Tajikistan: No Hajj, No Hijab, and Shave Your Beard

[hussain0216]

They can rise up for all I care, leave us alone plz

300 Sal tk kutaas lagti rhi hain HM abi b nae samjh rhy

Leave you alone?
If you support oppression of muslims then i support oppression of secularists

If you shave muslim beards and rip off our hijabs then you better be prepared for pain when we respond and rule and not complain

 

[Mentee]

There is NO such thing as muslims eating livers of kafirs.

Actually its the other way around , hint, Hinda , Syrian cannibals -----

Where do you get such idea even while living among muslims.

I live among normal Muslims , but those ideas, I get from some super muslims

You just said you are not muslim but now you are claiming to follown sharia. Man you are confused.

As per your standard iam a mushrik, so I wont bet on that musalman part

.

Btw there is NO different versions of sharia.

I follow Jafferi Hanafi and Maliki Jurisprudence in different situations what does it make me?

Leave you alone?
If you support oppression of muslims then i support oppression of secularists

If you shave muslim beards and rip off our hijabs then you better be prepared for pain when we respond and rule and not complain

Well lets finish it then, iam not the one shaving their beards and preventing them from Haj , go get yourself their and fight for their rights -----

 

[Luffy 500]

Actually its the other way around , hint, Hinda , Syrian cannibals -----

What has piss TV propaganda got to do with this thread?

I live among normal Muslims , but those ideas, I get from some super muslims

SO there are super muslims in PAK? DO they come from iran? ..................just guessing.

As per your standard iam a mushrik, so I wont bet on that musalman part

Don't go around defining my standard. When did I call you a mushrik? Are you a liar? It seems you desperately want to get called a mushrik.

.

I follow Jafferi Hanafi and Maliki Jurisprudence in different situations what does it make me?

A muslim. But you are calling yourself secular , mushrik , kafir at the same time. You are seriously confused.

Let me put it this way as answer to that question.

1-Yes and No secularism is dogmatic and intolerance:
A Secular is a believe it a way of life so when you believe in something you want that thing to have the upper hand.
B Also secularism is a believe but it can live with the others if it is been respected and taking into account.

2- Democracy is a door can the fundamentals get in so when they get in they want clean the country from every one against them then we see assassination and interfering in every one affairs Saudi and Turkey clear example.

3-Unfortunately the Sunni Islam needs to mitigate it's views about democracy and and it's fundamental views about sharing power and tolerance about the other group of people with ideas that differ in the nation who they want to live and rule their country the best example here is Alnahdha party of Tunisia they were very realistic about situation in Tunisia.

4- the world can't accept any kind of taliban or Qaeda rule in any part of the world unfortunately today any election any Muslim country these kinds will pop up and they will get some big share of the ballot box.

I believe when Muslims deny the use of guns and they show real tolerance and declare freedom for every one within the limit of Islam without Pedantism when we see a mitigated version of Islam I believe we will see our religion prosper and lead the world in all direction because it use to be tolerant one until some fanatic one like Ibn Taymeyah came 7 centuries ago and after Ibn Abdul wahhab follow suite the Islamic world lost its bright reputation.

As per your no. 1 point , it seems you are totally confused.

Yes you are right secularism is a belief , a way of life. Its a religion.

NO secularism is the belief that it has the right to enforce its beliefs on state and supersede all other beliefs and values. If other religion accept such subservience then only can it coexist. By design it is opposed to all other religion.

Democracy literally means rule of the people. There is NO room for rule of people or anyone or anything else in Islam. Allah (swt) law is supreme. There can be NO parliamentary debate on Allah (swt) law. Elections and electing leaders are a totally different matter. Democracy and elections are NOT mutually inclusive.

What is your problem with turkey and KSA? They helping muslims of syria (what ever their interest may be) against a genocidal maniac is too much for your liking?

Sunni islam does NOT need to mitigate anything. Others views have to conform to sunni Islam AKA islam. You are making it sectarian. You should read your history about what Iran used to be before a certain genocidal dynasty took over you country 400 years ago.

SO you have a problem with muslims electing their leaders and deciding for themselves how to run their country. Just like western neo-cons you also find AQ and taliban as convenient boggy men to further your agenda. NO wonder western neo-cons are becoming best buddies with iran.

