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Sikh families leave Orakzai after Taliban demand jizia

All said and done - this is not justified.

The only taxes that the minority community should pay must be due to the Federal govt. , such taxes in the name of religion is ancient and regressive , not to mention Blackmail.

One question though , under normal circumstances - if the Sikh family were to file a complaint in the police station for Blackmail or for threatning , the police would have to jail the person who asks for such taxes , right. Or is there a legal provision
 
All said and done - this is not justified.

The only taxes that the minority community should pay must be due to the Federal govt. , such taxes in the name of religion is ancient and regressive , not to mention Blackmail.

One question though , under normal circumstances - if the Sikh family were to file a complaint in the police station for Blackmail or for threatning , the police would have to jail the person who asks for such taxes , right. Or is there a legal provision
You are spot-on Nihat.

A person (muslim or non-muslim) can file a complaint for extortion, but the police in Orakzai is helpless. Religion is a sticky issue. They don't want to rub the Taliban the wrong way because they are outnumbered by hundreds and thousands.

I think there is no legal provision because Sharia is not enforced all over the country, hence all citizens come under state law. Whatever is provisioned in the state law books about extortion and punishments etc can be invoked by the Sikhs (or other religious minorities) in normal circumstances.
 
No u are wrong!!!

The non-muslim who cant convert, has to jizya!!
This is right!!

what kind of statement is this !! obviously jizya is levied on non muslims. Only conversion to Islam will make jizya null and void but Zakat will apply.
What did you find wrong with this statement ??? Are you trying to imply that there is a way out of Jizya without paying and still being a non muslim ??

secondly, jizya levy is not transferrable and not of a fixed amount. Prison awaits anyone that does not or cannot pay this amount !

thirdly, only taliban types approve of this ! Pakistan has taxation system from the british system and common law and a democratic parliamentary system . Only regressive societies like the which the talibaans want to establish believe in Jizya and other repressive measures !
 
All said and done - this is not justified.

The only taxes that the minority community should pay must be due to the Federal govt. , such taxes in the name of religion is ancient and regressive , not to mention Blackmail.

Times of India once again tried to sell its lies. It was not case of any jizia or religious tax. Kidnapping for ransom is a normal norm in tribal areas of NWFP and it has nothing to do with religion.
These criminals kidnapp and hijack vehicles of everyone irrespective of their religion.

In this case the only crime of these Sikhs is that they are wealthy traders and whoever has wealth becomes victim of these kidnappers for extortion.

The media hype is just because they are non-Muslims otherwise Muslim Pakistanis not only from NWFP but also from acorss Pakistan specially from Punjab have been kidnapped by these criminals from FATA for ransom and extortion.
But media has been taking it as a normal thing.

It is business rather than anything to do with religion. ToI will continue to do yellow journalism.

One question though , under normal circumstances - if the Sikh family were to file a complaint in the police station for Blackmail or for threatning , the police would have to jail the person who asks for such taxes , right. Or is there a legal provision

Anyone can complaint and file a case in the police station but unfortunatly the police is too corrupt and weak to provide any justice.

even in a big and modern province like Sindh people are facing extortion from activists of a well known political party, the shopkeepers daily give them specific money and they have no other choice not even to complaint to police for the reason that activists of this strong political part are too strong to take on for action.
 
Well let's think about it. I don't think it's as bad as you're making out at all. It's very logical actually.

You pay taxes, or I hope you do.

If you do not, you are punished and sent to jail?

So if a non Muslim doesn't pay his tax, he is punished.

If a Muslim doesn't pay Zakat, isn't he punished also?



Taking this from such sites as "http://www.lunaticsunitedagainstIslam.org", just demonstrates the gaps in your knowledge and argument.

If I may quote the whole verse to that Hadith. It's a little long, but you'll get the idea of what it says.

