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Suddenly, the Chinese Threat to Australia Seems Very Real

political instability and establishment hijacking and overtaking govts and international manipulation due to proximity with afghanistan, pakistan was in a much better position than east asia in the 60s, pakistan lost because of bhutto's nationalization policies as well.

as far as india is concerned, it had socialist economy till 1990s, china had developed capitalism in the 70s.

regards
political instability because of Mao revolt, to clean junks in China throughout 60s/70s, establishment hijacking, overtaking govts international manipulating, what are you talking about China is one of the most quite/peaceful players in international arena, you have few blames on China on Sparly island conflict with Vietnam, intervention in Indonesia's revolt in 880s and may be in Philippine, but look at the western worlds/USA these interventions since the Korean war that you blame on China, go to the you doctor please

where am i saying its china's fault, try to comprehend what im saying, japan for instance didn't need any foreign player, they developed their own industry and manufacturing, china got gifted by the west, it takes more to develop oneself independently and less to develop using foreign help. China developed its infrastructure because of mass flow of western help.

regards
When that happen if you talking about Western and Chinese cooperation in 80s this cooperation runs only few years and China had get few big ticket items from west, They have mature aerospace/ BMS industries before cooperation actually begun, Read the history of China before you troll here
 
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We didn't develop any role of international investment, but if this is the deciding factor, how come other developing countries , including yours, didn't develop this fast? many have labor cost much lower than China's.

Having Psudo capitalism with a communist backbone has many advantages which other non-communist state do not have.

1. Undisputed / unchallenged domestic politics
2. Full control of natural and human resources within the country, with restricted wages/incentives
3. Decisions are authoritative, limited rights to oppose / disagree
4. Most of the China's development come through HK which has huge incetivised agreements with the west. Post having HK from UK, China's economy leapfrogged.
5. Highly controlled media, playing tunes as prescribed by the government.
6. Almost all of the private sector is either government controlled or have stakes from government. Hence doing something without their nod is not feasible.
 
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Having Psudo capitalism with a communist backbone has many advantages which other non-communist state do not have.

1. Undisputed / unchallenged domestic politics
2. Full control of natural and human resources within the country, with restricted wages/incentives
3. Decisions are authoritative, limited rights to oppose / disagree
4. Most of the China's development come through HK which has huge incetivised agreements with the west. Post having HK from UK, China's economy leapfrogged.
5. Highly controlled media, playing tunes as prescribed by the government.
6. Almost all of the private sector is either government controlled or have stakes from government. Hence doing something without their nod is not feasible.

Are you saying that China has found a perfect receipe for nation building?
 
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CANBERRA, Australia — A Chinese defector to Australia who detailed political interference by Beijing. A businessman found dead after telling the authorities about a Chinese plot to install him in Parliament. Suspicious men following critics of Beijing in major Australian cities.

For a country that just wants calm commerce with China — the propellant behind 28 years of steady growth — the revelations of the past week have delivered a jolt.

Fears of Chinese interference once seemed to hover indistinctly over Australia. Now, Beijing’s political ambitions, and the espionage operations that further them, suddenly feel local, concrete and ever-present.

“It’s become the inescapable issue,” said Hugh White, a former intelligence official who teaches strategic studies at the Australian National University. “We’ve underestimated how quickly China’s power has grown along with its ambition to use that power.”

legislation to impose sanctions on Chinese and Hong Kong officials over human rights abuses in Hong Kong.

Even as it confronts the specter of brazen espionage, Australia’s government has yet to draw clear boundaries for an autocratic giant that is both an economic partner and a threat to freedom — a conundrum faced by many countries, but more acutely by Australia.

Prime Minister Scott Morrison continues to insist that Australia need not choose between China and the United States. A new foreign interference law has barely been enforced, and secrecy is so ingrained that even lawmakers and experts lack the in-depth information they need.


As a result, the country’s intelligence agencies have raised alarms about China in ways that most Australian politicians avoid. The agencies have never been flush with expertise on China, including Chinese speakers, yet they are now in charge of disentangling complex claims of nefarious deeds, all vigorously denied by China.

In the most troubling recent case, first reported by The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age, the Australian authorities have confirmed that they are investigating accusations made by Nick Zhao, an Australian businessman who told intelligence officials that he had been the target of a plot to install him in Parliament as a Chinese agent.

Mr. Zhao, a 32-year-old luxury car dealer, was a member of his local Liberal Party branch. He was a “perfect target for cultivation,” according to Andrew Hastie, a federal lawmaker and tough critic of Beijing who was briefed on the case. He told The Age that Mr. Zhao was “a bit of a high-roller in Melbourne, living beyond his means.”

