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click on the "thumbs up" sign at the bottom right of each post, just next to the quote button.
i dont see Thumbs up in any post Sir.
See attached image
Gucci Juice those nos 250 JETS by 2015 are pure speculation.
Even the RAF where i live can only procure Typhoons at approx 15 fighters per year.
To induct more than 1 Squadron a year,, Brand new plane,, New pilots,, Workshops for support, ground crew and quite simply the COST is almost impossible.
eg. China has inducted 100 J10s since 2004
France has inducted 40 Rafale since 2005 and UK Typhoons around 50 in 5 years.. These are super rich nations inducting trheir own built fighters...
India has barely inducted 100 flankers su30mki in 7 years.
I remember reading a report by ACM Tanvir who predicted that PAF would have 50 JF17 by 2010-2011.. The Artcile was an interview in Air Forces Monthly..
Thus Far we know for certain PAF has 8 prototypes of JF17 FOR IOC by this year end.
We Also know PAF has ordered 42 additional JF17 in version block 1 ie Russian engine & Chinease KLJ radar.
PAF will order block 2 only when either a western engine has been intergrated or the chinease engine meets PAFs minimum paremeters. This could take several years.
Pakistan and China on Saturday (7th March) signed an agreement for the serial production of 42 JF-17 Thunder jet fighter aircraft. JF-17 Thunder fighter aircraft are expected to form the backbone of the Pakistani aerial combat fleet in the coming years. The agreement was signed at the Pakistan Air Force (PAF) headquarters by Pakistan Aeronautical Complex Chairman Air Marshal Khalid Chaudhry and M A Zhiping, President of state-run China Aviation Import-Export Corporation.
Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mahmood, the chief of the Pakistan Air Force, said the first batch of JF-17s would be inducted into the Pakistani force later this year. Mahmood also said that, the serial production of the aircraft is being started with the cooperation of the Chinese government. Under the agreement, China will provide credit financing for manufacturing the jets. Payments will be made to China in seven years. On its part, Pakistan has invested USD 600 million in this project.
The JF-17 is a lightweight, all-weather, multi-role combat jet aircraft. It is jointly developed by Pakistan and China. The Pakistan Air Force has so far received eight JF-17 jets that are being used for testing and evaluation. Mahmood further added that, Pakistan would receive its first Airborne Warning and Control System aircraft from China by the end of 2010.
No sir i got nothing like that
It is generally the same engine like I said too (AL31F), but different versions (Mki has AL31FP with TVC), China never got a TVC version of that engine, not even for Su 30 MKK. That should make clear that China don't get all the same Russian stuff India can get, also at upg.J-10 and Su-30 use the same engine. If India can update its engine so can China (and by transition pakistan if it ever gets the Russian engine). How are you assuming just India with its mighty invincible Su-30 will be upgrading the engine and not China?
As for pakistan, they will most probably go with a Chinese engine. Its still 5 years away and too early to speculate.
Agree with that, specially that it's far to early to speculate how good it will be.
As hocuspocus link shows the 1,5 million are correct and that's double as much as we pay for upg more Mig 29 so I wouldn't call it peanuts. So what was wrong at my post?wrong.
Dassault is asking in the range of 20million for each upgrade not just 1,5m which is peanuts.
Thanks for the info, but did I ever compared Mirage with JF 17? I even said before JF 17 is better than LCA mk1, so for sure it must be better then the Mirage right?And just so you know, the "upgrade" includes making the M2K have
- STD-1553B bus (JF-17 already has it),
- Two displays and an advanced head-down display in a glass cockpit( JF-17 already has it, infact it has 3 MFDs and a complete glass cockpit) ,
- pulse doppler radar that can find objects out to 70 nautical miles ( JF-17 already has it),
- Electronic warfare systems, including new radar warning receivers with instantaneous wide-bank receivers (depends on kind of ECM)
- advanced navigation system, mission computers (JF-17 has it)
- an integrated missile warning receiver with continuous time-to-impact information (JF-17 already has it)
- Increased fuel capacity (about the same).
What I would found way more interesting then JF 17 VS Mki, or Mirage, would be a comparison between J10 vs upg Mig 29!
In a2a combats they seems to be very comparable, because of same radar, highly maneuverable and both should have good BVR missiles.
No sir i got nothing like that
well dear keep on posting any informative data that you have, after a certain number of posts you will be able to thanks other posts! it is a thumbs-up yellow colored sign at the bottom right corner of each post but will appear after a certain number of posts!
i hope this will help you! now dont forget to hit it when it appears to you
by the way welcome to forum!
regards!
Once again I just showed up what techs the Mki might get and am still interested what techs J10 will get that are better as Munir mentioned.
As hocuspocus link shows the 1,5 million are correct and that's double as much as we pay for upg more Mig 29 so I wouldn't call it peanuts. So what was wrong at my post?
Thanks for the info, but did I ever compared Mirage with JF 17? I even said before JF 17 is better than LCA mk1, so for sure it must be better then the Mirage right?
Sure that all could be, but the same things are expected for Mki and won't be better. That's why I asked what techs that will, or could be.As I said, its too early to speculate. But considering that its 5 years away, I am pretty sure there is enough time to incorporate lots of changes.
My personal feeling is, if AESA is being offered for JF-17 now then surely you can expect a pretty decent AESA for FC-20. Then the navigation system, weapons, missiles as mentioned by ex-PAF Chief. Which means better PGBs, better BVRAAM, better WVRAAM. If China can have a working WS-15 by then, then supercruise "might" be a possibility. Onboard computers, sensors, ECM are also things that can be improved by that time-frame.
Oh ok my fault, billion of course not million.You said 1.5 million from which it looks like you are saying 1.5million per plane. But its around 20-30 million per plane. It seems you meant 1.5 billion.
no offense, but some ppl here are being very arrogant and i think they should stop. and have a good discussion
noone is trolling here
everything is backed up with news articles and other sources
I think you forget that JF 17 is a brand new aircraft, not all of it's capabilities will be ready right from the start, but will be added with every new block. Look at F16, EF, Rafale...., they did it just like that. Mki/Mkk instead was variants of a completely developed Su 27, so you don't have to add many new things in a next block and can wait till it's time for the MLU.^
i understand bout the sources...
but i dont see how its economically viable to go from block 1 jf-17 to block 2 jf-17 in 3-5 years time.
i mean look at the mki, its been at block 1 for 10 years? and is due for an upgrade around 2014. sure there's been new equipment every few years but thats very small stuff like new processors, new lcd panels, etc...
No sir i got nothing like that
I think you forget that JF 17 is a brand new aircraft, not all of it's capabilities will be ready right from the start, but will be added with every new block. Look at F16, EF, Rafale...., they did it just like that. Mki/Mkk instead was variants of a completely developed Su 27, so you don't have to add many new things in a the next block and can wait till it's time for the MLU.
So new features for JF 17 in the next few years are realistic (more weapons, different engine, maybe radar), but if it's really going to be AESA radar is anther question cause it will be expensive.
IMO it makes more sense to get AESA for best PAF fighters like F16 or J10, these are more capable and only in few numbers so costs won't be so high compared to the big numbers of JF 17.