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The atrocities in the 1971 civil war

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Sheikh Mujib-ur-Rehman use to tell Bangladeshis that their jute is worth so much, they can all be living in palaces! Balochis were being told by Bughti that they have a sea of oil under Balochistan and they all can get rich! People of East Pakistan got up in arms because they literally could not see beyond their ethnicity. That essentially was the problem in East Pakistan. Otherwise there was just as much corruption in Lahore but i can assure you that no one would ever contemplate taking arms against the state in Lahore.What goes round comes around. In 1971 the East Pakistan Rifles (today's BD Rifles) killed their pro-Pakistan officers (both Bengalis, and non-Bengalis) and few months ago they did the same thing. I have no sympathies for them.No matter what happened in 1971 we must not forget that both sides were at fault. I revisited 1971 incident after BD mutiny to understand what is going on and yes I encountered horrific stories of atrocities commited by both sides.India created a lot of confusion and discord among two brothers but ultimately it was Pakistani government (Dictatorship mind you..a civilian government would have been better) whose policies alienated the entire population. It is not uncommon for mob mentality to develop among our people and the result we all know. Bengali attacking non Bengali and army responding with more force than justified and the downward spiral started.Pakistanis quite frankly have apologized a lot of times and it is the Bdeshis who should apologize now!Our Respected former President was a wise man and that is why he seeked apology from Bangladeshis without mentioning mutual crimes as he really wanted this reconciliation to succeed.Just get over it..No point of pushing the old issues to create more hatred between Bdeshis and Pakistanis.
 
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Huh thats real insightfull. Give me a break.

1) Jute did worth much at that time. Dandi and Calcutta was built on BD's jute. and Jute is the only thing Pakistan had that time.
2) Bengalis could not go above the ethnicity or the West Pakistani could not go above ethnicity? Thats a real question and the answer you should find in Mujib's speech. Minority leader from West had more values than majority leader of East to the then PK govt. You think Bhutto did not know about the army operation in East pakistan?
 
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Bengalis were victim of targetted killing.

And the Mukit bahini and others just randomly picked out people on the street to lop their heads off?

Don't be absurd - of course the East Pakistani rebels engaged in target killings, both before and after the military action. The Pakistani and allied security forces killed those they suspected of treason - separatism is treason is it not? And the punishment for treason is death in many nations - whether it be an intellectual or an armed rebel - which is not to say that other atrocities and unjustified killings did not take place

As to the scale - given the varying statements issued by the Bangladeshi leadership itself, and doubts raised by other historians, there can be no comparisons of 'scale' unless independent and mutual agreed upon investigations are undertaken to ascertain the truth behind the events of 1971.
 
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What sustained this thread so long in this respected and well-moderated forum---despite several cries from members [salman nedian: ‘Bas kar do Bas’ ; Hasnain2009: Stop yaar!!]---is yet to be understood.

Unknown to me the value this thread offers besides (1) spreading further bitterness, and (II) munching on the following wrong theories:

1. IA perpetrated the atrocities and then dumped the accusation on PA.

2. PA is a disciplined Muslim force and never did any atrocity / rape.

Both above are wrong to the core, and I am an witness as an earliest-batch Freedom Fighter. Why not just read (I) the book “East Pakistan: The Endgame An Onlooker's Journal 1969-1971” by Brigadier General A R Siddiqi, the former Chief of Inter Services Public Relations and the former Press Advisor to President Yahya, and (II) Hamudur Rehman Commission Report.

Yet if anyone prefers to argue on & on arrogantly, this respected forum should not be the right place.

May I suggest that this thread is abolished unless someone show effectively the meaningful purpose it will serve. On the other hand, the thread “Bangladesh urges Pakistan apology for 1971 crimes” may continue in stead---not as a site for mud-slinging---but to discuss the issue of apology: (I) If required, why in the name of Islam ? (II) Is it required to advance the cause of Union ? If not, why so. Why not 'No Union - No apology' ? (III) Was Gen Musharraf's apology in 2002 enough ? If yes, why ? If not, why ? etc. etc.

Definitely apology is not necessary (I) to respond to BAL Govt. plea, &/or (II) if we are not required to face Allah, and care about 'ummah' and not to look into the issue of Union.

A dignified person, if done a mistake, has only the ability to make apology. It is not everybody’s job or issue. If we are ‘low category’ people, we could forget ‘apology’ as well, and move on our respective selfish paths---good or bad. But we perhaps can not do so as long as both sides belong to ummah & Islam---driving few souls (Al-zakir, Ahmedzaka etc.) in this forum to work for a possible Union to which many others and myself dutifully subscribe.

We can not also say that since both the parties have committed atrocities ; so, it is even. Now let us shake our dirty hands, and start working for a Union forthwith.

Issue of ummah invariably brings the issue of Islam. In Islam---as you all know---good or bad deeds are not counted in numbers but are weighed to determine gravity, density & implications of each deed. A matchbox full of earth will weigh 50 gms but the same of solar surface will weigh 7+ tons.


Moreover, a publicly committed misdeed require invariably public apology in Islam.

Further, it is not atrocity alone but (1) Years of disparity; (2) Denying Sk. Mujib his premiership (3) No strong & effective protest by Pakistani mass during the atrocity period (4) Denial of due share of state-owned assets & liability.

Surely, we have done serious crimes among ourselves and to Islam too. Before the issue of a possible union proceeds further, we must clean ourselves from the crimes committed to each other and Islam. If one has done more, it has to be admitted and addressed appropriately too. If we can not , we are not capable of taking another chance for the 2nd time for any Union or intimate co-operation. Or are we ?

