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US attacks 5th time in a week! | PAF patrols Pak skies

batmannow US know very well it will need Pakistan again and again.

But its time Pakistan should revive its foreign policy.

Dear & hounrable jana, mam
Sory to say but , its time to fight !
US already have the knowledge, that our politicians & our top militry leadership is more intersted to get $$ for them and thier relatives, and they havnt have the balls to do anything practicly.
plz, humbly look at the crunnt situation, only words! nothing was done on the other hand, US kept doing , what they wanted too, US admistration dont even like, to comment on that?
but still , our political leadership+militry officials, still walking on the moon.
they still, assumed that they can change the mind set of US war machine?:lol::crazy:

i, guss our militry and political leadership is living in fools pradise, and some day when they will wake up all will be gone forever.( pakistan kaa khuda hafiz):tsk::cry::smitten::pakistan:
 
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WASHINGTON, Sept 13: The Bush administration risks expanding the failed war in Afghanistan into Pakistan, says a US lawmaker while commenting on the US decision to conduct raids into Pakistani territory.

The question of sending US ground troops inside Pakistan seems to have become an

election issue in the United States where voters are scheduled to elect a new president on Nov 4.

There’s a bipartisan support for conducting raids into Fata on suspected terrorist targets, although some lawmakers have spoken against the move as well.

“The president is once again violating international law by invading yet another nation which has not attacked the United States,” said Congressman Dennis Kucinich, an Ohio Democrat.

“Pakistan is a nuclear flash point on the Asian subcontinent … the United States under George Bush is playing with fire,” he warned.

One day before the anniversary of the 9/11 attacks, Rep. Kucinich presented a petition to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi with 50,000 signatures urging the impeachment of President Bush -- adding to the 100,000 he has already filed.

Seattle Congressman Jim McDermott, who has also signed on to the resolution, warned the Bush administration to stop war-mongering.

“The sounds we are hearing and the signals we are seeing from the administration remind me of the months leading up to the invasion of Iraq,” said Mr McDermott, also a Democrat, while commenting on the Bush administration’s new policy of enhanced military engagement in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Congressman Kucinich, however, was more forceful in his denouncement. He reminded President Bush that the situation in Pakistan ‘requires intense diplomacy,’ and urged Congress to block pursuance of the dangerous path.

“The president is once again violating international law by invading yet another nation which has not attacked the United States. Once again, he places our troops and our reputation at risk. Once again, he creates more enemies for America,” Mr Kucinich said in a statement.

“Pakistan’s objections to the illegal US Predator strikes inside the country’s border should be a clear indication of how Pakistan would respond to another illegal attack upon their sovereign nation,’ he added.
 
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ISLAMABAD, Sept 13: Defence Minister Chaudhry Ahmed Mukhtar said on Saturday that the United States had assured Pakistan that it would not violate the country’s territory in future.

Talking to reporters, he said the US could not make any achievement in the war against terrorism without the cooperation of Pakistan.

The statement from the defence minister has come after the killing of about 60 people, including women and children, in frequent attacks of the US planes on the tribal areas.

The minister said the US would not succeed in its search for Al Qaeda chief Osama bin Laden through attacks.He said the arrest of Osama would have no impact on the forthcoming presidential election in the United States.

He claimed that there were no confirmed reports whether Osama was alive or dead.

In reply to a question, he said Pakistan was playing the role of a frontline state in the ongoing war against terrorism.

He said that if any terrorist had taken refuge in Pakistani territory then only the Pakistan army and law-enforcement agencies would take action against him and no one would be allowed to cross the border.

The minister asked the US to provide any information it had about the presence of terrorists in the tribal areas to the Pakistani authorities and the Pakistani troops would take action against the extremists.
 
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MIRANSHAH, Pakistan (AFP) - Two air-to-ground missiles ripped through the sky before smashing into the house where a Taliban leader with close links to Al-Qaeda chief Osama bin Laden was thought to be hiding.

