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Article 87 or the entire part VII is specific to High Sea which excludes EEZ.
Until the entirety of the SCS is recognized to be Chinese EEZ, the area is considered 'high seas'.

Still...Not one of you have the balls to address the issue of why the theft occurred so far away from Chinese territory, disputed or not.

This UUV is COTS and cost about $150,000 to build. Whether it is used to gather information for military or civilian purposes is up to the owner, just like how a rifle can be used to provide food or defense. If you cannot build it, all you have to do is ask and most likely the US would have given China all the technical information to build it yourself. Peaceful cooperation and all that stuff.

No need to be thuggish about it, unless China feels the need to show the world that her sailors are tough -- against civilians.
 
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It is exactly like what the Russian are doing: there is propaganda value in this. "Oh look how tough we are, the US can't touch us'" on minor thinngs... but in reality the true professionals are shown to be the US crews. Each such incident to me is 'Chinese lost face"
 
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And you are suggesting about 50 nautical miles northwest of Subic Bay off the Philippines is Chinese EEZ? :crazy:

Besides:

Article86
Application of the provisions of this Part

The provisions of this Part apply to all parts of the sea that are not included in the exclusive economic zone, in the territorial sea or in the internal waters of a State, or in the archipelagic waters of an archipelagic State. This article does not entail any abridgement of the freedoms enjoyed by all States in the exclusive economic zone in accordance with article 58.

Article58
Rights and duties of other States in the exclusive economic zone

1. In the exclusive economic zone, all States, whether coastal or land-locked, enjoy, subject to the relevant provisions of this Convention, the freedoms referred to in article 87 of navigation and overflight and of the laying of submarine cables and pipelines, and other internationally lawful uses of the sea related to these freedoms, such as those associated with the operation of ships, aircraft and submarine cables and pipelines, and compatible with the other provisions of this Convention.

2. Articles 88 to 115 and other pertinent rules of international law apply to the exclusive economic zone in so far as they are not incompatible with this Part.

3. In exercising their rights and performing their duties under this Convention in the exclusive economic zone, States shall have due regard to the rights and duties of the coastal State and shall comply with the laws and regulations adopted by the coastal State in accordance with the provisions of this Convention and other rules of international law in so far as they are not incompatible with this Part.


Real islands are one thing. Artificial islands another.


And you are suggesting about 50 nautical miles northwest of Subic Bay off the Philippines is Chinese EEZ? :crazy:

As I've already pointed out, none that you've listed and highlighted include the right for "scientific research". Read Article 246 in regards to marine research.
As for the location, Chinese claim is that of historic title, which goes far beyond the rights of EEZ.

Until the entirety of the SCS is recognized to be Chinese EEZ, the area is considered 'high seas'.

Wrong. It doesn't have to be recognized as Chinese EEZ, but rather anyone's EEZ for it to be outside the definition of what is High Sea.
 
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"The UUV was lawfully conducting a military survey in the waters of the South China Sea," one official said, speaking on condition of anonymity. "It's a sovereign immune vessel, clearly marked in English not to be removed from the water - that it was U.S. property," the official said. The Pentagon confirmed the incident at a news briefing and said the drone used commercially available technology and sold for about $150,000.
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/12/16/china-has-seized-an-unmanned-us-navy-vehicle-in-south-china-sea.html

What is an 'ocean glider'?

An ocean glider is an autonomous underwater vehicle used to collect ocean data.
http://oceanservice.noaa.gov/facts/ocean-gliders.html

Slocum Sub-surface Electric Gliders
The Slocum electric glider can be deployed for up to thirty days and travel up to 1500-km (longer using Lithium batteries) collecting scientific data from depths of 5 to 1000m.
http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/edd/slocum-sub-surface-electric-gliders
See also http://rasc.usc.edu/slocum-glider.html

Slocum Service provision for a number of countries in the Asia – Pacific (APAC) region includes Australia, Brunei, Cambodia, East Timor, Indonesia, Malaysia, New Zealand, Philippines, Papua New Guinea, Singapore, Thailand, Vietnam, Myanmar, and Laos. Blue Ocean Monitoring (Services) is the exclusive third party Slocum Service provider for this region.
http://www.teledynemarine.com/press-releases/slocum-glider-service-expansion-asia-pacific

Potential future uses:
http://swampland.time.com/2013/12/22/navy-underwater-drone/
http://www.businessinsider.com/navy-underwater-drone-slocum-2014-1?international=true&r=US&IR=T
 
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Wrong. It doesn't have to be recognized as Chinese EEZ, but rather anyone's EEZ for it to be outside the definition of what is High Sea.
Fine...Then show us who else claimed the entirety of the SCS as own EEZ. As long as there is even one conflicting/contesting claim, the entire area is open for various maritime operations. So in this case, China cannot use violation of her EEZ to justify theft on the high seas.
 
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As I've already pointed out, none that you've listed and highlighted include the right for "scientific research". Read Article 246 in regards to marine research.
As for the location, Chinese claim is that of historic title, which goes far beyond the rights of EEZ.

Article87


Freedom of the high seas

1. The high seas are open to all States, whether coastal or land-locked. Freedom of the high seas is exercised under the conditions laid down by this Convention and by other rules of international law. It comprises, inter alia, both for coastal and land-locked States:

(a) freedom of navigation;

(b) freedom of overflight;

(c) freedom to lay submarine cables and pipelines, subject to Part VI;

(d) freedom to construct artificial islands and other installations permitted under international law, subject to Part VI;

(e) freedom of fishing, subject to the conditions laid down in section 2;

(f) freedom of scientific research, subject to Parts VI and XIII.


Part XIII

Article 238
Right to conduct marine scientific research

All States, irrespective of their geographical location, and competent international organizations have the right to conduct marine scientific research subject to the rights and duties of other States as provided for in this Convention.

NOW, as for 246: 50 nautical miles northwest of Subic Bay off the Philippinesis not Chinese EEZ

Article 246


Marine scientific research in the exclusive economic zone

and on the continental shelf

1. Coastal States, in the exercise of their jurisdiction, have the right to regulate, authorize and conduct marine scientific research in their exclusive economic zone and on their continental shelf in accordance with the relevant provisions of this Convention.

2. Marine scientific research in the exclusive economic zone and on the continental shelf shall be conducted with the consent of the coastal State.

3. Coastal States shall, in normal circumstances, grant their consent for marine scientific research projects by other States or competent international organizations in their exclusive economic zone or on their continental shelf to be carried out in accordance with this Convention exclusively for peaceful purposes and in order to increase scientific knowledge of the marine environment for the benefit of all mankind. To this end, coastal States shall establish rules and procedures ensuring that such consent will not be delayed or denied unreasonably.

4. For the purposes of applying paragraph 3, normal circumstances may exist in spite of the absence of diplomatic relations between the coastal State and the researching State.

5. Coastal States may however in their discretion withhold their consent to the conduct of a marine scientific research project of another State or competent international organization in the exclusive economic zone or on the continental shelf of the coastal State if that project:

(a) is of direct significance for the exploration and exploitation of natural resources, whether living or non-living;

(b) involves drilling into the continental shelf, the use of explosives or the introduction of harmful substances into the marine environment;

(c) involves the construction, operation or use of artificial islands, installations and structures referred to in articles 60 and 80;

(d) contains information communicated pursuant to article 248 regarding the nature and objectives of the project which is inaccurate or if the researching State or competent international organization has outstanding obligations to the coastal State from a prior research project.


6. Notwithstanding the provisions of paragraph 5, coastal States may not exercise their discretion to withhold consent under subparagraph (a) of that paragraph in respect of marine scientific research projects to be undertaken in accordance with the provisions of this Part on the continental shelf, beyond 200 nautical miles from the baselines from which the breadth of the territorial sea is measured, outside those specific areas which coastal States may at any time publicly designate as areas in which exploitation or detailed exploratory operations focused on those areas are occurring or will occur within a reasonable period of time. Coastal States shall give reasonable notice of the designation of such areas, as well as any modifications thereto, but shall not be obliged to give details of the operations therein.

7. The provisions of paragraph 6 are without prejudice to the rights of coastal States over the continental shelf as established in article 77.

8. Marine scientific research activities referred to in this article shall not unjustifiably interfere with activities undertaken by coastal States in the exercise of their sovereign rights and jurisdiction provided for in this Convention.

NOWHERE DOES THIS STATE THERE IS A RIGHT TO TAKE EQUIPMENT.

Wrong. It doesn't have to be recognized as Chinese EEZ, but rather anyone's EEZ for it to be outside the definition of what is High Sea.
Let's views this as being Philippine EEZ, what rights does that give a Chinese naval ships to operating in Philippine EEZ and to confiscate (steal) equipment, if the Philippines have given consent?
 
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Article 87 or the entire part VII is specific to High Sea which excludes EEZ. Article 86 reads, the provisions of this Part apply to all parts of the sea that are not included in the exclusive economic zone, in the territorial sea or in the internal waters of a State, or in the archipelagic waters of an archipelagic State. I've even provided a map of what's defined as High Sea earlier which excludes the entire SCS.
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Actually, it does. Article 58 of UNCLOS defining Exclusive Economic Zone give the right of other nation set forth by Article 87.

https://www.un.org/depts/los/convention_agreements/texts/unclos/part5.htm

Article58

Rights and duties of other States in the exclusive economic zone

1. In the exclusive economic zone, all States, whether coastal or land-locked, enjoy, subject to the relevant provisions of this Convention, the freedoms referred to in article 87 of navigation and overflight and of the laying of submarine cables and pipelines, and other internationally lawful uses of the sea related to these freedoms, such as those associated with the operation of ships, aircraft and submarine cables and pipelines, and compatible with the other provisions of this Convention.

2. Articles 88 to 115 and other pertinent rules of international law apply to the exclusive economic zone in so far as they are not incompatible with this Part.

3. In exercising their rights and performing their duties under this Convention in the exclusive economic zone, States shall have due regard to the rights and duties of the coastal State and shall comply with the laws and regulations adopted by the coastal State in accordance with the provisions of this Convention and other rules of international law in so far as they are not incompatible with this Part.

Article 87
http://www.un.org/Depts/los/convention_agreements/texts/unclos/part7.htm

1. The high seas are open to all States, whether coastal or land-locked. Freedom of the high seas is exercised under the conditions laid down by this Convention and by other rules of international law. It comprises, inter alia, both for coastal and land-locked States:

(a) freedom of navigation;

(b) freedom of overflight;

(c) freedom to lay submarine cables and pipelines, subject to Part VI;

(d) freedom to construct artificial islands and other installations permitted under international law, subject to Part VI;

(e) freedom of fishing, subject to the conditions laid down in section 2;

(f) freedom of scientific research, subject to Parts VI and XIII.

2. These freedoms shall be exercised by all States with due regard for the interests of other States in their exercise of the freedom of the high seas, and also with due regard for the rights under this Convention with respect to activities in the Area.

Even so, I don't think UN regonize that spot as China EEZ, so all these is basically a moot point
 
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China didnt argue that way, they simply return the AUV immediately.
That tells something.

An apology is recommended for a perfect end.

Disappointed to see they wasted the budget that way to ignite this potential crisis.

But disappointed more to see they didnt use an apology which cost None to end this.
 
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Fine...Then show us who else claimed the entirety of the SCS as own EEZ. As long as there is even one conflicting/contesting claim, the entire area is open for various maritime operations. So in this case, China cannot use violation of her EEZ to justify theft on the high seas.

Wrong. Claim and counter claim doesn't make the area open to others, as the dispute is purely between the parties involved, just as any territorial dispute between neighbors won't make that territory open for third party acquisition. As a third party not involved in the dispute, you can either pick a side and comply with that state's regulation, or if you claim to be neutral, then you need to comply with the relevant laws of both claimants. Thus far, the US has claimed to be neutral.

Article87


Freedom of the high seas

1. The high seas are open to all States, whether coastal or land-locked. Freedom of the high seas is exercised under the conditions laid down by this Convention and by other rules of international law. It comprises, inter alia, both for coastal and land-locked States:

(a) freedom of navigation;

(b) freedom of overflight;

(c) freedom to lay submarine cables and pipelines, subject to Part VI;

(d) freedom to construct artificial islands and other installations permitted under international law, subject to Part VI;

(e) freedom of fishing, subject to the conditions laid down in section 2;

(f) freedom of scientific research, subject to Parts VI and XIII.


Part XIII

Article 238
Right to conduct marine scientific research

All States, irrespective of their geographical location, and competent international organizations have the right to conduct marine scientific research subject to the rights and duties of other States as provided for in this Convention.

NOW, as for 246: 50 nautical miles northwest of Subic Bay off the Philippinesis not Chinese EEZ

Article 246


Marine scientific research in the exclusive economic zone

and on the continental shelf

1. Coastal States, in the exercise of their jurisdiction, have the right to regulate, authorize and conduct marine scientific research in their exclusive economic zone and on their continental shelf in accordance with the relevant provisions of this Convention.

2. Marine scientific research in the exclusive economic zone and on the continental shelf shall be conducted with the consent of the coastal State.

3. Coastal States shall, in normal circumstances, grant their consent for marine scientific research projects by other States or competent international organizations in their exclusive economic zone or on their continental shelf to be carried out in accordance with this Convention exclusively for peaceful purposes and in order to increase scientific knowledge of the marine environment for the benefit of all mankind. To this end, coastal States shall establish rules and procedures ensuring that such consent will not be delayed or denied unreasonably.

