US feels India has 180m Muslims

[Pakistanisage]

NEW DELHI: The United States believes that there are many more Muslims who live in India than is being officially stated here through census, and 'Islam' here presents a series of dichotomies like most issues affecting the world's largest democracy.

The US views on 'Indian Islam' and its interpretation had found place in one of its diplomatic cable, leaked by WikiLeaks.

Referring to various 'contacts' in India, the cable says that most of them believe that the official figure ( Census 2001) of over 138 million Muslims in India is "under representative" as actual number is "substantially higher" - closer to 160 to 180 million.

Taking sympathetic views of Indian Muslims for their 'liberal' approach, the cable, originated from American embassy in New Delhi in February last year, says that majority of the Muslims live in a very poor condition despite some of the millionaires from the community, like Azim Premji, influence Indian market.

It says: "Iconic celebrities such as Bollywood actor Shahrukh Khan attract legions of fans, while millions of Muslims languish in poverty. Since Independence, three Muslims have been appointed as President, but Muslims are grossly under-represented in Parliament and other elected bodies".

The US embassy cable also refers to the Rajinder Sachar Committee report which in 2006 revealed that Muslims in general fare worse in economic terms than India's Dalits. "These seeming contradictions reflect overall socioeconomic trends in India: a tiny percentage of Muslims thrive, while the vast majority struggles to support themselves".

The cable, however, noted that Indian Muslims are eager to catch up to their compatriots. "Their Sufi heritage, promoting pluralism and tolerance, should leave them well-equipped to compete in secular India. However, lingering resentment from the partition and external influences threaten to divide the community".

US diplomats in their dispatch to Washington also noted in details the composition of Shias and Sunni and existence of tension between two Sunni movements - Barelvi and Deobandi - rooted in differences in ideology, wealth, education and views on reforms. On political front, the dispatch says that Shia and Barelvi leaders have, of late, discussed forming a political alliance to counter Deoband and the increasing influence of Wahabism. The alliance would balance each group's strength: Barelvis have the numbers and Shias have a higher level of education and more contact with the Indian elite.

http://urdutahzeeb.net/articles/blog1.php?p=11869&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

Indian Muslim's Population is closer to 200 Million. They need to convert this numerical power into a Political Force. Stop voting for useless politicians who use Muslims as a VOTE BANK, but do little to improve their lot. Officially, India claims that Muslims are 13.64% of Indian population ( In reality the percentage of Muslims is closer to 18-20 % ), yet they have less than 4% of Indian Government Jobs and less than 2% of college graduates are Muslims ( as per Sachar Report ).

This inequity lies at the heart of Indian hypocrisy and claims of being a secular nation. It is a Hindu nation where Muslims are oppressed on an Institutional basis. In India, Muslims are called Pakistanis and Indian Hindus ask Muslims if they are Indian First or Muslim first. Maybe if they are treated as full citizens of India, they might feel like being Indians and not third class citizens.

 

[Shardul.....the lion]

What are americans upto?
why suddenly plight of indian muslims, after killing thousands and thousands of muslim in Iraq, afghanistan and pakistan?

A census is done by india every 10 yrs. Its huge effort by Govt of India.

Most of all, in view of pakistanis,
any antipakistan article by western newspaper like WSJ, BBC is western propoganda.
And anti-india article in same newspaper, pakistanis feels it is only truth in the world.

I thought pakistanis dont believe a word from americans after NATO attack.

 

[navtrek]

This is terrible.

Good to know.

Nothing terrible in it. Most Muslim families have a bad economic situation only because of lack of education. All have equal opportunities but it needs to be taken up right.

 

[janon]

Indian Muslim's Population is closer to 200 Million. They need to convert this numerical power into a Political Force. Stop voting for useless politicians who use Muslims as a VOTE BANK, but do little to improve their lot. Officially, India claims that Muslims are 13.64% of Indian population ( In reality the percentage of Muslims is closer to 18-20 % ), yet they have less than 4% of Indian Government Jobs and less than 2% of college graduates are Muslims ( as per Sachar Report ).

This inequity lies at the heart of Indian hypocrisy and claims of being a secular nation. It is a Hindu nation where Muslims are oppressed on an Institutional basis. In India, Muslims are called Pakistanis and Indian Hindus ask Muslims if they are Indian First or Muslim first. Maybe if they are treated as full citizens of India, they might feel like being Indians and not third class citizens.

