Turk Copter Maker Teams With Three Polish Firms

[Zarvan]

ANKARA — Tusas Turkish Aerospace Industries (TAI), maker of the T129 attack helicopter, has teamed up with three Polish defense companies in the hope of winning a Polish chopper contract.

A memorandum of understanding was signed Tuesday in Poland to formalize the partnership, TAI said. TAI’s Polish partners are WCBKT, WZL1, ITWL and MESKO.

The partnership was discussed during the IDEF ’15 show in Istanbul May 5-8 to cooperate on KRUK, Poland’s attack helicopter program.

Last year, the Polish government issued a request for information for its planned acquisition of 32 attack helicopters. TAI is one of the producers that expressed interest in the contract; the others are Airbus Helicopters, Bell and Boeing.

TAI produces the T129 under license from the Italian-British AgustaWestland.

While TAI is seeking export deals for the country’s first indigenous gunship it must win US export licenses for any future deal.

The T129 is powered by LHTEC CTS800, the commercial and export version of the T800 turboshaft engine for rotary wing applications made by the Light Helicopter Turbine Engine Co., a joint venture between Rolls-Royce and Honeywell.

CTS800 primarily powered the AgustaWestland Super Lynx 300 and ShinMaywa US-2 aircraft. In addition to the Turkish attack helicopter program, it also has been selected for the AgustaWestland AW159 Wildcat and Lynx Mk. 9A helicopter programs.

Email: [email protected]

Turk Copter Maker Teams With Three Polish Firms

 

[era_shield]

Bokdil strikes again.

 

[-------]

Bokdil strikes again.

You mean this part "While TAI is seeking export deals for the country’s first indigenous gunship it must win US export licenses for any future deal."

unfortunately it's true..

 

[Neptune]

But Poland is another NATO ally, so I don't expect any engine allowance difficulties we faced similar with Pakistan.

 

[era_shield]

You mean this part "While TAI is seeking export deals for the country’s first indigenous gunship it must win US export licenses for any future deal."

unfortunately it's true..

True unfortunately. I meant the part where he says T129 is license produced from AW, and where he spends a third of the article talking about the engine and says nothing else about the helicopter.

 

[-------]

But Poland is another NATO ally, so I don't expect any engine allowance difficulties we faced similar with Pakistan.

Sure, but it's another red tape that needs jumping over.. Also not only engine, some of the less crucial but equally important EW component like disco ball is also licensed.. :/

True unfortunately. I meant the part where he says T129 is license produced from AW, and where he spends a third of the article talking about the engine and says nothing else about the helicopter.

I see, well once a bokdil always a bokdil..

 

[Hakan]

The problem with bekdil is that the way he writes is like all of these projects are dumb to start off from the beginning, should Turkey have bought stuff off of the shelf? If the answer is no then the only way forward is to follow the current road map which he criticizes all of the time. Maybe he does that because politicians claim 100% indigenous. Either way the guy has a serious problem.

 

[ANMDT]

Also " under licence" disturbs my ear, that is right owned platform based on A129 , under licence term seems to refer a condition that we need AW permission to market t129 , Bekdil for sure a low knowledged politics author involved in defence tech would do this act.

I have contacted to editor, i dont expect a welcoming attitude from bekdil

 

[madmusti]

Poland is maybe an Ally but sadly to say that even the U.S President repeats again that Turkey is only strategic partner.

@Neptune how do you think about this ?

 

[Neptune]

@Combat-Master thanks bro for the information I didn't know that. Any indigenous plans for this "disco ball"?

Poland is maybe an Ally but sadly to say that even the U.S President repeats again that Turkey is only strategic partner.

@Neptune how do you think about this ?

At the T-129 case with Pakistan, I believe rather than us, unfortunately the reason was the political drift between Pakistan and US as well as it can be the strong lobby of American defense contractors to open the way up for their own sales. i.e Pakistan is to get AH-1Z choppers.