4. For the purposes of applying paragraph 3, normal circumstances may exist in spite of the absence of diplomatic relations between the coastal State and the researching State.

5. Coastal States may however in their discretion withhold their consent to the conduct of a marine scientific research project of another State or competent international organization in the exclusive economic zone or on the continental shelf of the coastal State if that project:

(a) is of direct significance for the exploration and exploitation of natural resources, whether living or non-living;

(b) involves drilling into the continental shelf, the use of explosives or the introduction of harmful substances into the marine environment;

(c) involves the construction, operation or use of artificial islands, installations and structures referred to in articles 60 and 80;

(d) contains information communicated pursuant to article 248 regarding the nature and objectives of the project which is inaccurate or if the researching State or competent international organization has outstanding obligations to the coastal State from a prior research project.


6. Notwithstanding the provisions of paragraph 5, coastal States may not exercise their discretion to withhold consent under subparagraph (a) of that paragraph in respect of marine scientific research projects to be undertaken in accordance with the provisions of this Part on the continental shelf, beyond 200 nautical miles from the baselines from which the breadth of the territorial sea is measured, outside those specific areas which coastal States may at any time publicly designate as areas in which exploitation or detailed exploratory operations focused on those areas are occurring or will occur within a reasonable period of time. Coastal States shall give reasonable notice of the designation of such areas, as well as any modifications thereto, but shall not be obliged to give details of the operations therein.

7. The provisions of paragraph 6 are without prejudice to the rights of coastal States over the continental shelf as established in article 77.

8. Marine scientific research activities referred to in this article shall not unjustifiably interfere with activities undertaken by coastal States in the exercise of their sovereign rights and jurisdiction provided for in this Convention.

NOWHERE DOES THIS STATE THERE IS A RIGHT TO TAKE EQUIPMENT.


Let's views this as being Philippine EEZ, what rights does that give a Chinese naval ships to operating in Philippine EEZ and to confiscate (steal) equipment, if the Philippines have given consent?

You are going around in circle. South China Sea is not HIGH SEA, even if you argue for Philippine's EEZ, the restriction on "scientific research" still applies. Mind you, but Philippine has made their statement that they have no knowledge of the US operation, nor do they object to Chinese naval conduct there. Moreover, the drone operation were not only the very definition of exploration of natural resrouces in other's EEZ, but also a military operation that directly violated the very condition laid out by the article as exclusively for peaceful purposes. That single fact alone make the operation and the drone outside the framework allowed for by UNCLOS.
 
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China didnt argue that way, they simply return the AUV immediately.
That tells something.

An apology is recommended for a perfect end.

Disappointed to see they wasted the budget that way to ignite this potential crisis.

But disappointed more to see they didnt use an apology which cost None to end this.

You sad?

That's unpresidented.

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Op-Ed: Underwater drone just a sample of US military action against China

By Hua Yiwen (People's Daily Online) December 19, 2016

FOREIGN201612191618000267082961655.jpg


File Photo

The U.S. unmanned navy vehicle in the South China Sea has quickly become the focus of international attention. President-elect Donald Trump participated in this public discussion through Twitter, first accusing China of stealing the unmanned underwater vehicle (UUV), and then saying that China can “keep it.”

In recent years, the U.S. has tried to strategically contain China through the South China Sea issue. In this case, the U.S. claimed that the UUV was collecting “military oceanographic data” in international waters "according to international law.” Reports stated that China found the device in its territorial waters in the South China Sea, thus earning the responsibility and right to identify the device in order to avoid potential hazard to passing ships.

China dealt with the issue professionally and with due diligence, and it has agreed to return the vehicle to the U.S. after an investigation. The U.S., on the other hand, has used this issue to hype up speculations, which does not help to solve the problem.

The U.S. cannot hide its real agenda by downplaying recent events. The unmanned drone was just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to U.S. military actions against China. The U.S. has been developing UUVs for a long time, treating them as a “power enhancer” for its military and a crucial part of its weapons system. The U.S. even increased its investment in the research of UUVs in recent years.

The fact that the U.S. released Bowditch, an oceanographic survey ship, in the South China Sea was another example of its years-long attempt to keep a close watch over China. The U.S. military routinely sends ships to Chinese waters to conduct close-in reconnaissance and military surveys. This demonstrates the country's hostility against China. So-called free navigation would not only increase the risk of accidents, it would also create obstacles for strategic mutual trust between China and the U.S.

Both cooperation and competition will co-exist in bilateral ties for a long time. It is precisely this dynamic that has made China stronger and stronger.

 
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I heard chinese hackers can hack Trump account and steal national security material he saves all data on his twitter account with public setting
 
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