The Ugly Truth About Pak Economy: A Brief History

[KhanBaba2]

Most importantly we have to start working on hallal food market on war footing ….. 2 trillion $$ economy and if we can take only 10% that will be huge for us ,,

A major increase in halal food would require a major increase in animal feed, which would require increase in agriculture. That would need more water and would need more dams. It won't happen overnight. Same with tea, palm or sunflower plantation.

 

[Dubious]

The hope here was (and is) that the present government under PMIK's leadership will be able to solve these issues, one by one, step by step, in an effective manner. If they follow the same tired old route of IMF and more loans, how will that be any different than all the times before, unless they can use these fresh loans to actually get Pakistan out of the present economic rut?

Dont you think the conditions that come with the loans actually cripple the country further ...if conditions enabled countries to get out of the loan circuit...where will the business of loan granting for IMF come from? You dont get rid of your "best" customers...

 

[Khafee]

Nicely put sir , Fully agree …..



But this need to be enough for those who said Pakistan have no money ………….
And morw will come , Insha-Allah ….. we still have zardari and nora companies ..

Bhai @MastanKhan Sahab, has said this a lot of times - If PAF needs money, let them get in to the Real Estate business.

IT's not about money only, but how the Elite corrupt loot with Impunity. THAT my friend is the crux of the problem.

 

[Dubious]

A major increase in halal food would require a major increase in animal feed, which would require increase in agriculture. That would need more water and would need more dams. It won't happen overnight. Same with tea, palm or sunflower plantation.

Well, the same animal food is god in india...god also needs animal feed and water...

Halal food is a untapped market...MANY shops in Europe and America need a continuous supply for their Muslim population..I mean no one is giving these away for free...it is trade / business like any other meat business on the planet!

 

[Reddington]

Wihtout Problem Definition entering Solution Space is futile excercise.

As I tried to narrate in my first post the problem with Pak Economy is not single point based. But rather multi layers/dimmensional. Hence the solutions are going to be equally multivectored.

@Mangus Ortus Novem one more of your thread gown to drain again should we start discussing possible solutions ??? @Reddington what u say?but must warn u no one going to notices as already on 4th page and here new political storm raising no body going to think about our given solutions what u say

Ok. Let's first identify problems.

Remember that economy is inter-connected with good governance, political stability, rule of law and literacy.
Here are the key problems Pakistan face today in my opinion.

1) Poor System of Governance

i) This Parliamentary democracy is nothing but a sham. A hogwash. Even ministers can't be appointed other than the politicians elected in assemblies. Which means no experts in their field can ever become a minister. While politicians are complete morons.

ii)18th amendment. A sinister amendment done to constitution on orders of outside powers to weaken the federation and give more funds to provinces. Which ends up in hands of politicians by the way.

2) Decadent Judicial System

19th century's Anglo-Saxon colonial laws designed by British especially to persecute and oppress the weak majority while rich elite can never be touched. Which means corruption, corruption and only corruption. People often say that Pakistan's biggest problem is corruption. It's not actually. It is just a symptom. The real disease of our country is our rotten judicial system that can never touch the elite (politicians, Judges, lawyers, bureaucrats, generals, businessman and others)

3) Low Quality Education

i) The situation of education in our country is downright pathetic. Universities are handing out degrees like pamphlets. Thousands of students are graduating every year from our universities. But they don't have the required skills to work in industries.
There needs to be skill based education with government supporting them to become entrepreneurs and do innovation.

ii)Another problem is that they are never taught to think out of box. Result is there is no innovation in our country. Also same reason we aren't producing any high caliber intellectuals, academics and scientists.

4) Corrupt Police system

Again Pakistan penal code (1860), Code of criminal Procedure(1898) designed by British. Rotten system that needs to be removed ASAP.

5) Tax Reforms

i) Tax reforms are badly needed. The government has imposed so much taxes on people (indirect taxes) on things of everyday life like food, clothing, medicines, electricity, gas etc. But still it says that people don't give taxes (direct taxes). Utter nonsense.

ii) Pakistan right now is on 147th number on the list of ease of doing business countries (World Bank).
Taxes needs to be reduced for businesses and foreign investment needs to be encouraged. There needs to be major reforms taken by the government to reduce taxes.

Here are the problems I have identified. If these problems are solved, then Pakistan can become economically stronger. What do you guys think. @Mangus Ortus Novem @zulu

 

[Umar Nazir]

As per World Bank, more than 36% economy of Pakistan is unregistered which cast Pakistan ateast 800 dollar in GDP per capita . My question is why every govt fail to register that unregistered economy ?????