In pakistan, constitutionally no non muslim can occupy certain posts, like president. That is the definition of institutionalised discrimination. First change your own constitution before telling others not to treat minorities as second class citizens. Change your constitution to treat all pakistanis as equals, not just muslims.

 

[IND151]

In pakistan, constitutionally no non muslim can occupy certain posts, like president. First change your own constitution before telling others not to treat minorities as second class citizens.

leave him alone

updya ghdhyawar pani

 

[janon]

Indian Muslim's Population is closer to 200 Million.

India has somewhere between 160-165 million Muslims.

How do you guys sit at home and come up with these numbers? Remarkable ability.

 

[IND151]

i think there are 140 to 150 million Muslims in India

 

[ali.jishan786]

How do you guys sit at home and come up with these numbers? Remarkable ability.

yes,we can't calculate real no. of myslims in India at Home.
but Indeed i am sure that no. of muslims in India is Greater than in pakistan.

 

[Rusty]

In pakistan, constitutionally no non muslim can occupy certain posts, like president. That is the definition of institutionalised discrimination. First change your own constitution before telling others not to treat minorities as second class citizens. Change your constitution to treat all pakistanis as equals, not just muslims.

In the Islamic republic of Pakistan, the ONLY position a non Muslim cannot have is the prime minister. That's it, stop trying to make it sound like non Muslims are widely discriminated against. A non Muslim can be anything else a Muslim can be, but you don't really care about that, you just want to spread your hate for Pakistan.

And as for the prime minister, keep in mind even in American, if you were not born on american land, you cannot become the president. So unless you were born in America Janon, you have 0 chance to become the president there. So you know how they say, people in glass houses and what not.

 

[janon]

In the Islamic republic of Pakistan, the ONLY position a non Muslim cannot have is the prime minister. That's it, stop trying to make it sound like non Muslims are widely discriminated against. A non Muslim can be anything else a Muslim can be, but you don't really care about that, you just want to spread your hate for Pakistan.

And as for the prime minister, keep in mind even in American, if you were not born on american land, you cannot become the president. So unless you were born in America Janon, you have 0 chance to become the president there. So you know how they say, people in glass houses and what not.

Absolutely. In all cuntries, only citizens can become president. But in some countries, only people of the majority religion can become president even if they were born and brought up there, and are no less citizens than others. So yes, in the modern world, most countries have begun to realise that religion should not be a qualification for any office. The topic of the thread was on religion, one of your countrymen said India treats muslims as second class citizens, and I was pointing out that we dont practice it constitutionally. I did not say non muslims are widely discrimanted against, and I did not say a single hateful word or spread hatred. That happened in your imagination. And also, in pakistan a person can be put to death for blasphemy - another tribalism that most of the world has grown beyond.
So don't try to claim that because other countries don't allow non natural born citizens to be president, that somehow compares to religious discrimination. That is not remotely the same.

 

[december]

a group conducted a census in muslim area in trivandrum ,kerala.........they asked so many question to get idea about muslims political view and their attitude towards america and day to day world happenings...........

people got susupecious about the questionaire and compalined police later it was found that the it was done at the request of american company.................

In another incident which happened very lately mugs & soups in which chips were concealed were distributed in muslim area by certian company..........they were caught red handed ...........later they said that it was a part of health survey..health dept & local police said that they were not aware of this survey.................


the seriousness of the case is that it was reported that such surveys were conducted in different muslim populated areas in the country...........


what i want to know is that is our intelligence agencies aware about theese incidents

 

[takeiteasy]

Yes. it is a big news. "made in UK" electronic chips concealed inside a popular US companies Soaps freely distributed among the muslim area. it is really weird. they claim it was to check the frequency of baths and the usage of soap. :p
indeed confusing.

Electronic chip in bath soap raises huge stink
Motion-sensor chips inserted as part of survey to study children’s health, says soap manufacturer
By

VM Sathish

Published Monday, December 12, 2011

Expatriate Indian consumers have become suspicious of a brand of bath soap manufactured by a multinational company after consumers back home complained about an electronic chip embedded in the soap.

Reports from India suggest that a bathing soap-related survey being conducted for Britain-based organisations in Beemapalli near Thiruvananthapuram, Kerala, was called off after residents, who had earlier agreed to the survey, panicked.

Based on police complaints filed by residents, local police took two officials of the surveying agency, Socio Economic Unit Foundation (SEUF), an NGO, into custody, but released them later.