"There was a glittering flash of light and a prolonged roar," said Hameedullah Khan, one of the first on the scene of Monday's suspected US drone strike in the Pakistani town of Dande Darpa Khel, near the Afghan border.


Two white drones circled the area for hours ahead of the attack that left 21 people dead, including women and children, residents told AFP.


"We recovered 10 bodies. Some were mutilated, some charred. We could not identify if the victims were locals or foreigners. But we could distinguish that children were among the dead," Khan said.


Missile strikes targeting Islamic militants in Pakistan's rugged tribal areas in recent weeks have been blamed on US-led coalition forces or CIA drones based in Afghanistan. Pakistan does not have missile-equipped drones.


In the past 12 days, five strikes have been carried out, targeting suspected Taliban or Al-Qaeda bases.


The reputed target of Monday's attack, veteran Taliban commander Jalaluddin Haqqani, was not among those killed, and the devastation left on the ground seems only to have strengthened the Taliban's influence on local civilians.


"After about an hour, the Taliban turned up," said Khan, who helped in the rescue work at Dande Darpa Khel.


"They ringed a building and erected a tent (to treat casualties) nearby," the 35-year-old said.


"Then they recovered more bodies and wounded who were sent to hospital."


Washington says Pakistan's mountainous tribal regions have become a safe haven for Islamic fighters waging an insurgency against international troops based across the border.


But the increasingly frequent missile attacks, for which the United States has not claimed responsibility, are straining Pakistan's relationship with its key ally.


Civilian deaths have stirred local anger and embarrassed the Pakistani government, already struggling to tackle the militancy that has seen 1,200 of its own people die in bombings and suicide attacks in the past year alone.


Pakistan's army, itself engaged in fierce clashes against militants linked to the Taliban and Al-Qaeda in the border regions, has also condemned what it sees as unilateral US action that violates the country's sovereignty.


Residents in Dande Darpa Khel say until recently, one drone would comb the region late at night or early in the morning. But now, two or three will fly together, around the clock.


"They keep on flying in our skies with full immunity and people are scared," said Abdus Khan, a 22-year-old student, adding that the prospect of further attacks may lead people to flee the area.


The US believes that Bin Laden and his deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri, are hiding in the tribal regions, but Pakistan security officials say the increase in missile attacks is ineffective.


"Pakistan's army is fully-fledged in crushing Taliban and Al-Qaeda fighters," a senior military official told AFP.

"The Americans must show patience and let us succeed in our strategy. When they launch unilateral strikes it is only counter-productive," he added.

Riffat Hussain, head of peace and conflict studies at Islamabad's National Defence University, said the strikes were undermining the fight to combat militancy in the tribal belt.

"This is playing into the hands of the extremists, especially when civilian collateral damage is much higher than the actual damage the Americans think they are causing to militant outfits or sanctuaries," Hussain said.

"These attacks will further strain Pakistan's efforts to play up to its role as a key ally of the United States in the global fight against terrorism."
 
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Islamabad, Sept 14, 2008
IRNA

Pakistani analysts have asked the government to halt supplies though its territory to US-led NATO forces in Afghanistan unless the United States stops missiles strikes in the tribal regions.

Scores of people, including women and children, have been killed in missiles fired by US drones in Waziristan tribal region over the past few weeks.

Pakistan has protested over the attacks and the army chief says that such attacks would prove to be counterproductive.

Chairman US Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee Admiral Mullen says the US will carry out unilateral strikes without Pakistan's approval.

Political parties and analysts are unanimous to condemn the US missile strikes and opposition is calling for parliament session to debate the war threats.

Pakistan's former ambassador to Afghanistan and foreign affairs expert Rustam Shah Muhmand said Sunday the government should stop supply line to NATO forces unless the US guarantees that it will not violate air space.

Oil and other items are supplied to the US-led NATO forces in Afghanistan though Pakistan's two major routes Torkham and Chaman.

