Turkish Unmanned Vehicle Programs

[OguzSenturk]

Maybe it's stupid to discuss but i don't fucking care. Could there be an unmanned small drone that carries Remote Controlled Weapon Station? So that we won't have to risk our pilots and T-129s in a region where manpads and doçkas do exist!

Something like combination of this

and this

If the operation zone doesn't have manpads or doçkas, just send T-129 to use their cannon against targets. If the operation zone does have manpads or doçkas, and if you need missile support, send T-129s in high altitute and let them only use their missiles, and not cannons. If there is no need for missile support, don't send T-129s but send those cheap drones to targets. What if Terrorists shoot that drone down?

Well, who fucking cares! 20 of these little drones are more cheaper than one T-129, plus you won't risk your pilot's life which cannot be tagged with any price.

 

[Khagan1923]

https://twitter.com/x/status/958226698063024133

UGV by Nurol?


We should also work on UGV with suicide capablities. If we had such UGV we could just send them through the tunnels and explode them at the other end. Or just breach buildings with terrorists in them and explode it.

 

[kartal1]

Maybe it's stupid to discuss but i don't fucking care. Could there be an unmanned small drone that carries Remote Controlled Weapon Station? So that we won't have to risk our pilots and T-129s in a region where manpads and doçkas do exist!

Something like combination of this

and this

If the operation zone doesn't have manpads or doçkas, just send T-129 to use their cannon against targets. If the operation zone does have manpads or doçkas, and if you need missile support, send T-129s in high altitute and let them only use their missiles, and not cannons. If there is no need for missile support, don't send T-129s but send those cheap drones to targets. What if Terrorists shoot that drone down?

Well, who fucking cares! 20 of these little drones are more cheaper than one T-129, plus you won't risk your pilot's life which cannot be tagged with any price.

Thats why we have kamikaze drones like Alpagu and Kargu right?

 

[OguzSenturk]

Thats why we have kamikaze drones like Alpagu and Kargu right?

No. Kamikaze drones are far way more expensive if we consider the price of 7.62 ammunition. What i meant is one cheap drone that carries one remote controlled gun, to send and use it in risky areas where T-129 shouldn't be used due to risking pilots' lives and T-129's itself wouldn't be smart.

 

[kartal1]

No. Kamikaze drones are far way more expensive if we consider the price of 7.62 ammunition. What i meant is one cheap drone that carries one remote controlled gun, to send and use it in risky areas where T-129 shouldn't be used due to risking pilots' lives and T-129's itself wouldn't be smart.

Understood. It will be heavy in the way I imagine it. If such action against such a position occur then a lot of ammo must be on board and/or complicated aim stabilizing system must be integrated. For sure it will be bigger than the ones we see in the movies. If the size is like how I imagine it it will be also difficult for transportation trough the battlefield. Such machine must take off from already secured places like forward operation bases of some kind. Good but also big idea. Also not sure how cheap it will be if we want it to be effective enough.

 

[OguzSenturk]

For sure it will be bigger than the ones we see in the movies.

Not that big. For example;

camcopter s-100 is an unmanned helicopter, it has enough maneuver and stability capabilities, it can even use missiles. It can be loaded with radars, optics etc. And it's not that big.

One small RCWS and terrorist scum couldn't see what hits them at night, and if they could even shot it down we would lose just one drone, not any pilot and not expensive platform such as T-129.

edit: TAI's R-300 may also be same or similar class

 

[Saithan]

accuracy would be an issue, which is why it's better with smart bombs. where you'd only need to land it in the proximity of the target.

 

[OguzSenturk]

accuracy would be an issue

Same platform in the picture above is being used as small missile platform, even bigger platforms (like MQ-8) carries lots of missiles. So you are right about that missile platform would be cool. But the whole point of this is using cannon, and not risking T-129 pilots' lives where cannons are needed and where anti-helicopter threat exist. If missile should be used, mission could be done by T-129, it can fly above the manpads altitude and missiles could destroy the target from safe areas.

Bombs would be useless on unmanned helicopter since they couldn't get as much velocity as they could on Bayraktar TB2s.

Accuracy was never a problem on any helicopters that has nice flir and software. T-129, AH-64, Tiger etc none of them has accuracy problem. So there won't be any accuracy problem for unmanned helicopters as well.

 

[Saithan]

hm.. I think perhaps you misunderstood what I meant. using cannon on UAV to hunt terrorists wouldn't be very optimal. Because of the accuracy issue when using cannons, hence I meant smart bombs, cirit etc. would be better suited for UAV types.

