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Sindh governor refuses to ratify forced conversion bill

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http://tribune.com.pk/story/1287146/sindh-governor-refuses-ratify-forced-conversion-bill/

Hello Pakistani Member,

Would like to know what might be the reason to refuse to ratify conversion bill?
Is anyone following this?
Your comments/opinion?

KARACHI:

In the wake of strident protests by various groups, Sindh Governor Justice (retd) Saeeduzzaman Siddiqui has refused to ratify the Sindh Assembly’s forced conversion bill, officially known as Criminal Law (Protection of Minorities) Bill.


“Please reconsider the legislation,” said Siddiqui in his message to the Sindh Assembly Secretariat.

In his observations, the governor referred to the letters written by the Council of Islamic Ideology (CII), MQM parliamentary leader Sardar Ahmed, as well as the protest by religious parties, which either called for the bill’s withdrawal or proposed amendments to it.

PPP may revisit bill against forced conversions

“Today, we have received the bill with the governor’s message. The governor’s plea for reconsideration means he has asked for the bill’s withdrawal and for the introduction of a new law,” said Sindh Assembly Secretary GM Umer Farooq while talking to The Express Tribune. With the governor’s message appended to it, he said, the bill will be presented at the upcoming session of the Sindh Assembly. “However, it is the house’s prerogative to accept it or not,” he said.

The private bill – jointly moved by the ruling PPP and the PML-F lawmakers and unanimously passed by the assembly on November 24 –recommended that change of religion not be recognised until a person becomes 18 years old.

It also prescribed severe penalties for forced conversion of religion and said, “Any person who forcibly converts another person shall be liable to imprisonment for a minimum of five years and maximum of life imprisonment and a fine to be paid to the victim.”

Following the passage of this proposed law, the PPP leadership, civil society members and minorities had celebrated the development and called it a ‘landmark’ achievement in the history of the assembly, which became the first legislative forum to adopt such a law in the country.

However, religious parties rallied against the proposed legislation, calling it against the spirit of Islam and threatening street agitation over it.

According to a source, the PPP government has apparently succumbed to the pressure and has agreed to make amendments to it.

“After Jamaat-e-Islami chief Sirajul Haq’s phoned PPP Co-chairman Asif Ali Zardari, the latter asked the Sindh Chief Minister Murad Ali Shah to withdraw the law and introduce a fresh bill,” an official source said.

Some sources even claimed that the governor objected to the bill on the advice of the Sindh CM.

However, Nand Kumar, the bill’s architect, insisted it was a genuine issue because forced conversions continue to pose a threat to the Hindu community. “Minor girls are compelled to change their religion and get married to Muslim men in Sindh,” he said, terming the government decision to withdraw the law a ‘cowardly act’

“No one objects to changing their faith out of their free-will. But it is a criminal practice to forcibly convert anybody,” he added. “I don’t know where the PPP stands after this decision. The party claims to have taken the mantle for the rights of minorities, yet it has surrendered that role,” he said.

More forced conversions going on than reported, says MP

PPP’s parliamentary leader in the Sindh Assembly, Nisar Ahmed Khuhro, justified his party and government policy. “We still own this bill, but since some parties have expressed reservations, so we have to redress the same,” he said. “The government will not withdraw the bill, but will make amendments to it,” he added.

However, sources privy to the development told The Express Tribune that the bill will again be sent to a standing committee for the point of view of religious parties to be incorporated in it. “I don’t know what will be the fate of this law, but it may hang in the balance,” a senior bureaucrat in Sindh Assembly said.

The PML-N’s MNA Ramesh Kumar Vakwani, who also heads the Pakistan Hindu Council, said: “It will be a big tragedy for non-Muslims, if the bill is withdrawn. After this decision the extremist elements will become confident and minorities will feel insecure.”

Published in The Express Tribune, January 7th, 2017.
 
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I wonder why the opposition? The minorities are not even sizable ; probably less than 5% of Pak population put together.
 
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GOOD.

This stupid bill should be rescinded.

The bill makes it illegal for anybody under 18 to convert to Islam. Like what the f*ck? Yes, forced conversions should be illegal and punished. But, a 17 year old has every right to choose whatever he/she wants to do with his life. How can government--in an Islamic republic!--make it illegal for 16,17 year olds to become Muslim

It doesn't happen even in U.S or india. Talk about Sindh assembly trying to lick extra Western a$$ due to NGO's and dollars.

These corrupt waderas...na deen k na mulk k!!

I wonder why the opposition? The minorities are not even sizable ; probably less than 5% of Pak population put together.
 
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http://tribune.com.pk/story/1287146/sindh-governor-refuses-ratify-forced-conversion-bill/

Hello Pakistani Member,

Would like to know what might be the reason to refuse to ratify conversion bill?
Is anyone following this?
Your comments/opinion?

KARACHI:

In the wake of strident protests by various groups, Sindh Governor Justice (retd) Saeeduzzaman Siddiqui has refused to ratify the Sindh Assembly’s forced conversion bill, officially known as Criminal Law (Protection of Minorities) Bill.


“Please reconsider the legislation,” said Siddiqui in his message to the Sindh Assembly Secretariat.

In his observations, the governor referred to the letters written by the Council of Islamic Ideology (CII), MQM parliamentary leader Sardar Ahmed, as well as the protest by religious parties, which either called for the bill’s withdrawal or proposed amendments to it.

PPP may revisit bill against forced conversions

“Today, we have received the bill with the governor’s message. The governor’s plea for reconsideration means he has asked for the bill’s withdrawal and for the introduction of a new law,” said Sindh Assembly Secretary GM Umer Farooq while talking to The Express Tribune. With the governor’s message appended to it, he said, the bill will be presented at the upcoming session of the Sindh Assembly. “However, it is the house’s prerogative to accept it or not,” he said.

The private bill – jointly moved by the ruling PPP and the PML-F lawmakers and unanimously passed by the assembly on November 24 –recommended that change of religion not be recognised until a person becomes 18 years old.

It also prescribed severe penalties for forced conversion of religion and said, “Any person who forcibly converts another person shall be liable to imprisonment for a minimum of five years and maximum of life imprisonment and a fine to be paid to the victim.”

Following the passage of this proposed law, the PPP leadership, civil society members and minorities had celebrated the development and called it a ‘landmark’ achievement in the history of the assembly, which became the first legislative forum to adopt such a law in the country.

However, religious parties rallied against the proposed legislation, calling it against the spirit of Islam and threatening street agitation over it.

According to a source, the PPP government has apparently succumbed to the pressure and has agreed to make amendments to it.

“After Jamaat-e-Islami chief Sirajul Haq’s phoned PPP Co-chairman Asif Ali Zardari, the latter asked the Sindh Chief Minister Murad Ali Shah to withdraw the law and introduce a fresh bill,” an official source said.

Some sources even claimed that the governor objected to the bill on the advice of the Sindh CM.

However, Nand Kumar, the bill’s architect, insisted it was a genuine issue because forced conversions continue to pose a threat to the Hindu community. “Minor girls are compelled to change their religion and get married to Muslim men in Sindh,” he said, terming the government decision to withdraw the law a ‘cowardly act’

“No one objects to changing their faith out of their free-will. But it is a criminal practice to forcibly convert anybody,” he added. “I don’t know where the PPP stands after this decision. The party claims to have taken the mantle for the rights of minorities, yet it has surrendered that role,” he said.

More forced conversions going on than reported, says MP

PPP’s parliamentary leader in the Sindh Assembly, Nisar Ahmed Khuhro, justified his party and government policy. “We still own this bill, but since some parties have expressed reservations, so we have to redress the same,” he said. “The government will not withdraw the bill, but will make amendments to it,” he added.

However, sources privy to the development told The Express Tribune that the bill will again be sent to a standing committee for the point of view of religious parties to be incorporated in it. “I don’t know what will be the fate of this law, but it may hang in the balance,” a senior bureaucrat in Sindh Assembly said.

The PML-N’s MNA Ramesh Kumar Vakwani, who also heads the Pakistan Hindu Council, said: “It will be a big tragedy for non-Muslims, if the bill is withdrawn. After this decision the extremist elements will become confident and minorities will feel insecure.”

Published in The Express Tribune, January 7th, 2017.
Title is very misleading, but what do you expect from our media? They exaggerate and twist everything to gain more views and attention.

The bill has little to do towards 'forced conversations'. It just makes it illegal for people under 18 to convert to Islam.
 
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This bill actually is contradictory to the constitution of pakistan legally speaking as it states that no law in conflict with islamic jurispudence can be enacted, this age clause goes directly against pronciple of islam hence was a bill directlt sanctioned by zionist money no dount via their greatest facilitators aka the ppp..
 