The survey was being conducted for the stated purpose of finding out the health and hygiene habits of the people living in coastal areas, to which the residents of Beemapalli consented. However, once the realisation of an embedded chip in the bathing soap dawned upon the locals, they feared that the soap might 'eavesdrop' on them or even film them in the shower.

The multinational soap company’s representatives say the motion-sensor chip was inserted as part of a behavioural survey to study individual hygiene. The same type of soaps implanted with electronic chips were spotted by customers in Bajpe near Mangalore in Karnataka state, according to reports quoting police officials in Kerala.

According to the soap manufacturer Hindustan Lever, part of the Unilever group, the chips were inserted into its ‘Lifebuoy’ brand of soap to help the company determine actual soap usage by children. The survey conducted among the fishing community of Beemapalli were suspended after residents started a protest march and filed a police complaint.

The health and sanitation survey involved distribution of soaps with embedded electronic chips to respondents near Beemapally. Those who promised to use the soap for five days and return the remaining portion were rewarded with Rs400 (Dh28). This incentive attracted many customers to take part and surveyors made consumers participating in the survey sign documents agreeing for the survey.

According to a sub-inspector who handled the case, a research organisation was entrusted with survey on health and sanitation for more than one Britain-based organisation. After surveyors explained to consumers that a chip was kept inside the soap, they also got declarations from them that they were aware of the chip.

The respondents were supposed to use the soap for five days. The survey team planned to return after five days and collect the used soaps from respondents to download information about soap using habits. The chips were to be inserted in a card reader to generate a graph.

"I am really shocked about these reports coming from India. What is the guarantee that the soaps that we buy from the supermarket are not embedded with similar electronic chips for eavesdropping? The company should speak out and stop using people as guinea pigs. It is an unethical practice," said Mohammed Ali, an expatriate living in Dubai.

Other expats too had the same view. "I don’t know what all products are now embedded with such electronic chips,” said Menon, another expatriate.

The topic is being widely discussed by the Indian media, community members and social network media.

Electronic chip in bath soap raises huge stink - Emirates 24/7

 

[Rusty]

Absolutely. In all cuntries, only citizens can become president. But in some countries, only people of the majority religion can become president even if they were born and brought up there, and are no less citizens than others. So yes, in the modern world, most countries have begun to realise that religion should not be a qualification for any office. The topic of the thread was on religion, one of your countrymen said India treats muslims as second class citizens, and I was pointing out that we dont practice it constitutionally. I did not say non muslims are widely discrimanted against, and I did not say a single hateful word or spread hatred. That happened in your imagination. And also, in pakistan a person can be put to death for blasphemy - another tribalism that most of the world has grown beyond.
So don't try to claim that because other countries don't allow non natural born citizens to be president, that somehow compares to religious discrimination. That is not remotely the same.

Your flag says USA
If you are truly from there then you should know that not every US citizen can become the president.
Only US citizens who are born in the USA.
Why are you ok with that and yet harping on Pakistan?

 

[janon]

Your flag says USA
If you are truly from there then you should know that not every US citizen can become the president.
Only US citizens who are born in the USA.
Why are you ok with that and yet harping on Pakistan?

Read properly. I clearly mentioned natural born citizens. A person who is born and brought up in the usa is fit to be president. A person who is an immigbrant who aquired citizenship cannot. However, a hindu or buddhist born and brough up in pak cannot be pres, because he is not a muslim. Spot the difference? A person born and brought up in pak should be considered to have equal priviledges, in spite of his religion. It is so sad that this has to be spelt out to you in the 21rst century. An immigrant may have lived most of his life outside, and in most cases, been a citizen of a different country, therefore the comparison to religious discrimination is not valid.

Also, stop this habit of comparing to USA every time your country is criticised. This is a common habit - instead of addressing a criticism of your country, quickly make a nonsensically unrelated criticism of the USA. Get rid of the notion that somehow criticising USA for an unrelated issue makes your country look better.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Nothing terrible in it. Most Muslim families have a bad economic situation only because of lack of education. All have equal opportunities but it needs to be taken up right.

Major fact is large part of Muslim concentration is in underdeveloped states like UP , West Bengal and Bihar. As per 2001 census they alone together make up 63 million Muslims i.e almost 50% of what we noted. Also states like Maharashtra and Assam despite higher GDP/per capita , the HDI of the people there is really low.

Muslim_population_by_states