India has succeeded in maintaining the unity of their much bigger population by doing right things to their people whereas the then-Pakistan has failed. If India as a secular state could maintain satisfactory parity among around 20 states and could transfer state-power several times, why we---as Muslims---could not do it even once in 23 years ? Shall we always blame India only for any opportunist role or Should we have the courage and pain to find, admit and aboslve ours, too ?

Unless we find answer to that ‘WHY’ and get our hearts cleaned by ‘tears of apology’, we do not have any great agenda at our hand---at least for the time being and for our new generation.
 
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Bengalis were victim of targetted killing. It was a common case when Army used to ask people to recite Kalema or Show them whether they are circumcised. If anybody failed on those test, they killed them in point blank.

How could a Muslim failed any of those test? Were the army sorting out Hindus and Islamic name mushrik???:coffee:
 
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How could a Muslim failed any of those test? Were the army sorting out Hindus and Islamic name mushrik???:coffee:

Yes they did, despite those army themselves failed to show them as muslim.
 
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This debate has been going for nearly 40 years why are we still arguing over this? Will my children and my grandchildren (when I have them) have to fight this debate also and show how meaningless and pointless this all is. We know that atrocities and wrong was committed on all sides but when someone tries to show that India was no less a party to all this we have to start from square one all over again. Truly pathetic! :hitwall::hitwall::blah:
 
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Could not agree more.Bangladeshis members come here and rant here about 71.We all say you are our brothers and we're sorry about this (despite the fact that both were equally responsible) and then they start posting full stories and stuff which only incites hatred from Pakistanis.No point of doing this.If you don't want to have ties with Pakistan..ask your government to break diplomatic relations with Pakistan..Quite simple to be honest.Pakistan has always been ready for good relations with Bangladesh.Do you honestly believe current generation of Pakistanis really hate Bangladesh like the way Bdeshis hate us!
 
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Our friendly mod has posted a comment on the 1971 Bangladesh war for freedom.

http://www.defence.pk/forums/national-political-issues/13937-christian-province-pakistan-9.html#post617131

The East Pakistan insurgency had largely been controlled militarily - independence would not have been achieved without Indian military intervention, heck, even the insurgency, instability and unrest would not have gotten to the point it did without covert Indian intervention.


What are Bangladesh peoples view on this.

Since may of you consider India to have only assisted in what was A Bangladesh Issue.

Is this this statement valid.
 
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Our friendly mod has posted a comment on the 1971 Bangladesh war for freedom.

http://www.defence.pk/forums/national-political-issues/13937-christian-province-pakistan-9.html#post617131




What are Bangladesh peoples view on this.

Since may of you consider India to have only assisted in what was A Bangladesh Issue.

Is this this statement valid.

Ya the biggest political party with 100% seat in parliament in East Pakistan declared independence means insurgency to some people is just living in a fools world. Army was broken, civil adminstration broken even diplomatic missions defected. Does that mean insurgency??? Give me a break.
Yes after 26th of March Bangladesh government seeked help from India, Russia and they were successfull in securing those.
 
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In vain, iajdani. All in vain.

You can see some of my conversations with AM, regarding Bangladesh's freedom struggle HERE. Although our topic was slightly different, you will get the idea.
 
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Our friendly mod has posted a comment on the 1971 Bangladesh war for freedom.

http://www.defence.pk/forums/national-political-issues/13937-christian-province-pakistan-9.html#post617131




What are Bangladesh peoples view on this.

Since may of you consider India to have only assisted in what was A Bangladesh Issue.

Is this this statement valid.

I agree with AgNoStIc MuSliM

Few Hindu loving mukti could not have achieved nothing if you did not shelter, trained and financed them. Separation of Pakistan has more to do with bharat, anti Islamic elements and traitors joint conspiracy than common east Pakistanis.

Musjib's and his whole family's violent death, mukti being miss treated by most Bangladeshis, death of other awami leaders, killing target of awami leaders, label as bharati dalal and awami out of power most of the time in the history modern Bangladesh proved my theory.:smokin:
 
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I agree with AgNoStIc MuSliM

Few Hindu loving mukti could not have achieved nothing if you did not shelter, trained and financed them. Separation of Pakistan has more to do with bharat, anti Islamic elements and traitors joint conspiracy than common east Pakistanis.

Musjib's and his whole family's violent death, mukti being miss treated by most Bangladeshis, death of other awami leaders, killing target of awami leaders, label as bharati dalal and awami out of power most of the time in the history modern Bangladesh proved my theory.:smokin:

then why do you have Bangladesh flag.

If you dont respect the creation of your nation then why do you represent Bangladesh.

You can just choose a Pak flag and go with it.
 
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then why do you have Bangladesh flag.

If you dont respect the creation of your nation then why do you represent Bangladesh.

You can just choose a Pak flag and go with it.

Read this following line again and you would understand.
Musjib's and his whole family's violent death, mukti being miss treated by most Bangladeshis, death of other awami leaders, killing target of awami leaders, label as bharati dalal and awami out of power most of the time in the history modern Bangladesh proved my theory

And Bangladesh Constitution is Islam based since we Muslim regained sovereignty of Bangladesh from dalal Mujib in 75. :smokin:
 
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Read this following line again and you would understand.

And Bangladesh Constitution is Islam based since we Muslim regained sovereignty of Bangladesh from dalal Mujib in 75. :smokin:

So why don't you declare '75 as your creation year?

I wonder whether the sentiment expressed by the above poster is the common sentiments of the B'deshis or they have a other point of views too. Also, some comes as real confused. They are proud of BD creation but also support BNP/ J-E-I, who had been working to re-associate BD with Pak (may by way of some loose federation). Can some one neutral present the different views of the B'deshis. We all know what the above poster's view, I'm interested in some other views, if any.
 
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