Another businessman with ties to the Chinese government, Mr. Zhao said, offered to provide a million Australian dollars ($677,000) to finance his election campaign for Parliament. But a few months later, in March, Mr. Zhao was found dead in a hotel room. The state’s coroner is investigating the cause of death.

In a rare statement, Mike Burgess, the head of Australia’s domestic spy agency, said on Monday that his organization was aware of Mr. Zhao’s case and was taking it very seriously.

The Chinese government, however, called the accusations a sign of Australian hysteria.

“Stories like ‘Chinese espionage’ or ‘China’s infiltration in Australia,’ with however bizarre plots and eye-catching details, are nothing but lies,” the Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman, Geng Shuang, said at a regular news briefing on Monday.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/28/world/australia/china-spying-wang-liqiang-nick-zhao.html


It seems that the West is desperate to make good on what Pompeo declared to NATO, that NATO's new threat is China. Sleazy Australians (the ones in power, pets of Zionists) are now following up on Pompeo's declaration. Pathetic and absurd, but not surprised to see Australia behaving like a bunch of cattle.
 
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It seems that the West is desperate to make good on what Pompeo declared to NATO, that NATO's new threat is China. Sleazy Australians (the ones in power, pets of Zionists) are now following up on Pompeo's declaration. Pathetic and absurd, but not surprised to see Australia behaving like a bunch of cattle.
I believe is the "Five Eyes Alliance" than NATO. US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and UK.
 
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It seems that the West is desperate to make good on what Pompeo declared to NATO, that NATO's new threat is China. Sleazy Australians (the ones in power, pets of Zionists) are now following up on Pompeo's declaration. Pathetic and absurd, but not surprised to see Australia behaving like a bunch of cattle.

If it were done to Pakistan you would not react like the Australians is what you are saying?
 
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If it were done to Pakistan you would not react like the Australians is what you are saying?

Fabrication and lies are part n parcel of Zionist owned and controlled West. As for Pakistan, we are NOT owned by Zionists and nor do we have covert ops running against China or Russia. Our government or national news networks don't pursue the line of maligning or waging color revolution and toppling governments.
 
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Fabrication and lies are part n parcel of Zionist owned and controlled West. As for Pakistan, we are NOT owned by Zionists and nor do we have covert ops running against China or Russia. Our government or national news networks don't pursue the line of maligning or waging color revolution and toppling governments.

You said Australians are sleazy for following up on a spy. I asked a simple question of you. If the same report came into Pakistan about spying activities that included installing a Senator in your parliament, would you then consider Pakistani authorities to be foolish and sleazy to be alarmed and follow up?
 
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So you disagree that China have an espionage arms? Like the CIA in the US or MI6 in the UK or ASIS in Australia? I mean, if you honestly believe that, then well.....

I don't know who is Lee Wen Ho, but a quick look up in court case file and google the name, it seems like he indeed pled guilty of a charge of misappropriate classified information as a pled bargain, and he was jailed and released. He was awarded 1.6 millions in compensation for unfair treatment during incarceration (including the unusually long solidary confinement, which consistent of violation of his Constitutional Right as Harsh and Unusual Punishment and his name released prior to conviction, which violate his privacy). So in the end, he was neither found guilty nor not guilty of espionage because of the pled deal he have with the DOJ, which he pled guilty on a single charge of misappropriate information.

However, as a law graduate, case law determined that usually when a person pled guilty to a lesser charge is that he did in fact committed those charge but the prosecution did not have enough proof to secure a conviction, simply because if the prosecution have enough evident to convict, they will not offer a pled arrangement, and if the defence have enough evidence to acquit, they won't take the pled bargain, also because US trial court is heavily favoured the defendant.

Spying is one thing. But trying to fund a spy candidate to run for parliament ? Gosh. What is the success rate ? How much can you gain ? What happens if it fails and backfires on you. You must measure how much you may gain by how much you may loss. It is just too crazy to be true.

Just like to chip hack story. When it came out it was BIG BIG news the world over. Every body including me was waiting for the picture of the actual PCB with the Spy Chip. Then it was debunked by one of the source and no more news on it. It's all fear mongering fake news.

As for Wen Ho Lee. You could also say that over 60 FIB agents that was working on him could not make any of the more serious spy charges stick even after all the big news worldwide. And what happen to the cox report ? How did that turn out ?

By the way you remind me of another poster "jhungary". Just like him you write a lot. Just like him you are in Australia and have links with Hong Kong. Just like him you would throw a fellow American Chinese under the truck.
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And is it coincident ? jHungary last post was around 15Mar2019 and you join in 7Aug2019.
 