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One needs to be convinced to change his/her religion. A child can easily be convinced because of mental immaturity. The responsibility of deciding for a child rests with his parent in any case. So I agree with a declared minimum age (maybe 14 or something) after which a man/woman is deemed capable of making his/her own decisions.
If you don't agree with the minimum age, and think it depends on case by case bases, then the only other way to establish if a person is capable of making his/her own decision is again through his parents.
We have personalities in Islamic history who converted in a young age but I think it happened because their parent or guardian was a Muslim. Has any child converted without the consent his parent/guardian during Prophets(pbuh) time?
 
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http://tribune.com.pk/story/1287146/sindh-governor-refuses-ratify-forced-conversion-bill/

Hello Pakistani Member,

Would like to know what might be the reason to refuse to ratify conversion bill?
Is anyone following this?
Your comments/opinion?

KARACHI:

In the wake of strident protests by various groups, Sindh Governor Justice (retd) Saeeduzzaman Siddiqui has refused to ratify the Sindh Assembly’s forced conversion bill, officially known as Criminal Law (Protection of Minorities) Bill.


“Please reconsider the legislation,” said Siddiqui in his message to the Sindh Assembly Secretariat.

In his observations, the governor referred to the letters written by the Council of Islamic Ideology (CII), MQM parliamentary leader Sardar Ahmed, as well as the protest by religious parties, which either called for the bill’s withdrawal or proposed amendments to it.

PPP may revisit bill against forced conversions

“Today, we have received the bill with the governor’s message. The governor’s plea for reconsideration means he has asked for the bill’s withdrawal and for the introduction of a new law,” said Sindh Assembly Secretary GM Umer Farooq while talking to The Express Tribune. With the governor’s message appended to it, he said, the bill will be presented at the upcoming session of the Sindh Assembly. “However, it is the house’s prerogative to accept it or not,” he said.

The private bill – jointly moved by the ruling PPP and the PML-F lawmakers and unanimously passed by the assembly on November 24 –recommended that change of religion not be recognised until a person becomes 18 years old.

It also prescribed severe penalties for forced conversion of religion and said, “Any person who forcibly converts another person shall be liable to imprisonment for a minimum of five years and maximum of life imprisonment and a fine to be paid to the victim.”

Following the passage of this proposed law, the PPP leadership, civil society members and minorities had celebrated the development and called it a ‘landmark’ achievement in the history of the assembly, which became the first legislative forum to adopt such a law in the country.

However, religious parties rallied against the proposed legislation, calling it against the spirit of Islam and threatening street agitation over it.

According to a source, the PPP government has apparently succumbed to the pressure and has agreed to make amendments to it.

“After Jamaat-e-Islami chief Sirajul Haq’s phoned PPP Co-chairman Asif Ali Zardari, the latter asked the Sindh Chief Minister Murad Ali Shah to withdraw the law and introduce a fresh bill,” an official source said.

Some sources even claimed that the governor objected to the bill on the advice of the Sindh CM.

However, Nand Kumar, the bill’s architect, insisted it was a genuine issue because forced conversions continue to pose a threat to the Hindu community. “Minor girls are compelled to change their religion and get married to Muslim men in Sindh,” he said, terming the government decision to withdraw the law a ‘cowardly act’

“No one objects to changing their faith out of their free-will. But it is a criminal practice to forcibly convert anybody,” he added. “I don’t know where the PPP stands after this decision. The party claims to have taken the mantle for the rights of minorities, yet it has surrendered that role,” he said.

More forced conversions going on than reported, says MP

PPP’s parliamentary leader in the Sindh Assembly, Nisar Ahmed Khuhro, justified his party and government policy. “We still own this bill, but since some parties have expressed reservations, so we have to redress the same,” he said. “The government will not withdraw the bill, but will make amendments to it,” he added.

However, sources privy to the development told The Express Tribune that the bill will again be sent to a standing committee for the point of view of religious parties to be incorporated in it. “I don’t know what will be the fate of this law, but it may hang in the balance,” a senior bureaucrat in Sindh Assembly said.

The PML-N’s MNA Ramesh Kumar Vakwani, who also heads the Pakistan Hindu Council, said: “It will be a big tragedy for non-Muslims, if the bill is withdrawn. After this decision the extremist elements will become confident and minorities will feel insecure.”

Published in The Express Tribune, January 7th, 2017.
:tup: decision. This would have been embarrassing for an Islamic Republic. Hindus having an issue with conversion should move to India, Nepal or other countries instead.
 
