Turkey Cancelled F-35 Order, To Be Re-Evaluated

[LegionnairE]

@northeast It's not even a technology it's a design you stole, don't you see how pathetic this is? It's one of the most complicated war machines we're talking about and the only design parameter you could find that is different is ...wheels

China got too fond of copying that's all. Consider this a constructive criticism.

In the future yes but for now with their airforce and the Dolphins they have an edge.

edge..? are we still talking about Cyprus here? Because last time I checked the power balance between Turkey and Israel was pretty much a stalemate. God i hope you're not talking about Cyprus.

Don't forget the basis of what we have now is reverse engineering of Nazi stuff!

So the captured German engineers reverse-engineered their own work? nice argument you've made there

 

[egolfs]

What problem is there to order 2 planes no matter at what cost?
At least the pilots could see the plane and do some tests.
There must be other problems.

Maybe Turkey is showing her displeasure of the US congress because it stopped the transfer of missile frigates to Turkey. They supposedly didn't trust Turkey - How can the US trust Turkey enough to sell her advanced fighter planes, like the F-35, but not to transfer second-hand frigates? I think the US has to make up its mind and stop being hypocritical.

 

[T-123456]

@northeast It's not even a technology it's a design you stole, don't you see how pathetic this is? It's one of the most complicated war machines we're talking about and the only design parameter you could find that is different is ...wheels

China got too fond of copying that's all. Consider this a constructive critici


edge..? are we still talking about Cyprus here? Because last time I checked the power balance between Turkey and Israel was pretty much a stalemate. God i hope you're not talking about Cyprus.

No cyprus,in general.

 

[LegionnairE]

No cyprus,in general.

In general still Turkey has a larger area of influence because of her navy. And there's nothing special about dolphins. Turkey still runs the largest Type 209 fleet of the world.

 

[tyrant]

If Turkey goes to war with Iran, she will have whatever she needs.
But god forbids, if Turkey goes to war with Israel or Greece, your military will be blocked from spare parts and your F16s may not even work any more. At that time a fast and cheap reverse engineering job is appreciated. Be realistic. Reverse engineering worked for China.

 

[T-123456]

In general still Turkey has a larger area of influence because of her navy. And there's nothing special about dolphins. Turkey still runs the largest Type 209 fleet of the world.[/QUOT
Nothing special?
Dolphins can send 200kg nuclear warheads.
Also AIP.
Which one of our subs has AIP?
Now you tell me what can we do about that?

If Turkey goes to war with Iran, she will have whatever she needs.
But god forbids, if Turkey goes to war with Israel or Greece, your military will be blocked from spare parts and your F16s may not even work any more. At that time a fast and cheap reverse engineering job is appreciated. Be realistic. Reverse engineering worked for China.

Greece is no problem for us in a war but Israel is(for now).

 

[northeast]

@northeast It's not even a technology it's a design you stole, don't you see how pathetic this is? It's one of the most complicated war machines we're talking about and the only design parameter you could find that is different is ...wheels

China got too fond of copying that's all. Consider this a constructive criticism.

edge..? are we still talking about Cyprus here? Because last time I checked the power balance between Turkey and Israel was pretty much a stalemate. God i hope you're not talking about Cyprus.

So the captured German engineers reverse-engineered their own work? nice argument you've made there

Yes,they looked pretty similar,so what?maybe our engineers like the design and thinks it's a good stealth design,all stealth fighter looks alike each other.Our J-20 is pretty original though.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

First of all, the Chinese still have problems to make their own engine. Second, China has a lot more resources and knowledge than Turkey.

Except USA and UK, no one can make fun of our jet engine.

And this thread is about F-35 and Turkey, why bring China over here?

 

[BronzePlaque]

The head article is wrong...The delay/cancelation of the order is not due to other partners cancelations..The reason is completely different!!!

Turkey has announced that it is putting the planned purchase of 100 F-35 fighter jets from the US on hold because the Pentagon refuses to share the source code used in the software designed for the aircraft as well as the codes that might be used externally to activate the planes.

Defense Minister Vecdi Gönül said on Tuesday, following a meeting of the Defense Industry Implementation Committee, that the negotiations over the F-35 procurement tender had not yielded "satisfactory results". He said, "We will evaluate the order in the next meeting, in light of the progress made in the talks by then".

He said much ground had been covered in the talks in terms of technology sharing, but this was not enough for Turkey to accept the jets. He said the costs of the project had also increased but that the Turkish side had failed to secure the source code and the remote flight codes for the planes for which it will be paying $16 billion.

Without the source code, Turkish engineers wouldn't be able to make any changes to the software that operates the jets. The external flight codes are equally important, if not more, as they can be used externally to navigate the jets.

 

[shree835]

First of all, the Chinese still have problems to make their own engine. Second, China has a lot more resources and knowledge than Turkey.

How do you know that...Can you prove it...??

Look at the front wheels of the Plane. Compare them to the F-35 wheels.

ohh...This was awesome.

 

[BronzePlaque]

^
I fail to understand..What has China anything to do with the topic? Lets stick to the current topic we have on our hands now instead of flaming the thread

 

[atatwolf]

So they basically say, you can only use the f35 when US approves when you use it when US doesn't approve I will deactive the f35 externally and the plain will crash. With such allies you don't need enemies. They can shove their jet where the light doesn't reach. Excuse my French.

The head article is wrong...The delay/cancelation of the order is not due to other partners cancelations..The reason is completely different!!!

Turkey has announced that it is putting the planned purchase of 100 F-35 fighter jets from the US on hold because the Pentagon refuses to share the source code used in the software designed for the aircraft as well as the codes that might be used externally to activate the planes.

Defense Minister Vecdi Gönül said on Tuesday, following a meeting of the Defense Industry Implementation Committee, that the negotiations over the F-35 procurement tender had not yielded "satisfactory results". He said, "We will evaluate the order in the next meeting, in light of the progress made in the talks by then".

He said much ground had been covered in the talks in terms of technology sharing, but this was not enough for Turkey to accept the jets. He said the costs of the project had also increased but that the Turkish side had failed to secure the source code and the remote flight codes for the planes for which it will be paying $16 billion.

Without the source code, Turkish engineers wouldn't be able to make any changes to the software that operates the jets. The external flight codes are equally important, if not more, as they can be used externally to navigate the jets.

 

[LegionnairE]

@tyrant first of all I never liked you,

second, Turkey already produces most of the F16s parts, We have access to F16's source codes and we can make changes on our F16s' we already have our own mission computer for F16. We can also launch our national cruise missiles and. What more do you think we need? Turkey doesn't have to reverse-engineer anything because Turkey has access to real stuff. Stop worrying!

Now you tell me what can we do about that?

Meltem
Seahawk
YTKB
Seriously 4 ships has an edge over 14? because they have AIP? you too can stop worrying pal.

 

[BronzePlaque]

So they basically say, you can only use the f35 when US approves when you use it when US doesn't approve I will deactive the f35 externally and the plain will crash. With such allies you don't need enemies. They can shove their jet where the light doesn't reach. Excuse my French.

Imho, this delay decision is a negotiation tactic..US refused the same request from UK and Israel..We are not stupid, we should not expect an inconsistent response..It was obvious that they would refuse it..But Turkey just received an additional 4 billion$ bill to cover development and procurement costs for our initial batch of 100 planes..So the question is obvious "what will my additional money get me??" I think what SSM really wants are more offsets and more locally produced parts plus the ability to integrate domestically produced munitions.(like SOM)

 

[LegionnairE]

I think what SSM really wants are more offsets and more locally produced parts plus the ability to integrate domestically produced munitions.(like SOM)

We will have it. We aren't going to have them source codes, not for a long time. But we will be given an interface that will allow us to integrate national systems on F35. This is what I've heard anyway.

From what i can tell, Turkish Armed Forces never rushed into a newly found technology before. It was the case with AIP that's why it took us so long to place an order for Type 214s. We always wait and get the most proven systems. As for F35 we can wait a couple of years more it's not an issue.