MilSpec
ELITE MEMBER
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2011
- Messages
- 12,931
- Reaction score
- 38
- Country
- Location
I don't think US will abandon the Kurds, they have huge backing here are seen as the only potent force on the ground fighting ISIL scums.
Syrian Civil War (Graphic Photos/Vid Not Allowed)
- Thread starter Alienoz_TR
- Start date
Like earlier, the trade off, but US has backed Turkish moves, what does it gain here? Assad stays, ISIS goes, Turkey 'protects' Turkmen in area west of euphrates, Kurds keep due East.
In my opinion? Turkey is heading for greater trouble on Internal Security front. This we both had predicted long back ... seems ages ago.
US only gains in weakening of Erdogan in an intervention wherein increasingly the Turkish forces will appear in a quagmire, if protracted engagement with incremental body count, the US gets a chance to change Erdogan. But, if they wanted him gone, he would have been gone.
Of course, Russian and US backing gives an impression of a quid pro quo in between the two, making me again look at China and SCS.
Reported US backing to coup a false flag Op leading to Russian-Turkish reapproachment, securing Assad (US does not seem to have a serious interest here except for token HR condemnations and securing Iraq operations)? Talk about conspiracy theory .. I am concoting it here.
sur
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- Aug 19, 2009
- Messages
- 2,829
- Reaction score
- 4
Israeli think tank: Don’t destroy ISIS; it’s a “useful tool” against Iran, Hezbollah, Syria
(source)
According to a think tank that does contract work for NATO and the Israeli government, the West should not destroy ISIS, the fascist Islamist extremist group that is committing genocide and ethnically cleansing minority groups in Syria and Iraq.
Why? The so-called Islamic State “can be a useful tool in undermining” Iran, Hezbollah, Syria and Russia, argues the think tank’s director.
“The continuing existence of IS serves a strategic purpose,” wrote Efraim Inbar in “The Destruction of Islamic State Is a Strategic Mistake,” a paper published on Aug. 2.
By cooperating with Russia to fight the genocidal extremist group, the United States is committing a “strategic folly” that will “enhance the power of the Moscow-Tehran-Damascus axis,” Inbar argued, implying that Russia, Iran and Syria are forming a strategic alliance to dominate the Middle East.
“The West should seek the further weakening of Islamic State, but not its destruction,” he added. “A weak IS is, counterintuitively, preferable to a destroyed IS.”
Inbar, an influential Israeli scholar, is the director of the Begin-Sadat Center for Strategic Studies, a think tank that says its mission is to advance “a realist, conservative, and Zionist agenda in the search for security and peace for Israel.”
The think tank, known by its acronym BESA, is affiliated with Israel’s Bar Ilan University and has been supported by the Israeli government, the NATO Mediterranean Initiative, the U.S. Embassy in Israel and the Carnegie Council for Ethics in International Affairs.
BESA also says it “conducts specialized research on contract to the Israeli foreign affairs and defense establishment, and for NATO.”
In his paper, Inbar suggested that it would be a good idea to prolong the war in Syria, which has destroyed the country, killing hundreds of thousands of people and displacing more than half the population.
As for the argument that defeating ISIS would make the Middle East more stable, Inbar maintained: “Stability is not a value in and of itself. It is desirable only if it serves our interests.”
“Instability and crises sometimes contain portents of positive change,” he added.
Inbar stressed that the “main enemy” for Israel and the West is not the self-declared Islamic State; it is Iran. He accused the Obama administration of “inflat[ing] the threat from IS in order to legitimize Iran as a ‘responsible’ actor that will, supposedly, fight IS in the Middle East.”
Iran has declared itself a mortal enemy of ISIS, largely because the Iranian government is founded on Shia Islam, a branch that the Sunni extremists of ISIS consider a form of apostasy. ISIS and its affiliates have massacred and ethnically cleansed Shia Muslims in Syria, Iraq and elsewhere.
Inbar noted that ISIS threatens the regime of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad. If the Syrian government survives, Inbar argued, “Many radical Islamists in the opposition forces, i.e., Al Nusra and its offshoots, might find other arenas in which to operate closer to Paris and Berlin.” Jabhat al-Nusra is Syria’s al-Qaida affiliate, and one of the most powerful rebel groups in the country. (It recently changed its name to Jabhat Fatah al-Sham.)
Hezbollah, the Lebanese-based militia that receives weapons and support from Iran, is also “being seriously taxed by the fight against IS, a state of affairs that suits Western interests,” Inbar wrote.