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GOOD.

This stupid bill should be rescinded.

The bill makes it illegal for anybody under 18 to convert to Islam. Like what the f*ck? Yes, forced conversions should be illegal and punished. But, a 17 year old has every right to choose whatever he/she wants to do with his life. How can government--in an Islamic republic!--make it illegal for 16,17 year olds to become Muslim

It doesn't happen even in U.S or india. Talk about Sindh assembly trying to lick extra Western a$$ due to NGO's and dollars.

These corrupt waderas...na deen k na mulk k!!
Title is very misleading, but what do you expect from our media? They exaggerate and twist everything to gain more views and attention.

The bill has little to do towards 'forced conversations'. It just makes it illegal for people under 18 to convert to Islam.


If somebody was really eager about Islam, they would spend those years studying it further, before formally converting at 18.

Don't understand how this is an issue? If a non-Muslim suddenly has the urge to convert, but then 'forgets' about Islam a year or two later, then they don't have the iman to be a proper Muslim anyway.
 
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If somebody was really eager about Islam, they would spend those years studying it further, before formally converting at 18.

You can not decide what people should do or not. You can only advise.

Therefore, there shouldn't be any law barring a person from converting to Islam before age 18. As simple as that.
 
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You can not decide what people should do or not. You can only advise.

Therefore, there shouldn't be any law barring a person from converting to Islam before age 18. As simple as that.

By opposing this bill your contradicting yourself.

The bill states:

“Any person who forcibly converts another person shall be liable to imprisonment for a minimum of five years and maximum of life imprisonment and a fine to be paid to the victim.”

and, as you said:

You can not decide what people should do or not. You can only advise.

As for the under 18 provision, Nand Kumar, the bills architect, states that “Minor girls are compelled to change their religion and get married to Muslim men in Sindh”.

How is forcing an underage girl to convert "advising" them. If this bill doesn't go through then people will continue to be forced to convert.
 
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By opposing this bill your contradicting yourself.

I am not. Show me how am I contradicting myself?

As long as you aren't breaking the law of land and harming others, government go no business in your personal life.


As for the under 18 provision, Nand Kumar, the bills architect, states that “Minor girls are compelled to change their religion and get married to Muslim men in Sindh”.

How is forcing an underage girl to convert "advising" them. If this bill doesn't go through then people will continue to be forced to convert.

Okay, stop the forced conversions. Why the bill is making it illegal to convert to Islam below 18 years of age? That's the most horrendous thing I have ever heard.

It is a very simple premise. You can not ban voluntary actions of people just because somebody else breaks the law.

Action should ONLY be taken against those who break the law (forced conversions)--not those who do not.

It is a simple premise, I don't know why are you finding it so hard to grasp. May I ask your age?
 
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You can not decide what people should do or not. You can only advise.

Therefore, there shouldn't be any law barring a person from converting to Islam before age 18. As simple as that.


The issue is that there are occasional forced conversions in rural Sindh (mostly of Hindus). While some aren't declared "converted" by force, it does happen. Secondly, you can never stop someone from believing something in their heart and mind. If a non-Muslim sincerely converts to Islam, Allah will accept their Iman from the moment they do so. That's what really matters.

However, sometimes Hindus are declared converted by some Imam, and are then wrongfully married off to a Muslim and have to live with their new Muslim family away from home, despite having never accepted the faith in their heart. Wrong not only to them, but also to their new Muslim spouse.

That is what this law aimed to prevent. Genuine conversions at any age are not a problem, obviously. Secondly, it's not necessarily a bad thing that a younger teenager who genuinely wants to convert to Islam spends a few years getting to know his or her religion before being accepted by the government as a Muslim and being eligible for marriage to a Muslim. After all, they only recently became old enough to think about this topic critically.
 
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So essentially trying to cover poor police performance with an iron law. Minorities should be protected. Any hindu girl converting to Islam above 14 should be brought before a Magistrate and investigated if out of free will, if not the family should be protected.
Sindh is a very backward and poor place. How this could be implemented is anyone ones guess. 'Bhutto tu Zindah hai'
 
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Man I do really feel sorry for the poor Hindus in rural Sindh, they have had it the worst. Having their ancient temples destroyed and now their young girls being kidnapped by Sunnis and forcibly converted to Islam.

This bill gave some hope but alas too much to ask from paedophile Mullah worshipping society.
 
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