Taliban release video of dam project

[VCheng]

............
Power in FATA speaks louder than Pushto......

Actually Sir, power speaks all languages over most of the world, does it not?

 

[Riteon]

I know of this incidence. The engineers will be released. One of the engineer belongs to the local population, if anything untoward happens to him, then you'll see some nice fireworks.

BTW, I have travelled from Tank towards D.I.Khan a gazillion times, and also visited the proposed Gomal Zam site (2004). Everyone is requested to travel with at least 6 full magazines / AK

]


Are there isolated areas....or areas with very less population.....how is TTP able to move around so freely

 

[Icarus]

Actually Sir, power speaks all languages over most of the world, does it not?

Most other parts of the world don't have semi-autonomous regions governed by Tribal Chiefs who each enjoy command over a couple of hundred thousand, well armed and extremely traditionalist fighting machines. That's why getting the equation of power right in FATA is of special importance.

 

[Hyperion]

That's a very sound analysis and your knowledge of the tribes speaks of your interest in them, however you missed the key language that is understood by all tribes......power. If you project power, every single tribe no matter how troublesome will line up and go head over heels to get on your good side. Such are the dynamics of a tribal society that the powerful commands all the respect and support, here's where the state apparatus comes in, the political admin must be the protective hand over the tribes but still retain a position of complete dominance, that will help keep all the tribes under control. You remember when those 30 boys were kidnapped by the Taliban and Afghan Insurgents from Bajaur, last year? They were called for many Jirgas but they stalled then the FC, a Mommand Lashkar 30,000 strong along with artillery support started moving towards Kunnar, the Afghan Party called a truce and personally delivered the boys to the nearest Pakistani border post.
Power in FATA speaks louder than Pushto......

Mate there are even better ways to do that. I'm aware of both sides of the discussion, the ones last year and the ones in 1980's when PAF did it first sortie inside Pakistan. I'm a Pathan (one of them) from a family where most served in the armed forces and none retired without couple stars (big ones) on their shoulders.

The problem isn't Pushto anymore, it's a much complex situation, I rather not get into it on an open forum. Small hint: There are tajiks / Turkmens / Arabs and whole lotta more to deal with now, though they are contained to a very small geographical zone -- to get rid of these elements ISI needs to use more grey matter rather project power through mk82's.

Use the relationships cultivated over the past decades, use people with high stature from these tribes, who are getting fat sleeping in their villas in F6/F7/F8 etc etc... Ask them to help you, in a nice way!

 

[VCheng]

Most other parts of the world don't have semi-autonomous regions governed by Tribal Chiefs who each enjoy command over a couple of hundred thousand, well armed and extremely traditionalist fighting machines. That's why getting the equation of power right in FATA is of special importance.

I beg to differ Sir. Large areas of Burma and Columbia are two examples that are somewhat similar to FATA in semi-autonomous militias owing allegiance to entities other than the formal state. What is unique about FATA on top of that is the religious fanaticism element that is adding the bulk of the present problems.

What hampers PA in dealing with such an ideological militia is identity, since it was always trained to fight against kafirs, not lookalikes who say their namaz just as they do.

 

[Hyperion]

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Are there isolated areas....or areas with very less population.....how is TTP able to move around so freely

Dude, you can drive your car at 140kph and for three hours you'll not see a soul!

I beg to differ Sir. Large areas of Burma and Columbia are two examples that are somewhat similar to FATA in *semi-autonomous militias owing allegiance to entities other than the formal state. What is unique about FATA on top of that is the ** religious fanaticism element that is adding the bulk of the present problems.

What hampers PA in dealing with such an ideological militia is identity, since it was always trained to fight against kafirs, not ***lookalikes who say their namaz just as they do.

* Not true.
** Mostly contained to one tribe.
*** Are you kidding me, what look alike?

 

[Icarus]

Mate there are even better ways to do that. I'm aware of both sides of the discussion, the ones last year and the ones in 1980's when PAF did it first sortie inside Pakistan. I'm a Pathan (one of them) from a family where most served in the armed forces and none retired without couple stars (big ones) on their shoulders.

The problem isn't Pushto anymore, it's a much complex situation, I rather not get into it on an open forum. Small hint: There are tajiks / Turkmens / Arabs and whole lotta more to deal with now, though they are contained to a very small geographical zone -- to get rid of these elements ISI needs to use more grey matter rather project power through mk82's.

Use the relationships cultivated over the past decades, use people with high stature from these tribes, who are getting fat sleeping in their villas in F6/F7/F8 etc etc... Ask them to help you, in a nice way!