“Allowing bad guys to kill bad guys sounds very cynical, but it is useful and even moral to do so if it keeps the bad guys busy and less able to harm the good guys,” Inbar explained.
Several days after Inbar’s paper was published, David M. Weinberg, director of public affairs at the BESA Center, wrote a similarly-themed Op-Ed titled “Should ISIS be wiped out?” in Israel Hayom, a popular right-wing newspaper funded by conservative billionaire Sheldon Adelson that strongly favors the agenda of Israel’s right-wing Prime Minister BenjaminNetanyahu.
In the piece, Weinberg defended his colleague’s argument and referred to ISIS as a “useful idiot.” He called the U.S. nuclear deal with Iran “rotten” and argued that Iran and Russia pose a “far greater threat than the terrorist nuisance of Islamic State.”
Weinberg also described the BESA Center as “a place of intellectual ferment and policy creativity,” without disclosing that he is that think tank’s director of public affairs.
After citing responses from two other associates of his think tank who disagree with their colleague, Weinberg concluded by writing: “The only certain thing is that Ayatollah Khamenei is watching this quintessentially Western open debate with amusement.”
On his website, Weinberg includes BESA in a list of resources for “hasbara,” or pro-Israel propaganda. It is joined by the ostensible civil rights organization the Anti-Defamation League and other pro-Israel think tanks, such as the Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) and the Washington Institute for Near East Policy (WINEP).
Weinberg has worked extensively with the Israeli government and served as a spokesman for Bar Ilan University. He also identifies himself on his website as a “columnist and lobbyist who is a sharp critic of Israel’s detractors and of post-Zionist trends in Israel.”
Inbar boasts an array of accolades. He was a member of the political strategic committee for Israel’s National Planning Council, a member of the academic committee of the Israeli military’s history department and the chair of the committee for the national security curriculum at the Ministry of Education.
He also has a prestigious academic record, having taught at Johns Hopkins and Georgetown and lectured at Harvard, MIT, Columbia, Oxford and Yale. Inbar also served as a scholar at the Woodrow Wilson International Center for Scholars and was appointed as a Manfred Wörner NATO fellow.
The strategy Inbar and Weinberg have proposed, that of indirectly allowing a fascist Islamist group to continue fighting Western enemies, is not necessarily a new one in American and Israeli foreign policy circles. It is reminiscent of the U.S. Cold War policy of supporting far-right Islamist extremists in order to fight communists and left-wing nationalists.
In the war in Afghanistan in the 1980s, the CIA and U.S. allies Pakistan and Saudi Arabiaarmed, trained and funded Islamic fundamentalists in their fight against the Soviet Union and Afghanistan’s Soviet-backed socialist government. These U.S.-backed rebels, known as the mujahideen, eventually produced the bases for al-Qaida and the Taliban.
In the 1980s, Israel adopted a similar policy. It supported right-wing Islamist groups like Hamas in order to undermine the Palestine Liberation Organization, or PLO, a coalition of various left-wing nationalist and communist political parties.
“Hamas, to my great regret, is Israel’s creation,” Avner Cohen, a retired Israeli official who worked in Gaza for more than 20 years, told The Wall Street Journal.
As far back as 1957, President Dwight Eisenhower insisted to the CIA, “We should do everything possible to stress the ‘holy war’ aspect,” in order to fight leftist movements in the Middle East.
Read More...
This article was written by Ben Norton from Salon and was legally licensed through the NewsCred publisher network
(source)
According to a think tank that does contract work for NATO and the Israeli government, the West should not destroy ISIS, the fascist Islamist extremist group that is committing genocide and ethnically cleansing minority groups in Syria and Iraq.
Why? The so-called Islamic State “can be a useful tool in undermining” Iran, Hezbollah, Syria and Russia, argues the think tank’s director.
“The continuing existence of IS serves a strategic purpose,” wrote Efraim Inbar in “The Destruction of Islamic State Is a Strategic Mistake,” a paper published on Aug. 2.
By cooperating with Russia to fight the genocidal extremist group, the United States is committing a “strategic folly” that will “enhance the power of the Moscow-Tehran-Damascus axis,” Inbar argued, implying that Russia, Iran and Syria are forming a strategic alliance to dominate the Middle East.
“The West should seek the further weakening of Islamic State, but not its destruction,” he added. “A weak IS is, counterintuitively, preferable to a destroyed IS.”