Muhmand said that the US has intensified missile attacks on Pakistani tribal regions to get political advantage in the upcoming presidential elections.

"The government must review its role in the so-called war on terror if the US continues missiles strikes," he said.

Muhmand said that the US has failed to achieve its goals in Afghanistan and that is why it is adopting aggressive posture to show to the Americans that it is active to hit high value target.

A former army general and senior defense analyst Talat Masood said that the unilateral action by the US troops to hit targets inside Pakistan could not only alienate Pakistanis from the US, but also prove detrimental for the entire region.

He said that NATO clearly distanced itself from the US strikes inside Pakistani borders that it will not take part in a proposed US strategy of conducting raids from Afghanistan against Taliban and al Qaeda militants. The NATO's statement on not to attack inside Pakistan, represents a wise thinking on behalf of the organization.

Another senior news analyst Rasool Bux Raees however expressed concern over the unilateral strikes by the US against suspected targets inside Pakistan.

The analyst made it clear that NATO being an independent organization did not mean to toe US policies on attacks against militants.

When asked if US could take initiative of striking Pakistani areas without the support of NATO, Raees said, "It could be a solo flight, but would severely hurt the feelings of Pakistan and Afghanistan for not taking them into confidence."
 
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LONDON: Prime Minister Gordon Brown has made it clear that he respects Pakistan’s sovereignty and its territorial integrity, British Minister for International Development Shahid Malik said on Sunday.

Malik described reports that Brown was supporting a new strategy of unilateral cross-border bombings into Pakistan from Afghanistan as ‘completely false’.

He said, “It was a disgrace that the truth had been twisted in this manner.”

His assertion comes in the wake of a letter addressed by fellow Labour peer Lord Nazeer Ahmed to Prime Minister Brown, warning him against supporting any United States move to send troops into Pakistan.

Malik said British views would be conveyed to Pakistani President Asif Ali Zardari in his meeting with Brown on Tuesday.

Malik said that those spreading lies were interested in publicity rather than the interests of Pakistan or the United Kingdom. APP
 
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Facing up to “the war in Pakistan”


Reuters | 14 Sep 2008

There has been much hesitation in the world’s media about how to label U.S. military action inside Pakistan’s borders, including a reported ground raid and a series of missile strikes. Do you call it an “invasion”? Or use the more innocuous-sounding “intervention”? In an editorial, the Washington Post gives it a name which is rather striking in its directness. It calls it quite simply, The War in Pakistan.

President George W. Bush’s reported decision in July to step up attacks by U.S. forces in Pakistan’s tribal areas, the newspaper says, was both necessary and long overdue. It acknowledges there is a risk the strikes might prompt a breach between the U.S. and Pakistani armies, or destabilize the new civilian government in Pakistan. But, it says, ”no risk to Pakistan’s political system or its U.S. relations is greater than that of a second 9/11 staged from the tribal territories. U.S. missile and commando attacks must be backed by the best intelligence and must minimize civilian casualties. But they must continue.”

Others are lining up to condemn the new U.S. strategy in Pakistan.

“The Americans are probably right in claiming that Al-Qaeda and the Taleban have regrouped and using bases in Pakistan to launch cross-border raids into Afghanistan,” says Saudi-based Arab News. “They are certainly right in thinking that there will be no peace in Afghanistan while that remains the case. But they have to let the Pakistanis deal with this. If they continue the raids, they risk not merely losing what dwindling support they have in Pakistan but, far worse, alienating the country so thoroughly than no government even vaguely sympathetic to the US and the West can survive there.”

Pakistan’s Daily Times takes this argument further by suggesting that if public opinion turns even more against the United States, “the country will become more vulnerable to Al Qaeda and we will face unpredictable odds. According to nuclear theory, Pakistan is a nuclear power and cannot be attacked. If the US attacks Pakistani territory, battles with the Pakistan army, stops military assistance to Pakistan, and thus ends up making Al Qaeda supreme in Pakistan, the nuclear theory might then apply to Al Qaeda.”

In the Huffington Post, Shuja Nawaz writes that “the next time the US physically invades Pakistani territory to take out suspected militants, it may meet the Pakistan army head on. Or it may face a complete cut-off of war supplies and fuel in Afghanistan via Pakistan. With only two weeks supply of fuel available to its forces inside Afghanistan and no alternative route currently available, the war in Afghanistan may come to a screeching halt.”

Nawaz adds that both Pakistan and the United States need to rethink their actions. ”Otherwise, the US will not only lose an ally in Pakistan but ignite a conflagration inside that huge and nuclear-armed country that will make the war in Afghanistan seem like a Sunday hike in the Hindu Kush.”

Scary stuff then, with lots of massive risks being talked about on both sides of the argument, from another 9/11 to al Qaeda taking charge of Pakistan.

So here is a completely different view from Juan Cole in Informed Comment. “The original al Qaeda is defeated,” he says. Do read his post before leaping to judgment on this assertion, as he makes some interesting points, including arguing that the Taliban are driven more by Pashtun nationalism than by a desire to spread terrorism around the world.

“Although the US is worried about the Arab volunteers who take refuge among the resurgent Taliban, they are a tiny element and cannot easily launch international terrorist operations from FATA (Pakistan’s Federally Administered Tribal Areas),” he writes. Based on an analysis of al Qaeda’s capabilities around the world, including in Iraq, he concludes; “For now, our war is over. Time to come home, and train and fund locals to do the clean-up work.”

Just suppose for a minute that his argument were to turn out to be correct. Then is the United States opening up a third front after Iraq and Afghanistan, but this time on the territory of a nuclear-armed country, for the wrong reasons?
 
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How exactly did you come to this conclusion that PA is not capable to handle these terrorists. Also have you even bothered to analyze, how capable the US is which even after the passing of seven years has failed miserably in both Iraq and Afghanistan and now to cover this shame is shifting all blame on to Pakistan and wants to make Pakistan as its next scape goat. Pakistanis maybe divided and that too for obvious reasons but when it comes to external threat, somehow the nation gets untied. Till date i have met not a single Pakistani both from educated class and uneducated who was against the remarks of the army chief. The nations reaction is so strong that you cant imagine. PA might be inferior to both NATO and US when it comes to equipment but thats not all that makes PA the best in the business. When it comes to defending the mother land and specially when the whole nation is backing it up, you should be able to predict results what will happen to these yanks once they decide to cross the border.

Hon. IceCold:

No doubt you have a point. However I have not seen Pakistanis united against an external threat except in 1965. They certainly weren’t in 1971. Regarding the capability of PA to control the militants, you may chose to ignore the attacks on convoys, kidnapping of the whole companies and attack on the training areas, the facts speak for themselves. I have always believed that PA is an army of lions led by the donkeys. Brig Zafar Alam implies the same in his book “the ways it was”.

Regarding the US army, don’t think they will enter Pakistan in large numbers; they will use predators, especially the cruise missiles to destroy Pakistan's assets. I have heard ex COAS Gen Musharraf on TV admitting that reason why he did a u-turn on Taliban issue was that he analysed possible scenario of confrontation with the US and found that co-operation was the best option. However if you have better info than the COAS, it is another matter.

I am posting a poignant article from today’s Dawn for you benefit. You have of course every right to hold a different opinion.


Miscreants and militants




By Tasneem Siddiqui


“THERE are a handful of miscreants, and we will sort them out in no time,” thundered Gen Yahya Khan. The date was March 24 1971, the occasion: the launching of a crackdown against the Awami League and its supporters. A foreign correspondent asked how many of these ‘miscreants’ were there.

Before Yahya Khan could reply, a colleague whispered in the correspondent’s ear, “only four and half crores [45 million]”.