Bro, myself I don't support the idea of being vastly polarized towards a single world power except for NATO but this case is different. gov't-to-gov't (not inter-state) approach have always been a headache for US-Turkish affairs but one thing we and Americans that don't have interest on politics do deny to accept is that we actually are very dependent on each other. Examples can varie from country to country. On paper, even Azerbaijan is our strategic partner as much as US is. At the end of the day we all know what Azerbaijan means to us. It's from 2006 but take a peak at this:

Replace Turkey as a Strategic Partner? :: Middle East Quarterly

US is our partner at multiple things, close partners at; NATO, OECD, Energy security, Counter-terrorism, a Foremost supporter to EU application...etc. Yes we are developing day by day on all sectors but one thing is clear and it can be viewed as a sad truth, good back-up or something else depending on commentator's opinion. But Turkey's strategic location, located at Eastern Europe, facing the threat of Soviet (Communism) expansion, being one of the first secular states established at the 20th century, our need of someone to support us since we were just a new state...etc. led the West to absorb Turkey into itself without hesitations mutually and even today at this time when there's a Sultan on our head and an international media war waged against Turkey, people in West Europe started to accept us as Europeans. This may or may not be related with how much they love (!) kebap but rather crisises grew behind the shadows of civil wars in Syria and Iraq which have already shown Turkey's importance, the Civil War in Ukraine, European Immigration Crisis, growing Russo-Chinese influence over the ME, Balkans, Caucasus have once again showed that they can not afford to lose Turkey. Likewise in our case, we are facing rapidly growing threats targeting our national security that one day, due to lack of political unity and leadership we wont be able to overcome these problems without US support. Iran have always been a historic rival and no one can figure out what they might do in near future. Heck even Saudi Arabia and Egypt started trying to take on Turkey.

I get what you mean, I think these examples can give a better overview on your question mate. If US had viewed Turkey just as the description you've given:


1- We wouldn't get any green light and US backing on future 80 km long buffer zone inside Syria.

2- We might have left or being kicked out from NATO (yeah I know it's still unrealistic even in this scenario)

3- No matter how powerful we are ISIS would have attacked us.

4- No license production of F-16s and no for HVKK's own software for our fighter jets. No sale of SM-2/SM-3 missiles to Turkish Naval Forces....etc. This list can last a hundred lines.

5- US would have accepted and legalized the Armenian Genocide Claims all over the states like a decade ago already.

But that's a Turk's opinion, you better ask that to Americans as well @Technogaianist (get us Sven ), @jhungary @gambit @James Jaevid.
Or some foreign perspective @Arsalan @Horus @Slav Defence @Serpentine @Abingdonboy. Your overseeings would be appreciated on the reality US-Turkish affairs

 

[Fenrir]

@Technogaianist (get us Sven )

I'll ask him for his thoughts:

In the mean time - my thoughts:

On T-129, and from one NATO country to another (and Poland), I can't see how the T-129 wouldn't be approved for sale to Poland, even with its US engine, considering its even taking part in the tender. I would assume Poland did the necessary research first to ensure the US would sign off on the deal.

Otherwise Turkey and Poland are in for some embarrassment.

I still think Poland will opt for a US helicopter though. The AH-64 seems to be suited more-so for the threat profile Poland is facing - mainly Russian armor.

...

On Turkish - US relations:

Yes, there have been some down times, especially given the recent turmoil in the Middle East (as if there's been a time when there wasn't strife in the region), but considering Turkey is still one of the most important NATO partners not named France of the UK.

In Afghanistan:

U.S. Central Command | Turkey

In Libya:

Turkey joins NATO operations against Libya

Of course that doesn't mean there aren't disagreements either, such as in Iraq where Turkey opted not to partake, but NATO hasn't always seen eye to eye.

Even during the worst of US-Turkish relations:

Turkish invasion of Cyprus

A time when Turkey closed its airbases to the US and ordered US troops out, its NATO bases remained open and US troops continued to be stationed on Turkish soil. Turkey, no matter what its relations are with the US at any one time, remains committed to NATO and has repeatedly demonstrated that.

NATO remains strategically important to Turkey as a hedge against a traditionally hostile Russia, and Turkey remains vitally important to NATO in combating regional tensions, militancy and Russia.

They've been through worse, they'll get over this too. And frankly, their current relations aren't too bad anyway, they are cooperating quite a lot in Iraq and Syria:

Turkey agrees to allow U.S. military to use its base to attack Islamic State

Turkey carries out first air strikes as part of anti-Isis US coalition

The US might want Turkey to do more against ISIS, but they've been saying the same thing to Pakistan for years. Enough is never enough. To the US, you can always do more.

 

[Hurshid Celebi]

As I wrote before in an other post Türkiye and Poland agreed TOT,
my friends from Poland told me that it will all depend on finance.
Tiger is offered practical as a "gift", Apache for more US contributions for Poland esp. in THAAD and more strategic affairs.

Poland wanted possible Integration of AGM-114 HF and Israeli Spike. TAI agreed fully !

T129 ATAK w Warszawie. Drugi przystanek na „Roadshow” w drodze do Kielc | DEFENCE24

 

[-------]

@Combat-Master thanks bro for the information I didn't know that. Any indigenous plans for this "disco ball"?



At the T-129 case with Pakistan, I believe rather than us, unfortunately the reason was the political drift between Pakistan and US as well as it can be the strong lobby of American defense contractors to open the way up for their own sales. i.e Pakistan is to get AH-1Z choppers.

Bro, myself I don't support the idea of being vastly polarized towards a single world power except for NATO but this case is different. gov't-to-gov't (not inter-state) approach have always been a headache for US-Turkish affairs but one thing we and Americans that don't have interest on politics do deny to accept is that we actually are very dependent on each other. Examples can varie from country to country. On paper, even Azerbaijan is our strategic partner as much as US is. At the end of the day we all know what Azerbaijan means to us. It's from 2006 but take a peak at this:

Replace Turkey as a Strategic Partner? :: Middle East Quarterly

US is our partner at multiple things, close partners at; NATO, OECD, Energy security, Counter-terrorism, a Foremost supporter to EU application...etc. Yes we are developing day by day on all sectors but one thing is clear and it can be viewed as a sad truth, good back-up or something else depending on commentator's opinion. But Turkey's strategic location, located at Eastern Europe, facing the threat of Soviet (Communism) expansion, being one of the first secular states established at the 20th century, our need of someone to support us since we were just a new state...etc. led the West to absorb Turkey into itself without hesitations mutually and even today at this time when there's a Sultan on our head and an international media war waged against Turkey, people in West Europe started to accept us as Europeans. This may or may not be related with how much they love (!) kebap but rather crisises grew behind the shadows of civil wars in Syria and Iraq which have already shown Turkey's importance, the Civil War in Ukraine, European Immigration Crisis, growing Russo-Chinese influence over the ME, Balkans, Caucasus have once again showed that they can not afford to lose Turkey. Likewise in our case, we are facing rapidly growing threats targeting our national security that one day, due to lack of political unity and leadership we wont be able to overcome these problems without US support. Iran have always been a historic rival and no one can figure out what they might do in near future. Heck even Saudi Arabia and Egypt started trying to take on Turkey.

I get what you mean, I think these examples can give a better overview on your question mate. If US had viewed Turkey just as the description you've given:


1- We wouldn't get any green light and US backing on future 80 km long buffer zone inside Syria.

2- We might have left or being kicked out from NATO (yeah I know it's still unrealistic even in this scenario)

3- No matter how powerful we are ISIS would have attacked us.

4- No license production of F-16s and no for HVKK's own software for our fighter jets. No sale of SM-2/SM-3 missiles to Turkish Naval Forces....etc. This list can last a hundred lines.

5- US would have accepted and legalized the Armenian Genocide Claims all over the states like a decade ago already.

But that's a Turk's opinion, you better ask that to Americans as well @Technogaianist (get us Sven ), @jhungary @gambit @James Jaevid.
Or some foreign perspective @Arsalan @Horus @Slav Defence @Serpentine @Abingdonboy. Your overseeings would be appreciated on the reality US-Turkish affairs

I haven't read anything that would replace IRCM jammer directly. Aselsan does plan on developing DIRCM, perhaps we'll see it on AWACs and future Turkish platforms..