It seems you have a very flawed perception of Islam. Freedom, rights , choice all has to be within the frame work of Islam since its the only true religion. Its perfect. What's perfect does NOT need tinkering to suit the fallacious ideology of secularists and persian nationalists.

Ibn Taymiyah and Ibn Abdul Wahab (may Allah (swt) have mercy on them) were amazing scholars of orthodoxy who defended Islam against falsehood and heresy. They intellectually broke the backs of heretics and as such they are ludicrously maligned with false accusations today by the enemies of Islam. Ibn Taymiyah arguments are as much valid today as they were 700 years ago. If you call yourself muslim , you should be proud of these scholars of orthodoxy. We as muslims should learn from their life how they intellectually fought back against heresy.

 

[Mentee]

Don't go around defining my standard. When did I call you a mushrik? It seems you desperately want to get called a mushrik.

Case closed

A muslim. But you are calling yourself secular , mushrik , kafir at the same time. You are seriously confused

A secular Muslim nit an atheist and no I ain't confuse that I pull the trigger on innocent folks

What has piss TV propaganda got to do with this thread?

stop pissing me off by insulting my intellect , how dare you to equate myself with mullahs like you having different sects and that hinda part is mentioned in our govt school text books-----I told you we are a different group of ajmi Sunnis who have nothing to do with certain beliefs, come here in Pakistan and try to reason with any villager let alone an urban dweller on yazeed and hinda chapter, he'll most prolly lynch you if not rip you apart, now cry me a river---

SO there are super muslims in PAK? DO they come from iran? ..................just guessing.

Listen my lone tableghi bangali wondering in some yahood o hanood country. you could never understand the bond of family, we shall choose Iranians and Turks over any other Muslim nation any day of the year, apart from the genetic cultural and religious ties----- there's one more blessing upon us that none of us is wahabi/deobandi majority state------

Edit : Iam amazed at Wahabis how conveniently they label and present their selves as the bastion of sunnism ,opinions of some odd million Arabs and their funded minions hold no ground , call your selves whatever but you folks ain't sunni

 

[mike2000 is back]

600 million USD...ban hajj for few years...we will pay off all IMF debt

Ahahahahah......U are funny.

 

[Luffy 500]

@Mentee you are jumping to absurd conclusions and coming out as a sectarian zombie. I am NOT making it sectarian but you are not only making it sectarian but badmouthing a group of muslims your religious group (not sure what it is) have a beef with. It seems you have comprehension problem. DO visit a doctor. Hope you get better soon.

 

[Mentee]

@Mentee you are jumping to absurd conclusions and coming out as a sectarian zombie. I am NOT making it sectarian but you are not only making it sectarian but badmouthing a group of muslims your religious group (not sure what it is) have a beef with. It seems you have comprehension problem. DO visit a doctor. Hope you get better soon.

Malik ashtrer asked you a question and you jumped in with your sectarian Abdul wahab n ibn taymia discourse they are this and that , iam a brailvi/sufi Sunni , the majority sect in Pak turkey central Asia Lebanon ------ we along with shias denounce these characters for their not so compatible theories Vis a vis majority Muslim beliefs

 

[Luffy 500]

Malik ashtrer asked you a question and you jumped in with your sectarian Abdul wahab n ibn taymia discourse they are this and that , iam a brailvi/sufi Sunni , the majority sect in Pak turkey central Asia Lebanon ------ we along with shias denounce these characters for their not so compatible theories Vis a vis majority Muslim beliefs

Look at Malik ashtrer posts. He raised the question of Ibn Taymiyah and Ibn Abdul Wahab (may Allah have mercy on them). I replied him accordingly. As usual you jump to conclusions based on flawed preconceived notions.

I respect scholars of orthodoxy. I respect both Ibn Taymiyah and al-Ghazzaali (may Allaah have mercy on them both). I consider doebandis , tabligees , ikhwanis , moderate sufis etc brothers in Islam.I may NOT agree with them but they are brothers nonetheless.

So you identify yourself according to sect. But don't project your sectarian image on me. I call myself a muslim.

 

[Mentee]

Look at Malik ashtrer posts. He raised the question of Ibn Abdul Wahab (may Allah have mercy on him). I replied him accordingly. As usual you jump to conclusions based on flawed preconceived notions.