This was no joke. The crackdown soon transformed into a full-fledged military action against Bengalis, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people. With a few exceptions, no one from the western wing raised a protesting voice. The Bengalis, who had once been at the forefront of the Pakistan Movement and were more in number than the West Pakistanis, were ultimately declared secessionists and pushed out of the federation. It was a unique case of its own kind, a minority declaring a majority secessionists.

Pakistan is an interesting country in many ways. At one time or another in its history, large chunks of its population have been declared either ‘anti-state’, ‘secessionist’, ‘miscreant’, ‘terrorist’, ‘militant’ or ‘extremist’ by its own rulers. It is also interesting that while the population of one province or a political party is so declared, others watch in silence or enjoy their chagrin.

Treason factories started working right in 1947, when a freedom fighter like Khan Abdul Ghaffar Khan was declared ‘anti-state’. Soon after, hundreds of Khudai Khidmatgars were brutally killed at Bhabhra. In the mid-1950s, the United Front government of East Pakistan which had defeated the Muslim League by a landslide, was not allowed to function properly and was ultimately dismissed on flimsy charges. Maulvi Fazlul Haq, who had presented the Pakistan Resolution on March 23, 1940 was declared a ‘traitor’.

The people of Balochistan and their leaders have been the most unfortunate. Starting with a forced merger of Kalat with Pakistan, they have repeatedly faced the wrath of the Pakistan establishment. Ayub Khan, Zulfikar Ali Bhutto and Pervez Musharraf each in turn declared the Baloch nationalist leaders enemies of Pakistan and either imprisoned or killed them. Thousands of Marri, Bugti and Mengal tribesmen had to flee the country to save their lives. Many of them died in exile in miserable conditions.

Next it was the turn of rural Sindh to face the might of the state. The 1977 coup led by Gen Ziaul Haq and the ‘judicial murder’ of Zulfikar Ali Bhutto in 1979 had hurt the sentiments of the Sindhi population and most of them felt alienated from the state. In 1984 they found a chance to express their bitterness through the MRD movement which was suppressed with brute force. Urban Sindh, which did not support the MRD movement, but observed the torture and merciless killing of rural Sindhis from the sidelines, was next in line.

In 1991 the army chief declared the MQM a ‘terrorist’ organisation and launched a crackdown against it. The circle was now complete. Except for Punjab, people from all the other provinces had either been declared traitors or terrorists, or both.

It must be said to the credit of ordinary Pakistanis that in spite of all exploitation, suppression, coercion, intimidation, subversion, torture, imprisonment and rigged elections (Arundhati Roy’s words describing the situation in Jammu and Kashmir), they showed resilience and bounced back every time whether it was separation of East Pakistan, military action in Balochistan or the reign of terror in Karachi.

Pakistan had many basic problems, but till the early 1980s it remained a peaceful country by and large. There was no religious, sectarian or ethnic violence and people were going to their mosques, imambargahs, temples, churches, schools and colleges without any fear. Streets were safe and the display of arms very rare. But things started changing when with Saudi money and American armament Pakistan found itself at the forefront of the war against Soviet Russia. Similarly, in order to stop the increasing influence of the revolution in Shia Iran, militant Wahabi Islam was promoted as a matter of state policy.

Now for the first time we saw the state, which so far had been fighting against ‘miscreants’, and ‘extremists’, producing, patronising protecting promoting and arming its own brand of militants calling them ‘jihadis’ or ‘mujahideen’. Of course they were fighting a holy war in Afghanistan and Kashmir but its natural consequence was the rise of obscurantism and fanaticism in Pakistan.

At that time perceptive observers had warned that once the Afghan war was over, Pakistan would have to bear the backlash. Fears of brutalisation of society were also expressed. But all sane advice went unheeded. Things could still be controlled if Pakistan’s military junta had extricated itself from the Afghan quagmire after the Soviet withdrawal. But unfortunately, this development gave new ideas to Pakistan’s ruling class. Now they started talking about ‘strategic depth’ and a puppet government in Afghanistan to safeguard Pakistan’s interests on a permanent basis.

The Mujahideen/Taliban were seen by the army as the country’s second line of defence on its western frontier. Some hawks also started talking of the ‘revival of the glory of Islam’ by establishing a medieval theocratic state in Afghanistan.

However, 9/11 changed the whole scenario and the Americans asked Pakistan to take a 180-degree turn. On the surface, Gen Musharraf accepted US dictation but the army continued with its Afghan policy while taking only superficial actions against the Taliban for the world’s consumption. Fast forward to 2008. An operation which started in South Waziristan against ‘foreign’ militants some years back, has gradually engulfed almost half of the Frontier province. Now no one knows who is fighting whom and for what purpose. The list of militant groups is daunting. We have the Al Qaeda, Afghan Taliban, Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan, Lashkar-i-Islam and leaders like Sufi Mohammad, Baitullah Mehsud and Mangal Bagh to name just a few.

In Kurram Agency two tribes are fighting against each other (the ISPR spokesperson is shy of calling them Shias and Sunnis). In Balochistan a low-level insurgency is going on against state coercion. While all this continues, nobody can distinguish the ISI creations from the genuine militants. Indira Gandhi had one Bhindranwale, but the Pakistan Army has many in its cupboard.

The problem is that for our military high command, their narrow institutional interests come first, and most of the time they equate their interests with national interests. But now we are facing a catch-22 situation. On the one hand, the Pakistani Army has neither the capacity nor the willingness to fight an all-out war against the militants, and on the other, it is not ready to allow the civilian government to take control of the Afghan policy. Will it be too much to expect that it will learn from its past mistakes and develop a national consensus before it is too late?

DAWN - Opinion; September 15, 2008
 
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US troops' attempt to enter inside Pakistan's territory foiled
Updated at: 1210 PST, Monday, September 15, 2008


WANA: Pakistan Army and local tribes on Monday foiled an attempt of US troops to enter inside Pakistan’s territory through two American helicopters.

According to sources, US troops boarded on two helicopters were trying to enter onto Pakistan’s areas near Angoor Adda along Pak-Afghan border when local tribes and troops of Pakistan army resisted the move and opened fire, forcing US helicopters to return.

Sources said situation remains tense in the area while local tribals along with Pakistan army are also positioned to face any untoward situation.


US troops' attempt to enter inside Pakistan's territory foiled

Had enough, its time to kick US *** :sniper:
 
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US troops' attempt to enter inside Pakistan's territory foiled
Updated at: 1210 PST, Monday, September 15, 2008


WANA: Pakistan Army and local tribes on Monday foiled an attempt of US troops to enter inside Pakistan’s territory through two American helicopters.

According to sources, US troops boarded on two helicopters were trying to enter onto Pakistan’s areas near Angoor Adda along Pak-Afghan border when local tribes and troops of Pakistan army resisted the move and opened fire, forcing US helicopters to return.

Sources said situation remains tense in the area while local tribals along with Pakistan army are also positioned to face any untoward situation.


US troops' attempt to enter inside Pakistan's territory foiled

Had enough, its time to kick US *** :sniper:

:pakistan::pakistan: that the way.

time to use stingers, shoot down their helis
 
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US troops' attempt to enter inside Pakistan's territory foiled
Updated at: 1210 PST, Monday, September 15, 2008


WANA: Pakistan Army and local tribes on Monday foiled an attempt of US troops to enter inside Pakistan’s territory through two American helicopters.

According to sources, US troops boarded on two helicopters were trying to enter onto Pakistan’s areas near Angoor Adda along Pak-Afghan border when local tribes and troops of Pakistan army resisted the move and opened fire, forcing US helicopters to return.

Sources said situation remains tense in the area while local tribals along with Pakistan army are also positioned to face any untoward situation.


US troops' attempt to enter inside Pakistan's territory foiled

Had enough, its time to kick US *** :sniper:

Thats the way to go. Time has indeed come to kick the stinky *** of these yanks.:sniper::usflag:
 
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