confidence.
Unless Trump comes back civil war is not going to happen.

Well, Chinese defeated US led UN troops 70 years ago, so did Viet Cong in 70's.

 

[Beast]

That's why Soviet Union was a coward. During China's Three Kindoms period, the weakest kindom, Shu was the most aggressive one. Because Shu knew time was not on its side. It had to constantly invade Wei to interupt its development. Soviet Union was in the same position as Shu was. It should be more bolder to start some conventional war. And I really doubt US would start nuke war with Soviet Union even if Soviet Union invaded Western European countries.

I don't think Soviet was cowards. If US attack Soviet and start invading Soviet state, you think Soviet don't dare to throw nuke at NATO forces and US and repel them out?

The crumple of Soviet economy really makes Soviet leadership that direction and policy of theirs, are wrong compare to US capitalism.

Worst of all, they have a weak leader that time.

China is very fortunate to have Deng Xiaoping. Tiananmen square incident is the most dangerous moment of CCP but Deng believe is very strong. He knows where China shall head and what China wants. The opening of economy let him see some light. If Tiananmen square incident happen in 1980. China might start to doubt it's direction and succumb to color revolution.

 

[大汉奸柳传志]

Soviet Union was built on an ideology, once an ideology fails no amount of military action can save it

 

[Beast]

Soviet Union was built on an ideology, once an ideology fails no amount of military action can save it

China is build on support of people.