 

[Khafee]

Ok. Let's first identify problems.

Remember that economy is inter-connected with good governance, political stability, rule of law and literacy.
Here are the key problems Pakistan face today in my opinion.

1) Poor System of Governance

i) This Parliamentary democracy is nothing but a sham. A hogwash. Even ministers can't be appointed other than the politicians elected in assemblies. Which means no experts in their field can ever become a minister. While politicians are complete morons.

ii)18th amendment. A sinister amendment done to constitution on orders of outside powers to weaken the federation and give more funds to provinces. Which ends up in hands of politicians by the way.

2) Decadent Judicial System

19th century's Anglo-Saxon colonial laws designed by British especially to persecute and oppress the weak majority while rich elite can never be touched. Which means corruption, corruption and only corruption. People often say that Pakistan's biggest problem is corruption. It's not actually. It is just a symptom. The real disease of our country is our rotten judicial system that can never touch the elite (politicians, Judges, lawyers, bureaucrats, generals, businessman and others)

3) Low Quality Education

i) The situation of education in our country is downright pathetic. Universities are handing out degrees like pamphlets. Thousands of students are graduating every year from our universities. But they don't have the required skills to work in industries.
There needs to be skill based education with government supporting them to become entrepreneurs and do innovation.

ii)Another problem is that they are never taught to think out of box. Result is there is no innovation in our country. Also same reason we aren't producing any high caliber intellectuals, academics and scientists.

4) Corrupt Police system

Again Pakistan penal code (1860), Code of criminal Procedure(1898) designed by British. Rotten system that needs to be removed ASAP.

5) Tax Reforms

i) Tax reforms are badly needed. The government has imposed so much taxes on people (indirect taxes) on things of everyday life like food, clothing, medicines, electricity, gas etc. But still it says that people don't give taxes (direct taxes). Utter nonsense.

ii) Pakistan right now is on 147th number on the list of ease of doing business countries (World Bank).
Taxes needs to be reduced for businesses and foreign investment needs to be encouraged. There needs to be major reforms taken by the government to reduce taxes.

Here are the problems I have identified. If these problems are solved, then Pakistan can become economically stronger. What do you guys think. @Mangus Ortus Novem @zulu

Export oriented laws would really help as well.

 

[VCheng]

Dont you think the conditions that come with the loans actually cripple the country further ...if conditions enabled countries to get out of the loan circuit...where will the business of loan granting for IMF come from? You dont get rid of your "best" customers...

For starters, going to the IMF or not is a decision made by the country, not the IMF. The conditions that IMF puts are according to its published charter and well-known, and are designed with sound economic principles in mind.

If any country decides they are not willing to accept the conditions, then it is their choice not to seek IMF funds.

IMF is not in the "business" of loans. It was set up as a lender of last resort to enable struggling economies avoid a total collapse, and that remains its only role. That is why it charges much lower rates than commercial lenders in the business.

 

[Dubious]

Economic future of Pakistan linked with enhancement of exports: Imran Khan
April 04, 2019

Prime Minister Imran Khan says economic future of Pakistan is linked with enhancement of exports which so far have remained far below the actual potential.

He was chairing 80th meeting of Board of Administrators of Export Development Fund in Islamabad today (Thursday).

The Prime Minister said in past, revenue-centric economic policies with overemphasis on collection of revenues made the industry uncompetitive. He said the PTI government has made a paradigm shift in prioritizing the competitiveness of industry vis-à-vis revenue collection.

The meeting approved budget and the schedule of activities to be held during four-day TEXPO Exhibition 2019 at Lahore Expo Centre on 11th of this month.


http://www.radio.gov.pk/04-04-2019/economic-future-of-pakistan-linked-with-enhancement-of-exports-pm


So 1 issue is being addressed! What next?

 

[Khafee]

As per World Bank, more than 36% economy of Pakistan is unregistered which cast Pakistan ateast 800 dollar in GDP per capita . My question is why every govt fail to register that unregistered economy ?????

Look at the Tax records of your MNA / MLA / Senators, and you will have your answer.

 

[Dubious]

For starters, going to the IMF or not is a decision made by the country, not the IMF. The conditions that IMF puts are according to its published charter and well-known, and are designed with sound economic principles in mind.

If any country decides they are not willing to accept the conditions, then it is their choice not to seek IMF funds.

IMF is not in the "business" of loans. It was set up as a lender of last resort to enable struggling economics avoid a total collapse, and that remains its only role.

It isnt in the "business" of loans? Then how does it run without lending and getting back interest?

2ndly, it is the country's choice when you tell it to devalue its currency...Then it cant pay back [coz the same money they borrowed now has to be payed back not just with interest but also within its capacity/ currency = still paying more] and the 2 cant be linked...Then that isnt very smart economics, now is it?

 

[Khafee]

So 1 issue is being addressed! What next?

When something gets implemented, and we can see +ve results, then we can say that it has been addressed.

Right now, its just one guy trying to figure out, where the head is, and where the tail is, while his team is busy in pulling fast ones.

 

[Mangus Ortus Novem]

Ok. Let's first identify problems.

Remember that economy is inter-connected with good governance, political stability, rule of law and literacy.
Here are the key problems Pakistan face today in my opinion.

1) Poor System of Governance

i) This Parliamentary democracy is nothing but a sham. A hogwash. Even ministers can't be appointed other than the politicians elected in assemblies. Which means no experts in their field can ever become a minister. While politicians are complete morons.

ii)18th amendment. A sinister amendment done to constitution on orders of outside powers to weaken the federation and give more funds to provinces. Which ends up in hands of politicians by the way.

2) Decadent Judicial System

19th century's Anglo-Saxon colonial laws designed by British especially to persecute and oppress the weak majority while rich elite can never be touched. Which means corruption, corruption and only corruption. People often say that Pakistan's biggest problem is corruption. It's not actually. It is just a symptom. The real disease of our country is our rotten judicial system that can never touch the elite (politicians, Judges, lawyers, bureaucrats, generals, businessman and others)

3) Low Quality Education

i) The situation of education in our country is downright pathetic. Universities are handing out degrees like pamphlets. Thousands of students are graduating every year from our universities. But they don't have the required skills to work in industries.
There needs to be skill based education with government supporting them to become entrepreneurs and do innovation.

ii)Another problem is that they are never taught to think out of box. Result is there is no innovation in our country. Also same reason we aren't producing any high caliber intellectuals, academics and scientists.

4) Corrupt Police system

Again Pakistan penal code (1860), Code of criminal Procedure(1898) designed by British. Rotten system that needs to be removed ASAP.

5) Tax Reforms

i) Tax reforms are badly needed. The government has imposed so much taxes on people (indirect taxes) on things of everyday life like food, clothing, medicines, electricity, gas etc. But still it says that people don't give taxes (direct taxes). Utter nonsense.

ii) Pakistan right now is on 147th number on the list of ease of doing business countries (World Bank).
Taxes needs to be reduced for businesses and foreign investment needs to be encouraged. There needs to be major reforms taken by the government to reduce taxes.

Here are the problems I have identified. If these problems are solved, then Pakistan can become economically stronger. What do you guys think. @Mangus Ortus Novem @zulu

.


Dear Pak,

A very good beginning. Yes, beginning... please, look at the total Instuitional Capture as well. Save for national defence all other instuitions are in a state of ruin.

Your bureaucracy is more of a colonial force to manage the locals than serve the citizens. Hence, no ease of doing business or any policymaking.

Tax collection is no problem.

Your tax office collects taxes alright. Between 6T to 8T which never goes to treasury. All in the pocket. Well established fact. Why do you think there are so many medical doctors in the tax department?

Bureaucracy is part of #CriminalEnterprise . Police is just an enforcer/bouncer for the elite.

Also there is a religion capture by the #DieselMullahs who are on the payroll of foreign powers. Reference: Wikileaks

But I am delighted that you have narrowed the field.

What else do you think?

Regards,

Mangus

 

[CHACHA"G"]

A major increase in halal food would require a major increase in animal feed, which would require increase in agriculture. That would need more water and would need more dams. It won't happen overnight. Same with tea, palm or sunflower plantation.

Yes , but does that mean we don't have to start ????????????? If we start this year we will see full fruits in 2025 …….. Just after 6 years …….

 

[VCheng]

It isnt in the "business" of loans? Then how does it run without lending and getting back interest?

2ndly, it is the country's choice when you tell it to devalue its currency...Then it cant pay back [coz the same money they borrowed now has to be payed back not just with interest but also within its capacity/ currency = still paying more] and the 2 cant be linked...Then that isnt very smart economics, now is it?

The interest rate IMF charges is only to repay its members who put up the money, and is far less than commercial lenders who are in the lending business.

And again, if the IMF conditions are not good for the country, then it is up to the country to refuse the bailout. It is their choice and their decision, and not up to the IMF.

The value of the currency is determined by basic principles - what a country produces and what it consumes - and that is what the IMF must prescribe according to its charter, pure and simple.