Inbar, an influential Israeli scholar, is the director of the Begin-Sadat Center for Strategic Studies, a think tank that says its mission is to advance “a realist, conservative, and Zionist agenda in the search for security and peace for Israel.”
The think tank, known by its acronym BESA, is affiliated with Israel’s Bar Ilan University and has been supported by the Israeli government, the NATO Mediterranean Initiative, the U.S. Embassy in Israel and the Carnegie Council for Ethics in International Affairs.
BESA also says it “conducts specialized research on contract to the Israeli foreign affairs and defense establishment, and for NATO.”
In his paper, Inbar suggested that it would be a good idea to prolong the war in Syria, which has destroyed the country, killing hundreds of thousands of people and displacing more than half the population.
As for the argument that defeating ISIS would make the Middle East more stable, Inbar maintained: “Stability is not a value in and of itself. It is desirable only if it serves our interests.”
“Instability and crises sometimes contain portents of positive change,” he added.
Inbar stressed that the “main enemy” for Israel and the West is not the self-declared Islamic State; it is Iran. He accused the Obama administration of “inflat[ing] the threat from IS in order to legitimize Iran as a ‘responsible’ actor that will, supposedly, fight IS in the Middle East.”
Iran has declared itself a mortal enemy of ISIS, largely because the Iranian government is founded on Shia Islam, a branch that the Sunni extremists of ISIS consider a form of apostasy. ISIS and its affiliates have massacred and ethnically cleansed Shia Muslims in Syria, Iraq and elsewhere.
Inbar noted that ISIS threatens the regime of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad. If the Syrian government survives, Inbar argued, “Many radical Islamists in the opposition forces, i.e., Al Nusra and its offshoots, might find other arenas in which to operate closer to Paris and Berlin.” Jabhat al-Nusra is Syria’s al-Qaida affiliate, and one of the most powerful rebel groups in the country. (It recently changed its name to Jabhat Fatah al-Sham.)
Hezbollah, the Lebanese-based militia that receives weapons and support from Iran, is also “being seriously taxed by the fight against IS, a state of affairs that suits Western interests,” Inbar wrote.
“Allowing bad guys to kill bad guys sounds very cynical, but it is useful and even moral to do so if it keeps the bad guys busy and less able to harm the good guys,” Inbar explained.
Several days after Inbar’s paper was published, David M. Weinberg, director of public affairs at the BESA Center, wrote a similarly-themed Op-Ed titled “Should ISIS be wiped out?” in Israel Hayom, a popular right-wing newspaper funded by conservative billionaire Sheldon Adelson that strongly favors the agenda of Israel’s right-wing Prime Minister BenjaminNetanyahu.
In the piece, Weinberg defended his colleague’s argument and referred to ISIS as a “useful idiot.” He called the U.S. nuclear deal with Iran “rotten” and argued that Iran and Russia pose a “far greater threat than the terrorist nuisance of Islamic State.”
Weinberg also described the BESA Center as “a place of intellectual ferment and policy creativity,” without disclosing that he is that think tank’s director of public affairs.
After citing responses from two other associates of his think tank who disagree with their colleague, Weinberg concluded by writing: “The only certain thing is that Ayatollah Khamenei is watching this quintessentially Western open debate with amusement.”
On his website, Weinberg includes BESA in a list of resources for “hasbara,” or pro-Israel propaganda. It is joined by the ostensible civil rights organization the Anti-Defamation League and other pro-Israel think tanks, such as the Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) and the Washington Institute for Near East Policy (WINEP).
Weinberg has worked extensively with the Israeli government and served as a spokesman for Bar Ilan University. He also identifies himself on his website as a “columnist and lobbyist who is a sharp critic of Israel’s detractors and of post-Zionist trends in Israel.”
Inbar boasts an array of accolades. He was a member of the political strategic committee for Israel’s National Planning Council, a member of the academic committee of the Israeli military’s history department and the chair of the committee for the national security curriculum at the Ministry of Education.
He also has a prestigious academic record, having taught at Johns Hopkins and Georgetown and lectured at Harvard, MIT, Columbia, Oxford and Yale. Inbar also served as a scholar at the Woodrow Wilson International Center for Scholars and was appointed as a Manfred Wörner NATO fellow.