So you identify yourself according to sect. But don't project your sectarian image on me. I call myself a muslim.

Yeah right, a Muslim who only wants to see his sect's hegemony over all others , lets say what if a Muslim wants Sharea as per Jafferi or Hanafi beliefs would you accept that?

 

[Luffy 500]

Yeah right, a Muslim who only wants to see his sect's hegemony over all others , lets say what if a Muslim wants Sharea as per Jafferi or Hanafi beliefs would you accept that?

You have a very flawed perception of the people you have been taught to hate.

Sharia is based on Quran , Sunnah , Scholarly consensus, opinions of the prophet's companions, analogy etc. The four sunni school of islamic jurisprudence are NOT sects but schools of law.

Its up to scholars trained in jurisprudence to decide how to implement sharia. I am no scholar to accept or reject such hypothetical scenarios.

 

[Areesh]

This cr@p failed in Turkey. This would fail in Tajikistan too.

Banning people from following their beliefs and religion is something what Taliban and Daesh do. Tajik government is not much different.

 

[Mentee]

You have a very flawed perception of the people you have been taught to hate.

Sharia is based on Quran , Sunnah , Scholarly consensus, opinions of the prophet's companions, analogy etc. The four sunni school of islamic jurisprudence are NOT sects but schools of law.

Its up to scholars trained in jurisprudence to decide how to implement sharia. I am no scholar to accept or reject such hypothetical scenarios.

Is it that difficult for you to understand,? I and majority of Pakistani Muslims don't want your religious ideas to be lmposed upon them , what is there to discuss now?

 

[Apprentice]

Leave you alone?
If you support oppression of muslims then i support oppression of secularists

If you shave muslim beards and rip off our hijabs then you better be prepared for pain when we respond and rule and not complain

This

Is it that difficult for you to understand,? I and majority of Pakistani Muslims don't want your religious ideas to be lmposed upon them , what is there to discuss now?

What kind of ideas do the majority of Pakistani Muslims follow in your opinion?

You say you are Barelvi. Okay.

Now can you list the things which you think are against the ''type of Sharia'' Pakistanis want?

I would like to know this definition of this 'type of sharia' which you are referring to. This is the first time I am hearing of such things.

Btw, barring some aqeedah and fiqh issues, the Barelvi and Deobandi and Salafi perspective on most issues are the same.

Example: Barelvis are also against secularism. They also share the Deobandi view on burqa/beard. There is NO difference between the two (in most matters). You on the other hand seem to be in favour of restricting hajj (thats why you said I should be reprorted to Australian authorities just because I defended people's right/responsibility to do Hajj from ridiculous conditions). A real Barelvi would NEVER say such a thing.

I have a feeling that you are just using Barelvi's name as an excuse for liberal/secular thinking.

And btw, your reference to khawarij groups such as ISIS and TTP is disgusting and a strawman.

 

[Azad-Kashmiri]

Yeah right, a Muslim who only wants to see his sect's hegemony over all others , lets say what if a Muslim wants Sharea as per Jafferi or Hanafi beliefs would you accept that?

I've been reading your comments and you claim to be a Brelvi. Bhai you understanding of Islam is not in keeping with the MAJORITY of Muslims in our country. Maybe your speaking about the circle of family and friends you're speaking about. Your understanding of Islam in not the same of our sheikh, Imam Ahmad Raza Khan rahmimallah.

Bhai, we say we're Brelvis because of the understanding of Islam by a notable scholar of our time in our place. In fact we do taqleed of the Hanafi masliq, hence we're Sunni-Muslim-Hanafi

I think you know what scholars like Arfan-Shah Mashwadi-Brelvi says about Shia! Btw Jaffria are Shia as you know and they're included in the fatwa.

We disagree with the deobandia and wahabbia on points of aqeedah.

Bhai, SHARIATH-ALLAH is ONE! If a Maliki Imam were to come to power in Pakistan, we would have to follow HIS madhab and that goes for any of the four SUNNI schools. We would NEVER follow a Shia!

P.S: Bhai PLEASE never call yourself a Kafir. In Islam you are what you say you are!

 

[Apprentice]

FYI @Mentee this is what the majority of Pakistanis think: