Ukraine sets task of building Europe's strongest army, returning Crimea — security chief

[ptldM3]

I dont know why people dismissed Ukraine Military Strength this quick, think about they had just fought and currently stablised a Russian Backing coup...Thatsin itself is something.

As we can see in the begining of the wa, Ukraine Military is literally thrid rated, yet they can hold out for a Russian backing invasion for a year. I dont remember can anyone do that.

In time, Ukrainian Military is going to get stronge, we already see the high water mark for the seperatist, as they tried, but none success to expand the front line, the front line is from now going to be pushed back into Russian side.

Dont forget, Ukraine only uses National Guard, Interior Troop and volunteer to fight the war at donbass, their army, yes abit small, was held back during the conflict.

Are you being serious?


For starters, many of the fighters are locals they can be distinguished from the dialect. As for arms, Russia has provided arms but the Ukrainians have abandoned or surrendered dozens if not hundreds of pieces of heavy military equipment. Your choice of words is also a bit wrong, it is not that Ukraine can "hold out" a Russian "invasion" for a year, it is that they can not drive out the "pro Russians", in fact the Ukrainian side has been in retreat ever since they recaptured Slavyansk.

 

[Beast]

Are you being serious?


For starters, many of the fighters are locals they can be distinguished from the dialect. As for arms, Russia has provided arms but the Ukrainians have abandoned or surrendered dozens if not hundreds of pieces of heavy military equipment. Your choice of words is also a bit wrong, it is not that Ukraine can "hold out" a Russian "invasion" for a year, it is that they can not drive out the "pro Russians", in fact the Ukrainian side has been in retreat ever since they recaptured Slavyansk.

And fancy jhungary called himself professional? Maybe a salesman

 

[jhungary]

Wrong. Russia never supported pro Russian rebels. Putin wants Ukraine to be whole and strong or else he would have recognized Donbas like he recognized Abkhazia and South Ossetia.

If Ukraine ever dares to make a move on Crimea, which is officially Russian territory, then I guarantee you Ukraine would cease to exist.

Do you realise the red part contradict the blue part?

We can dismiss it becos it has miserable military budget of $3.2 billion US dollar.

While Russia has at least USD80 billion.

as if that does matter lol.

US - 685 billions Military Budget
Afghanistan - Less 2 billions.

Who have to leave who after 14 years war?

Are you being serious?


For starters, many of the fighters are locals they can be distinguished from the dialect. As for arms, Russia has provided arms but the Ukrainians have abandoned or surrendered dozens if not hundreds of pieces of heavy military equipment. Your choice of words is also a bit wrong, it is not that Ukraine can "hold out" a Russian "invasion" for a year, it is that they can not drive out the "pro Russians", in fact the Ukrainian side has been in retreat ever since they recaptured Slavyansk.

Ahh, the good old Russia did not involve in Ukraine.

lol, if you think so. But the fact and truth seems to disagree with you. But then again, you will simply brush it down to western imperialist propaganda...lol

 

[ih8viet]

Now if only dreams came true..

 

[ptldM3]

Ahh, the good old Russia did not involve in Ukraine.

lol, if you think so. But the fact and truth seems to disagree with you. But then again, you will simply brush it down to western imperialist propaganda...lol

Try reading what i wrote carefully then read what you just posted. Also what "truth" disagrees with me?

The fact that many of the fighters speak with a local dialect?

The fact that Ukraine has been in retreat since the Slavyansk offensive?

Or the fact that much of equipment that the rebels use is abandoned Ukrainian equipment?

 

[Beast]

Do you realise the red part contradict the blue part?



as if that does matter lol.

US - 685 billions Military Budget
Afghanistan - Less 2 billions.

Who have to leave who after 14 years war?

Of coz money matter, if Ukraine is going to take back Crimea. It will be a conventional war involved fighter jet vs fighter jet, tank vs tank and troops vs troops. Fancy you using insurgent war making a comparison?

Anybody who thinks USD3.2 billion is going to stand up against Russia USD80 billion in a conventional war is going to get his head check.

 

[jhungary]

Try reading what i wrote carefully then read what you just posted. Also what "truth" disagrees with me?

The fact that many of the fighters speak with a local dialect?

The fact that Ukraine has been in retreat since the Slavyansk offensive?

Or the fact that much of equipment that the rebels use is abandoned Ukrainian equipment?

fact is, Russian send Russian Marine wearing Marine Uniform with Marine Unit patch and riding in battle in Ukrain with T72BM and T80, tanks that Ukrainian did not field

And yes, those are propaganda according to you as there areno Russian force fighting in Ukraine right?

LOL why do I waste my time with you?

you can denied what you want, but My Ukrainian friend I made in Iraq said 3 out of 5 captured soldier his unit capture speak RUSSIAN WITH EASTERN ACCENT, in case you dont know Ukrainian dont speak Russian with Eastern Accents, only Russian bordered China do. And depending on source, Russian, not etethnic Russian of Ukrainian descents madd up of 40 to 85%of the rebel fighting dorce

But yeah, he must be lying, according to you...

Of coz money matter, if Ukraine is going to take back Crimea. It will be a conventional war involved fighter jet vs fighter jet, tank vs tank and troops vs troops. Fancy you using insurgent war making a comparison?

Anybody who thinks USD3.2 billion is going to stand up against Russia USD80 billion in a conventional war is going to get his head check.

so you want to send at least 1/3 of afghani for a head check? Hope China can pay for.them lol

 

[ptldM3]

fact is, Russian send Russian Marine wearing Marine Uniform with Marine Unit patch and riding in battle in Ukrain with T72BM and T80, tanks that Ukrainian did not field

There was one guy in a video with a Russian marine patch and this is evidence? There has been rebel fighters wearing German and British insignia flags, does it mean that they are German or British? I have seen Russian, Dutch, British, American, Ukrainian and German uniforms/patch insignia.

By your token also, the Ukrainian soldiers must be waffen ss time travlers too considering some have been seen sporting waffen ss lightning insignia.


As for tanks Russia has provided them, unfortunately people like you probably do not know the difference between T-62s, T-72s and T-80s. Ukraine has used all three in the conflict.

you can denied what you want, but My Ukrainian friend I made in Iraq said 3 out of 5 captured soldier his unit capture speak RUSSIAN WITH EASTERN ACCENT, in case you dont know Ukrainian dont speak Russian with Eastern Accents, only Russian bordered China do. And depending on source, Russian, not etethnic Russian of Ukrainian descents madd up of 40 to 85%of the rebel fighting dorce



But yeah, he must be lying, according to you...

I was born in eastern Russia near China and half of my family is from Ukraine, tell me more i seem to be so ignorant.


As for Russians, yes there are plenty of volunteers from Russia. Your friend i do not know, as so i do not know if he was personally on the front line or not but most Ukrainians keep repeating what their media propaganda machine tells them those who do not end up being beat up or arrested. Ukraine's top general claimed Russia used nuclear weapons in Donetsk airport. Everyone knows that is not true, but it did not stop Ukrainian media and many ordinary Ukrainians from claiming it was. So does the Ukrainian military lie? Absolutely, has your friend never lied, has he never bend the truth, has he never repeated what others told him? Ukrainian soldiers claim they have not seen a single Russian fighting in Ukraine others say they have.

 

[jhungary]

There was one guy in a video with a Russian marine patch and this is evidence? There has been rebel fighters wearing German and British insignia flags, does it mean that they are German or British? I have seen Russian, Dutch, British, American, Ukrainian and German uniforms/patch insignia.

By your token also, the Ukrainian soldiers must be waffen ss time travlers too considering some have been seen sporting waffen ss lightning insignia.