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Spying is one thing. But trying to fund a spy candidate to run for parliament ? Gosh. What is the success rate ? How much can you gain ? What happens if it fails and backfires on you. You must measure how much you may gain by how much you may loss. It is just too crazy to be true.

Just like to chip hack story. When it came out it was BIG BIG news the world over. Every body including me was waiting for the picture of the actual PCB with the Spy Chip. Then it was debunked by one of the source and no more news on it. It's all fear mongering fake news.

As for Wen Ho Lee. You could also say that over 60 FIB agents that was working on him could not make any of the more serious spy charges stick even after all the big news worldwide. And what happen to the cox report ? How did that turn out ?

By the way you remind me of another poster "jhungary". Just like him you write a lot. Just like him you are in Australia and have links with Hong Kong. Just like him you would throw a fellow American Chinese under the truck.

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And is it coincident ? jHungary last post was around 15Mar2019 and you join in 7Aug2019.

I don't know how easy it would get to install a mole in the parliament, but that does not mean it cannot be done. And I am not sure if you have heard of the 黄向墨 incident earlier in Australia. It was reveal after a Royal Commission which leading to Huang being strip off his residence and a few MP resigned. So yes, foreign influence to Australian Parliament is possible. Whether or not this spy reveal to be truth is one thing. But that is not a far away make believe story.

Like the chip hack story, you didn't see it does not mean it does not exist.

About Lee Wen Ho, first of all, not being able to convict does not equal to innocents, that is when you gone thru a trial and you were found not guilty. Not being able to convict is just that, I don't have enough evident that goes beyond the reasonable doubt that you did that crime. It doesn't matter if they have 60 FBI agent or 200 FBI agent, if you cannot gather enough evidence to go over the threshold, you can't proceed with the prosecution.

I didn't read the cox report prior to this conversation, as I have zero interest with current affair in the United States, I do a quick search on Cox Report and Lee Wen Ho in google, it mention something about racial profiling, and political character assassination. If this is what you are talking about. Then maybe, I don't know, but that does not negate the fact that he did pled guilty and took the plea bargain. I don't believe anyone who have done nothing wrong are willing to pled guilty on a crime and serve time.

As for jhungary, well, you are the second person accuse me of being him. I don't really know who this person is, and after you accusing me of being him, I have search his post history here. If you read his post, you know beside content rich reply, we have different interest. I don't think I have ever care about the US either in this forum or in real life, he is an American, he post frequently in American Forum. His post are all about military, well, it's logically since he claim to be a soldier. My post is all about Law and Economy. See there? We have different interest. And probably the final thing I would say it's completely different is that he always claim to be a Chinese, I never consider myself a Chinese, in fact, I don't like it when people call me Chinese. There are also a few different attribute he claim is different than what I claim, but since we cannot verify them online, so I did not count them.

And if you believe people are stupid enough to wait for 6 months and open another account and go back to a anonymous forum just to post there, I mean, was it too much work for something very, extremely trivial? I mean this is not anything remotely important, it's just a forum, why would someone wait 6 months to come back to this forum and post under a different identity? Of course, if you want to believe I am him, that's up to you,

PS. I post long because you post long, if you only have a few quick question, I would have posted with a few quick answer. Also, I joined this forum after I got to Australia for my studies in late July, when someone told me about this forum, before than I was in Hong Kong and I am active only in Hong Kong forum, like 88.com, HK Golden and so on. And finally, I don't see why me and jhungary said the same thing regarding Lee Wen Ho was a surprise, Lee pled guilty, and that is a fact, and as long as it stays as a fact, it would be the same regardless who said that.
 
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Australia is thinking too much of themselves in the eyes of China.China adds more than one Australia to her GDP each year. Now it is end of the year, another Australia is being added to China s GDP.
 
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Australia is thinking too much of themselves in the eyes of China.China adds more than one Australia to her GDP each year. Now it is end of the year, another Australia is being added to China s GDP.

It actually mean nothing. Because an average Australian can also say

Now it is end of the year, another 5 Chinese family earning is being added to my bank account.

China have 1.4 billions people, while Australia only have 24 millions, or 0.024 billions of people, for those of you who don't know, that's 50 times the Population of Australia. And yet China can only add the entire Australian GDP to its score, which mean of the 1.4 billions people, they can only manage to add what the whole 24 millions people earn in Australia. Bear in mind US also added the whole Australia GDP in their tank, and they only have 330 millions people.
 
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