The advantage is it's unmanned and only carries payload/drops it and returns. potentially only using a smart bomb to take out terrorists.

The difficulties of using gun while moving doesn't disappear whether it's a UAV or manned T129.

bullets are cheaper, but if you can't take out terrorists and keep losing the UAV then it's not that cheap again.

...cluster bombs could be useful though.

 

[OguzSenturk]

hence I meant smart bombs, cirit etc. would be better suited for UAV types.

That is what i said; there are other configurations of those unmanned helicopters above in picture, that loaded with missiles. I agree with you, that would be useful specially for Turkish Navy. I would love to see unmanned helicopters loaded with missiles take off and land one by one over TCG Anadolu.

using cannon on UAV to hunt terrorists wouldn't be very optimal. Because of the accuracy issue when using cannons

There was never accuracy issue on cannons of any last-generation rotary-wing aircraft, anywhere. I even gave examples to you, therefor there wouldn't be any accuracy problem for these unmanned helicopters as well.

 

[mete]

That is what i said; there are other configurations of those unmanned helicopters above in picture, that loaded with missiles. I agree with you, that would be useful specially for Turkish Navy. I would love to see unmanned helicopters loaded with missiles take off and land one by one over TCG Anadolu.


There was never accuracy issue on cannons of any last-generation rotary-wing aircraft, anywhere. I even gave examples to you, therefor there wouldn't be any accuracy problem for these unmanned helicopters as well.

Ballistic accuricy with guns fired from helicopters are really complicated. The biggest issue is inertia. Firing gun from a 5000 kg helicopter is too different from firing a gun from 250-300 kg(just example) unmanned helicopter. With 5 tons mass even 20 mm gun might not affect the system and ballistic path but 12mm from a small vehicle might be a much harder issue to calculate and stabilise.

Even though it is a good idea to shoot with unmanned helicopter and our defence industry have technical capabilities of solving those problems.

 

[OguzSenturk]

Ballistic accuricy with guns fired from helicopters are really complicated. The biggest issue is inertia. Firing gun from a 5000 kg helicopter is too different from firing a gun from 250-300 kg(just example) unmanned helicopter. With 5 tons mass even 20 mm gun might not affect the system and ballistic path but 12mm from a small vehicle might be a much harder issue to calculate and stabilise.

You are right, i am aware of this. But i never wanted to put 20mm/30mm on 300kg unmanned helicopter, that would be unnecesserily over powered. Even 12mm is not necessery. 7,62 Sarp-Light loaded unmanned helicopter, would have less inertia than 20mm loaded T-129, or 30mm loaded AH-64. 7,62 may push your shoulder back little bit if you don't position yourself, but it wouldn't even move 300kg mass in the air that cutting air with it's blades a centimeter.

Imagine that these kind of unmanned helicopters, fly above 150m-200m on surface and hit terrorists one by one, without risking any pilot's life, and even if terrorist scum somehow succeed to shot it down your cost would be much more lower than T-129.

I said 150-200m altitude because T-129s even fly lower than this as they can be seen in videos in Afrin.

 

[LegionnairE]

You are right, i am aware of this. But i never wanted to put 20mm/30mm on 300kg unmanned helicopter, that would be unnecesserily over powered. Even 12mm is not necessery. 7,62 Sarp-Light loaded unmanned helicopter, would have less inertia than 20mm loaded T-129, or 30mm loaded AH-64. 7,62 may push your shoulder back little bit if you don't position yourself, but it wouldn't even move 300kg mass in the air that cutting air with it's blades a centimeter.

Imagine that these kind of unmanned helicopters, fly above 150m-200m on surface and hit terrorists one by one, without risking any pilot's life, and even if terrorist scum somehow succeed to shot it down your cost would be much more lower than T-129.

I said 150-200m altitude because T-129s even fly lower than this as they can be seen in videos in Afrin.

problem is, if the enemy is in rifle range, so are you.

 

[OguzSenturk]

problem is, if the enemy is in rifle range, so are you.

Yes, but this is also legit for T-129. Your lose will always be cheaper on cheap unmanned helicopters; you will only risk unmanned helicopter's itself which is not as much expensive as T-129, and no pilot's life will be risked.

So you are in profit anyway.

 

[UkroTurk]

Having stuffed handgranedes into glass jar, our soldiers used to drop jars from helicopters onto terrorists.
Comparing those old days with todays laser guided smart bombs we should just chill out.