The strategy Inbar and Weinberg have proposed, that of indirectly allowing a fascist Islamist group to continue fighting Western enemies, is not necessarily a new one in American and Israeli foreign policy circles. It is reminiscent of the U.S. Cold War policy of supporting far-right Islamist extremists in order to fight communists and left-wing nationalists.
In the war in Afghanistan in the 1980s, the CIA and U.S. allies Pakistan and Saudi Arabiaarmed, trained and funded Islamic fundamentalists in their fight against the Soviet Union and Afghanistan’s Soviet-backed socialist government. These U.S.-backed rebels, known as the mujahideen, eventually produced the bases for al-Qaida and the Taliban.
In the 1980s, Israel adopted a similar policy. It supported right-wing Islamist groups like Hamas in order to undermine the Palestine Liberation Organization, or PLO, a coalition of various left-wing nationalist and communist political parties.
“Hamas, to my great regret, is Israel’s creation,” Avner Cohen, a retired Israeli official who worked in Gaza for more than 20 years, told The Wall Street Journal.
As far back as 1957, President Dwight Eisenhower insisted to the CIA, “We should do everything possible to stress the ‘holy war’ aspect,” in order to fight leftist movements in the Middle East.
Read More...
This article was written by Ben Norton from Salon and was legally licensed through the NewsCred publisher network
A simplified understanding of various factions in Middle East. I think everything will be clear after you go through it.
@notorious_eagle I think to really understand the conflict one has to revisit the Arab 'awakening' in the aftermath of the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, where, the Christian Arab population led a revival of Arab literature centred at Beirut and then Damascus in order to instil a feeling of Arab 'nationalism' and emphasise the commonality of the various groups of Arabs to the bonding understanding of Islam. But then, like any other system, when you introduce religion into nationalism and administration, you tend to mix the ingredients for an explosion, which needs only an ignition to play itself out.
I think, what we are seeing is the automatic progression of the consequences of those actions of 1950-60 period ably helped by various world powers and vested interests.
@notorious_eagle I think to really understand the conflict one has to revisit the Arab 'awakening' in the aftermath of the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, where, the Christian Arab population led a revival of Arab literature centred at Beirut and then Damascus in order to instil a feeling of Arab 'nationalism' and emphasise the commonality of the various groups of Arabs to the bonding understanding of Islam. But then, like any other system, when you introduce religion into nationalism and administration, you tend to mix the ingredients for an explosion, which needs only an ignition to play itself out.
I think, what we are seeing is the automatic progression of the consequences of those actions of 1950-60 period ably helped by various world powers and vested interests.
Aero
FULL MEMBER
- Joined
- Nov 21, 2015
- Messages
- 637
- Reaction score
- -3
- Country
- Location
I think everything will be clear after you go through it.
if you can go through it.
-SINAN-
BANNED
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2013
- Messages
- 16,746
- Reaction score
- 0
- Country
- Location
They were fighting with ISIS....They used opportunity and clashed with FSA. They clashed with SAA. Even when we begin the operation, their leader said Turkey would be defeated.....These guys are delusional.
T-Rex
ELITE MEMBER
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2008
- Messages
- 9,989
- Reaction score
- -11
- Country
- Location
Exclusive video shows Turkish Red Crescent supplying food to Syrian civilians in Jarablus
DAILY SABAH
ISTANBUL
Published 12 hours ago
An exclusive video aired by Turkey's news channel TRT World showed on Sunday Turkish Red Crescent's relief activities in Syrian town of Jarablus, recently liberated from the Daesh terrorist organization by the Turkey-backed Free Syrian Army (FSA).
Ediz Tiyansan, the first foreign journalist to report live from town said that Jarablus's civilians have celebrated Daesh's defeat by the FSA and Turkish forces.
Telling about his arrival to the city, TRT World's Tiyansan said "That was one of the most emotional moments of my life. Just as we arrived into the city, the crowd had already gathered and upon seeing the Red Crescent truck, they started cheering."
The journalist also asked the locals about their experiences under Daesh rule. "It was absolute hell," he quoted locals as saying.
The locals said there was no food or supplies as Daesh constantly confiscated things from people. 'We went hungry' for some 17 months," one of the locals said.
Touching upon the Turkish Red Crescent's efforts to help locals, he said "The Red Crescent is bringing 5.000 meal portions every day. Officials told me they will continue providing aid as long as it's necessary," he added.
TRT reported that the FSA fighters are always on alert for any possible Daesh sleeper cells embedded within the civilian crowds.