As for tanks Russia has provided them, unfortunately people like you probably do not know the difference between T-62s, T-72s and T-80s. Ukraine has used all three in the conflict.













I was born in eastern Russia near China and half of my family is from Ukraine, tell me more i seem to be so ignorant.


As for Russians, yes there are plenty of volunteers from Russia. Your friend i do not know, as so i do not know if he was personally on the front line or not but most Ukrainians keep repeating what their media propaganda machine tells them those who do not end up being beat up or arrested. Ukraine's top general claimed Russia used nuclear weapons in Donetsk airport. Everyone knows that is not true, but it did not stop Ukrainian media and many ordinary Ukrainians from claiming it was. So does the Ukrainian military lie? Absolutely, has your friend never lied, has he never bend the truth, has he never repeated what others told him? Ukrainian soldiers claim they have not seen a single Russian fighting in Ukraine others say they have.

lol again, I dont know anything...

lol you can go live in your world of denial and say Russia does not involve in the conflict. Thats honestly, your choice, but I did laugh a little when you say I dont know the different between T62, T72 and T80 lol

I been on all 3 in my Army days.

I personally, as a cavalry commander, inspect a T72 and T62 left behind in Iraq and I was on a Pakistani T80 when I was in Islamabad for training the last time.

May I ask which tank you have been on?

LOL the rest of your post is a moot point.

 

[ptldM3]

lol again, I dont know anything...

Apparently you seem to claim to know more about Russian and Ukrainian dialects then me.

lol you can go live in your world of denial and say Russia does not involve in the conflict. Thats honestly, your choice, but I did laugh a little when you say I dont know the different between T62, T72 and T80 lol

You obviously do not read my posts. I never denied that Russia has sent supplies, i suggest actually reading my posts before posting.

I personally, as a cavalry commander, inspect a T72 and T62 left behind in Iraq and I was on a Pakistani T80 when I was in Islamabad for training the last time.

May I ask which tank you have been on?

Every conversation you are in you claim to 'have been' or 'know someone'. If we talk about the space shuttle you will claim you have flown in it, we we talk about pak-fa you will claim you have a friend that designed it, ect. Even if we assume you are truthful, it makes no difference when talking about the debate. You claimed that there were Russian model T-72s and T-80s, i also claimed that Russia did provided equipment and that the tanks you mentioned (T-72, T-62 and T-80) are also used by the Ukrainian army. What is your point? You are not even reading my posts and assume i claim otherwise.


Again what point are you trying to prove?

 

[Homo Sapiens]

Look at the MAP Ukraine is tiny compared to Russia. Ukraine can never challenge Russia.

No it doesn't. Russia population 145 million. Ukraine population at most 40 million. Back in 2001 Ukraine population was down to 45 million from 52 million in 1991. That was Ukraine's last census. Having lost Crimea Ukraine lost 2 million people. Plus thousands killed in war.


Russia can deploy its entire military to fight Ukraine. Russia has nukes. No one dares to mess with Russia. Ukraine has to watch its borders from Poland and Romania which hate Ukraine because Ukraine took their lands.

You are wrong.Ukraine population is 42,928,900 in January 1, 2015 without Crimea.You should check source.

Russia can never deploy its entire force against Ukraine.If it want then Siberia will go to China, Sakhalin and Kuril Is. to Japan,Caucasus will be independent.Poland will capture Kaliningrad, USA Canada will case away Russia from Arctic.

And for nuke I think any military conflict between Russia and Ukraine will be conventional at best.Any nuclear attack on Ukraine will response massive NATO retaliatory nuclear attack on Russian mainland.Russia will not take that risk.Do not trust Putin's bluff.

Poland and Romania both are extreme anti-Russian and they have good relation with Ukraine.Currently they have no territorial dispute.Their territorial dispute gone away with ww2.They will side with Ukraine to punish Russia just like they did during ww2 with nazi Germany.

Look at the MAP Ukraine is tiny compared to Russia. Ukraine can never challenge Russia.

No it doesn't. Russia population 145 million. Ukraine population at most 40 million. Back in 2001 Ukraine population was down to 45 million from 52 million in 1991. That was Ukraine's last census. Having lost Crimea Ukraine lost 2 million people. Plus thousands killed in war.




Russia can deploy its entire military to fight Ukraine. Russia has nukes. No one dares to mess with Russia. Ukraine has to watch its borders from Poland and Romania which hate Ukraine because Ukraine took their lands.

If territorial size was the main factor determining global power then Denmark would have been Greenland's colony and UK is the colony of Canada rather than opposite. Global military power mostly determined by size of economy, population,technologocal and industrial strength and military alliance.Look at Israel.

 

[halfilhal]

Praise the devil. My task is just to dig a thousand chicks.

 

[jhungary]

Apparently you seem to claim to know more about Russian and Ukrainian dialects then me.

Lol apparently, you claim to be the one that know a lot more than me about Ukraine. I did not claim anything, I did know people within the Ukrainian Army for my war in Iraq, believe it or not is up to you, I don't see why I have to proof anything to you.

Same as I did not challenge you when you say YOU WERE BORN IN EASTERN RUSSIA.

You obviously do not read my posts. I never denied that Russia has sent supplies, i suggest actually reading my posts before posting.

If it is, then that's mutual. Did I accuse of you denied Russia sent supplies??

What did my post say?

Every conversation you are in you claim to 'have been' or 'know someone'. If we talk about the space shuttle you will claim you have flown in it, we we talk about pak-fa you will claim you have a friend that designed it, ect. Even if we assume you are truthful, it makes no difference when talking about the debate. You claimed that there were Russian model T-72s and T-80s, i also claimed that Russia did provided equipment and that the tanks you mentioned (T-72, T-62 and T-80) are also used by the Ukrainian army. What is your point? You are not even reading my posts and assume i claim otherwise.

No, I did not ever talk about PAK-FA, as I don't know shit about that.

Then again, I am not the one accusing me of not knowing the different between T-62, T-72 and T-80. YOU DID

Many country deal business with United States operate those, it's only natural for me being an Army Officer, would have know such a thing. I merely stated that I know the different with my Army Background, and you gone all gaga with it with your post.

What I claim does not matter, so does what you claim, My value come from my post, I believe there is a reason why I have 141 Positive rating here when you only have 9. I am not the type who would spill garbage and expect people to treat it as gold simply because "I claim" anything. I know my stuff, I know my people, apparently there are 141 time, people believe that too, so if, you don't believe it, that's fine with me

And again, I never did say you denied Russian provided equipment. Go back to my post and look closely regarding what I say.

Again what point are you trying to prove?

lol seems like you are the one who are trying to prove something, not me.

 

[TheNoob]

Translation :- We want to ask Russia to decimate us into oblivion.

 

[flamer84]

First of all you don't need 50 billion $ to stand up to Russia.Ukraine had a budget of about 1.8 billion $ before the conflict some 1-1.2.% of their GDP .Those money mostly went on salaries,not to mention that a part of them where simply robbed by corrupt officials.If they would have spent double than that without stealing money ofcourse,with a 3,5-4 billion $ constant budget they could have maintained a good combat readiness for their troops and maintain their current hardware.In a sense Ukraine was lucky to have extensive Soviet hardware which would have needed only upgrades rather than new ,expensive weapons aquisitions.Their stupidity made that even that hardware was left in in tatters after 20 years of theft.

Another problem was the Russian infiltration in their ranks ,many officers deserted or linked informations to Russia,a weak,corrupt system is easy to infiltrate.

Now,i'm not saying they would win 1 vs 1 with Russia but they would have had a credible deterrent because Russia wouldn't have invaded with all her force in a total war ,that would bankrupt her.They would have certainly had the power to crush the terrorist uprising which we see now,