Now your talking my lingo! Here where the Lashkars come in, the people of FATA are more frustrated by the Taliban than anyone else on the planet, they have suffered the most at their hands so their anger is of course justified however to convince them that they should join forces with the state and fight against the TTP, they should feel convinced that the TTP won't be back next year to carry out brutal reprisals against the Lashkaris, we again reach the point where a solid projection of power is necessary to earn support.

I beg to differ Sir. Large areas of Burma and Columbia are two examples that are somewhat similar to FATA in semi-autonomous militias owing allegiance to entities other than the formal state. What is unique about FATA on top of that is the religious fanaticism element that is adding the bulk of the present problems.

What hampers PA in dealing with such an ideological militia is identity, since it was always trained to fight against kafirs, not lookalikes who say their namaz just as they do.

This hampering phenomenon you refer to is called the "First 3 Months Syndrome" (Shitty name, I know). Anyway, new soldiers of the religious type sent to the WoT have bouts of uncertainty in their first 3 months, when they have been ambushed a couple of times and lost 20 odd mates, they turn into vicious fighting machines. You can tell the two breeds apart from their body language.

 

[Hyperion]

Now your talking my lingo! Here where the Lashkars come in, the people of FATA are more frustrated by the Taliban than anyone else on the planet, they have suffered the most at their hands so their anger is of course justified however to convince them that they should join forces with the state and fight against the TTP, they should feel convinced that the TTP won't be back next year to carry out brutal reprisals against the Lashkaris, we again reach the point where a solid projection of power is necessary to earn support.

My friend, we need rapid response units in each of the "troubled" zones, logistical setups in (you know where), then use D.I.Khan as staging area --- MP School / Cantonment is a large enough place, and relatively well fortified! --- There are many other things, but you guys need to start there... After doing all this, go and start the negotiations...

In our culture you have to walk the talk... so they will understand that you're there for the long haul... Additionally, have a tactical squadron ready at FCU/Mianwali for backup. You know the present situation that Mianwali needs lot's of attention, you know why! But this will be beneficial in other ways too.. Use the resources at hand and beef them up, this is all I can say.

 

[VCheng]

..................
This hampering phenomenon you refer to is called the "First 3 Months Syndrome" (Shitty name, I know). Anyway, new soldiers of the religious type sent to the WoT have bouts of uncertainty in their first 3 months, when they have been ambushed a couple of times and lost 20 odd mates, they turn into vicious fighting machines. You can tell the two breeds apart from their body language.

Thank you for that clarification.

Now if only you could make the rest of Pakistani society come to the same realization.......

 

[SamranAli]

By reading the title, I thought Taliban is building a Dam. lol

I also thought the same.

 

[Hyperion]

Thank you for that clarification.

Now if only you could make the rest of Pakistani society come to the same realization.......

VC, not possible... and sometimes you wish for too much!

 

[VCheng]

VC, not possible... and sometimes you wish for too much!

Yes, I know, I am just an idealist fool who is totally lost here.

 

[Safriz]

Off topic,,but anybody knows if Haji Ayub Afridi's grand castle is still there near landikotall?
It was the only 'pakka' structure in that area when i visited it..
Doors remained open for everybody and anybody who could enter certain parts of the castle and have a free meal,even live there for some days...
But all drug anr ammunition smuggling money...

 

[Hyperion]

Yes, I know, I am just an idealist fool who is totally lost here.

VC, all will be well. Trust me. I know you wish well, no matter how crass you maybe in your comments (sometimes)! DONT WORRY!!!!

Off topic,,but anybody knows if Haji Ayub Afridi's grand castle is still there near landikotall?
It was the only 'pakka' structure in that area when i visited it..
Doors remained open for everybody and anybody who could enter certain parts of the castle and have a free meal,even live there for some days...
But all drug anr ammunition smuggling money...

LOL... One day I'll tell you about 30 other castles, some places they have their own GSM towers, using encrypted base stations, and electrical engineers to maintain them!!!!

 

[Safriz]

VC, all will be well. Trust me. I know you wish well, no matter how crass you maybe in your comments (sometimes)! DONT WORRY!!!!



LOL... One day I'll tell you about 30 other castles, some places they have their own GSM towers, using encrypted base stations, and electrical engineers to maintain them!!!!

Ok....so i knew if just one which i saw in 90s..But you say there are many...
No wonder government cannot have control of these areas....and all the trouble comes from there....