Showing the main square of the town on camera, Tisanyan said that just a week ago it was used as a stage for Daesh's brutal beheadings and torture. "Locals were encouraged to watch them," he added.
Elements of the FSA backed by Turkish air and ground support encircled the Daesh-held northern Syrian town of Jarablus as part of the joint Turkey-anti Daesh coalition operation dubbed Euphrates Shield last Wednesday, and took control of the town later in the day.
http://www.dailysabah.com/syrian-cr...upplying-food-to-syrian-civilians-in-jarablus
DAILY SABAH
ISTANBUL
Published 12 hours ago
An exclusive video aired by Turkey's news channel TRT World showed on Sunday Turkish Red Crescent's relief activities in Syrian town of Jarablus, recently liberated from the Daesh terrorist organization by the Turkey-backed Free Syrian Army (FSA).
Ediz Tiyansan, the first foreign journalist to report live from town said that Jarablus's civilians have celebrated Daesh's defeat by the FSA and Turkish forces.
Telling about his arrival to the city, TRT World's Tiyansan said "That was one of the most emotional moments of my life. Just as we arrived into the city, the crowd had already gathered and upon seeing the Red Crescent truck, they started cheering."
The journalist also asked the locals about their experiences under Daesh rule. "It was absolute hell," he quoted locals as saying.
The locals said there was no food or supplies as Daesh constantly confiscated things from people. 'We went hungry' for some 17 months," one of the locals said.
Touching upon the Turkish Red Crescent's efforts to help locals, he said "The Red Crescent is bringing 5.000 meal portions every day. Officials told me they will continue providing aid as long as it's necessary," he added.
TRT reported that the FSA fighters are always on alert for any possible Daesh sleeper cells embedded within the civilian crowds.
Showing the main square of the town on camera, Tisanyan said that just a week ago it was used as a stage for Daesh's brutal beheadings and torture. "Locals were encouraged to watch them," he added.
Elements of the FSA backed by Turkish air and ground support encircled the Daesh-held northern Syrian town of Jarablus as part of the joint Turkey-anti Daesh coalition operation dubbed Euphrates Shield last Wednesday, and took control of the town later in the day.
http://www.dailysabah.com/syrian-cr...upplying-food-to-syrian-civilians-in-jarablus
usernameless
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2013
- Messages
- 2,541
- Reaction score
- 4
- Country
- Location
That's what 'unconditional' US support does to one. I'm sure the ypg leader is shitting his pants now due to fear of being abondoned by the US in the east of the Euphrates too considering nothing is certain anymore since ypg clearly has not retreated to the east despite the order of the US and the threat of losing US support if ypg doesn't retreat.
Mahmoud_EGY
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2012
- Messages
- 2,546
- Reaction score
- 1
- Country
- Location
a shame that but this is a lesson for the million time for anyone trusting the US the way I see it turkey is now under the mercy of Russia while they are in Syria if Russia started supporting any groups kurds or pro government militia they are in trouble
bsruzm
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- May 10, 2015
- Messages
- 5,218
- Reaction score
- 0
- Country
- Location
Disgusting? You have no idea, I would make those so called potent SOBs or anyone on my way look for ISIS. No more fun for you, Canadian. Join the potent terrorist's, don't waste your time here.
Last edited:
Tsilihin
FULL MEMBER
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2013
- Messages
- 274
- Reaction score
- 0
In Europe especially in Sicily ,Calabria,Hungary,Romania,Bulgaria...terrorism can't penetrate like in Germany , France,Belgium ,because if they start to shit,they can easy become a food for pigs.
Another thing is that in this countries people are nervous and good fighters.
Terorism need unconventional and too extreme way of fighting.
Aramagedon
BANNED
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2015
- Messages
- 8,801
- Reaction score
- -13
- Country
- Location
Syria was peaceful before democracy lover freedom fighter beheaders 
now see what the hell it is coverted to
thanks US, saudia, qatar, turkey for bringing democracy to Islamic countries especially Afghanistan Syria and Yemen
bsruzm
SENIOR MEMBER
- Joined
- May 10, 2015
- Messages
- 5,218
- Reaction score
- 0
- Country
- Location
Similar threads
Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts
-
-
Imran Khan vs Pakistan: Protest of Treachery - Casualty Report- Latest: Pakistan Space Agency
-
-
-
Bajwa calls Bushra's allegations against Saudi Arabia 'baseless'
- Latest: Novus ordu seclorum
