US' Afghan Pull-Out to Create New Challenges for China, Pakistan – Analysts

[Yankee-stani]

Unfortunately it's true if you meet any indian in abroad he is fine to you but if you meet some afghani he is always hostile towards you

I noticed that as well Indians abroad in real life are not as the ultra-nationalistic trolls you find on PDF but Afghans In real life will always be complaining about Pakistan and "muh Durand line"

 

[truthseer]

Another example of US creating trouble, then running away. Mark my works, it'll get much, much worse when they leave, then we'll fix the mess.

And we'll be blamed for it

 

[Indus Pakistan]

I hope the same brother 40 years of instabilty has to end and its effects on Pakistan as well

Don't forget. After 9/11 and over 5000 dead Zbigniew Brzezinski was aked was supporting the Mujihadeen worth it for US? His reply. Yes, absolutely. Demise of Soviet Union, end of cold War, freedom of Eastern Europe.

Now, after 40 years of trouble ask the same question about Pakistan. The answer. Think of this "the bomb". We owe the bomb thanks to Afghans.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1453065

 

[Khanate]

It probably left the negotiating team with the Taliban with shaky hands. The pullout will happen but Trumps impatience will hand over greater concessions to the Taliban. At this juncture it is important that our connections remain strong with both "sides" of the actual power play and we "help" the US with a "positive" withdrawal.

Indian influence is now going to try and leverage on Iran with the promise of trade and investment which the Iranian desperately need. It is here where we need to use a mix of diplomacy and covert warfare to create a killing field for Indian influence in Afg one the Taliban really take hold.

Going by Kulbhushan Jadhav's confession, Indian embassies and consulates in Afghanistan are snake pits. On the flip side, the killing field for Indian influence will bring peace in Balochistan.

 

[Yankee-stani]

Don't forget. After 9/11 and over 5000 dead Zbigniew Brzezinski was aked was supporting the Mujihadeen worth it for US? His reply. Yes, absolutely. Demise of Soviet Union, end of cold War, freedom of Eastern Europe.

Now, after 40 years of trouble ask the same question about Pakistan. The answer. Think of this "the bomb". We owe the bomb thanks to Afghans.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1453065

Ice Cold Geo-Political goals always trumps emotions its something us Pakistanis should learn in this day and age enough of this "Arab larping'' and "Muh Rohingya" larping as well

 

[HttpError]

Don't forget. After 9/11 and over 5000 dead Zbigniew Brzezinski was aked was supporting the Mujihadeen worth it for US? His reply. Yes, absolutely. Demise of Soviet Union, end of cold War, freedom of Eastern Europe.

Now, after 40 years of trouble ask the same question about Pakistan. The answer. Think of this "the bomb". We owe the bomb thanks to Afghans.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1453065

Very true, if it wasn't for Afghanistan (fighting against Soviets) it would have been almost impossible to get a nuclear bomb.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

The brutal fact is there is no way, I mean no way would USA have allowed Pakistan even sniff "nukes". Think of Iran, Iraq. If in 2001 America could threaten "bomb you to stone age" and cause Musharaf to quiver in fear please tell me what would have happened in 1980 if USA had threatened "bomb you to stone age" or give up the nuke idea.

The reality was trhe Afghan jihad and million dead Afghans under Soviet attack gave Pakistan a licence to continue to build the nukes and through out the 1980s even recieve $ billions and advanced weapons from USA like F-16s etc. USA turned a blind eye to Pakistan's nuke project. Now you can ask yourself the question was the trouble Pakistan got out of the Afghan adventure worth it?

Well, it depends what premium you give Pakistani nukes ....


Afghan war helped Pakistan keep nuclear option: US papers

WASHINGTON: Torn between preventing Pakistan from going nuclear and fighting the Soviets in Afghanistan, the United States appears to have decided that pushing the Russians out of Kabul was more important, shows a set of documents released by the US State Department.


Official US memos and letter — released under an arrangement to make public official documents after 30 years — show that Chinese leader Deng Xiaoping (in office from 1978 to 1989) also played a key role in convincing Washington to continue to support Islamabad despite its nuclear programme.


https://www.dawn.com/news/1453065

 

[Khanate]

Don't forget. After 9/11 and over 5000 dead Zbigniew Brzezinski was aked was supporting the Mujihadeen worth it for US? His reply. Yes, absolutely. Demise of Soviet Union, end of cold War, freedom of Eastern Europe.

Now, after 40 years of trouble ask the same question about Pakistan. The answer. Think of this "the bomb". We owe the bomb thanks to Afghans.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1453065

There were other considerations as well.

At the time, Pakistan was sandwitched between a communist China, a socialist India and a revolutionary Iran. The arrival of Soviets in Afghanistan only added to the Western anxiety that the entire region will go dark. Otherwsie, CIA knew what was going on with the nuclear program.

 

[truthseer]

The brutal fact is there is no way, I mean no way would USA have allowed Pakistan even sniff "nukes". Think of Iran, Iraq. If in 2001 America could threaten "bomb you to stone age" and cause Musharaf to quiver in fear please tell me what would have happened in 1980 if USA had threatened "bomb you to stone age" or give up the nuke idea.

That was biggest tactical error by Musharraf though. If Americans couldn't attack Afghanistan, they sure as hell couldn't attack us without a launching base.

 

[Yankee-stani]

The brutal fact is there is no way, I mean no way would USA have allowed Pakistan even sniff "nukes". Think of Iran, Iraq. If in 2001 America could threaten "bomb you to stone age" and cause Musharaf to quiver in fear please tell me what would have happened in 1980 if USA had threatened "bomb you to stone age" or give up the nuke idea.

The reality was trhe Afghan jihad and million dead Afghans under Soviet attack gave Pakistan a licence to continue to build the nukes and through out the 1980s even recieve $ billions and advanced weapons from USA like F-16s etc. USA turned a blind eye to Pakistan's nuke project. Now you can ask yourself the question was the trouble Pakistan got out of the Afghan adventure worth it?

Well, it depends what premium you give Pakistani nukes ....


Afghan war helped Pakistan keep nuclear option: US papers

WASHINGTON: Torn between preventing Pakistan from going nuclear and fighting the Soviets in Afghanistan, the United States appears to have decided that pushing the Russians out of Kabul was more important, shows a set of documents released by the US State Department.


Official US memos and letter — released under an arrangement to make public official documents after 30 years — show that Chinese leader Deng Xiaoping (in office from 1978 to 1989) also played a key role in convincing Washington to continue to support Islamabad despite its nuclear programme.


https://www.dawn.com/news/1453065

Mushy in 2001 was pretty cucky at best even with the Nukes, for all the hype we destroyed Afghanistan blah blah and the blame for the instabilty of that country we did not the Afghans themselves got themselves in the pit of doom, we did benefit by getting nukes but the full benefits were trashed because of idiotic Pakistani politicians and frankly Nawaz/Benazir musical chairs

There were other considerations as well.

At the time, Pakistan was sandwitched between a communist China, a socialist India and a revolutionary Iran. The arrival of Soviets in Afghanistan only added to the Western anxiety that the entire region will go dark. Otherwsie, CIA knew what was going on with the nuclear program.

And Pakistan got along with Communist China pretty well during that time lol

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Otherwsie, CIA knew what was going on with the nuclear program.

You know and I know those considersations by themselves would not have been strong enough to prevent USA from going for Pakistan. Israel would [was] pushing for this but the strategic calculus created by Afghan jihad was too important and as documents show [even Chinese got involved] USA held back. Please do read the link below. I know you have this thing against Afghans but don't let that cloud reality. Hard reality as seen in unclassified documents.


"WASHINGTON: Torn between preventing Pakistan from going nuclear and fighting the Soviets in Afghanistan, the United States appears to have decided that pushing the Russians out of Kabul was more important, shows a set of documents released by the US State Department."


https://www.dawn.com/news/1453065

 

[Yankee-stani]

You know and I know those considersations by themselves would not have been strong enough to prevent USA from going for Pakistan. Israel would [was] pushing for this but the strategic calculus created by Afghan jihad was too important and as documents show [even Chinese got involved] USA held back. Please do read the link below. I know you have this thing against Afghans but don't let that cloud reality. Hard reality as seen in unclassified documents.


"WASHINGTON: Torn between preventing Pakistan from going nuclear and fighting the Soviets in Afghanistan, the United States appears to have decided that pushing the Russians out of Kabul was more important, shows a set of documents released by the US State Department."


https://www.dawn.com/news/1453065

And the Iron bros saved Pak lol

Deng points out that India started the nuclear race in South Asia, causing Pakistan to start its own programme.

“Pakistan has its own arguments, i.e., India has exploded a nuclear device but the world has not seemed to complain about this,” Deng told Brown.

“So, now you have decided to put this aside and solve the question of military and economic aid to Pakistan. We applaud this decision,” said Deng.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Otherwsie, CIA knew what was going on with the nuclear program.

More then knew. In 1976 Kissinger had even come to Pakistan to warn Bhutto to give up the nuke project. The fact was USA was out to stop Pakisatan but then bang landed the news of Soviet invasion of Afghanistan in 1979 changing the geo-strategic reality tha gave Pakistan the licence to continue building nukes. Please take the time to read the full article. Link provided below.

The US tried to persuade the Pakistani leadership through all means. Henry Kissinger, the US secretary of state, visited Pakistan in August 1976 when the PPP government was treading towards holding elections. On Aug 10, when Bhutto was in Lahore, Kissinger called on him at the Governor House and tried to dissuade him from acquiring the plant. During the meeting Kissinger expressed displeasure over Pakistan’s dealings with France.


Thirty years later, the memos about the meeting released by George Washington University’s National Security Archive, in May 2006, referred to Kissinger telling Bhutto that it was offensive to US intelligence when Bhutto insisted that Pakistan needed the reprocessing plant for its energy needs; Bhutto responded by demanding that the US should also not insist that Pakistan give up the reprocessing plant. Kissinger made it clear: “What concerns us is how the reprocessing facilities were used at a certain point.” At that stage Bhutto reiterated the assurances and safeguards for nuclear facilities, to which Kissinger said that he was concerned about “realities not words; safeguards deals were not enough because one side could break an agreement”. Bhutto reassured him that Pakistan would not explode a bomb but the memos with the archive show that Pakistan expressed the intention to continue its nuclear development programme. After the meeting Bhutto told the newsmen that he was satisfied with the talks.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1023467

 

[Khanate]

And Pakistan got along with Communist China pretty well during that time lol

Which only makes Pakistan more vulunerable to the communist ideology. Their were plenty of card carrying communists in Pakistan who would have gladly presided over this transformation project. The anxiety was real.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

killing field for Indian influence in Afg

And so it will be. It will be "Hindu Kush" v2.