"It has been reported from Sulaiman b. Buraid through his father that when the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) appointed anyone as leader of an army or detachment he would especially exhort him to fear Allah and to be good to the Muslims who were with him. He would say: Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah. Make a holy war, do not embezzle the spoils; do not break your pledge; and do not mutilate (the dead) bodies; do not kill the children. When you meet your enemies who are polytheists, invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them. Then invite them to migrate from their lands to the land of Muhairs and inform them that, if they do so, they shall have all the privileges and obligations of the Muhajirs. If they refuse to migrate, tell them that they will have the status of Bedouin Muilims and will be subjected to the Commands of Allah like other Muslims, but they will not get any share from the spoils of war or Fai' except when they actually fight with the Muslims (against the disbelievers). If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them. When you lay siege to a fort and the besieged appeal to you for protection in the name of Allah and His Prophet, do not accord to them the guarantee of Allah and His Prophet, but accord to them your own guarantee and the guarantee of your companions for it is a lesser sin that the security given by you or your companions be disregarded than that the security granted in the name of Allah and His Prophet be violated When you besiege a fort and the besieged want you to let them out in accordance with Allah's Command, do not let them come out in accordance with His Command, but do so at your (own) command, for you do not know whether or not you will be able to carry out Allah's behest with regard to them."

If you've read it, you will see that applies to the non Muslim armies who they were fighting with. The are offered a choice between Islam or not. Should they refuse Islam, that was fine, but they need to pay the Jizya. Should they choose Islam, they'll need to pay the Zakat. Either way they have to pay their tax, whether they agree to convert or not. Does it sound reasonable?

hmmm....RR..
1)the sikhs are not a part of a conquered force my friend....they are peaceful and poor people living from ages in pakistan...
2)the jizya and the other tax for the Muslims are not same...otherwise the'yd be called by the same name...
3)a tax totaling to millions...to be payed by a handful of poor sikh families to a renegade faction...deemed terrorist by the whole world...seems a tad bit unjust...
4)when we pay taxes...the govt...builds roads and provides basic amenities....the sikhs have to pay this huge tax just to be able to live..
5)sikhs and other minorities should have the same rights as other muslims...this tax thus is unfair

i am sorry to quote from the quoran...i have no right to indulge into what is written in something which is sacred to millions...but answer these simple qn.s...
 
hmmm....RR..
1)the sikhs are not a part of a conquered force my friend....they are peaceful and poor people living from ages in pakistan...
2)the jizya and the other tax for the Muslims are not same...otherwise the'yd be called by the same name...
3)a tax totaling to millions...to be payed by a handful of poor sikh families to a renegade faction...deemed terrorist by the whole world...seems a tad bit unjust...
4)when we pay taxes...the govt...builds roads and provides basic amenities....the sikhs have to pay this huge tax just to be able to live..
5)sikhs and other minorities should have the same rights as other muslims...this tax thus is unfair

i am sorry to quote from the quoran...i have no right to indulge into what is written in something which is sacred to millions...but answer these simple qn.s...
Shouldn't this forum topic be closed now? I think we have talked as much as could be about the topic, and Paritosh's comment is a really apt ending.
 
Shouldn't this forum topic be closed now? I think we have talked as much as could be about the topic, and Paritosh's comment is a really apt ending.

No topic is closed till it does not reach Kashmir. This is what I am seeing from last few weeks, since Moderators are i dont know where. So you will see lot of bashing from both sides, just wait and watch... :angry:
 
Times of India does add some masala to its news now and then.

Atleast not this time

Sikh families leave Orakzai after Taliban demand jizia

By Abdul Saboor Khan

HANGU: Sikh families living in Orakzai Agency have left the agency after the Taliban demanded Rs 50 million as jizia (tax) from them, official sources and locals said on Tuesday.

Residents of Ferozekhel area in Lower Orakzai Agency told Daily Times on Tuesday that around 10 Sikh families left the agency after the demand by the Taliban, who said they were a minority and liable to pay the tax for living in the area in accordance with sharia.

Locals said the Taliban had notified the Sikh families about the ‘tax’ around a week ago. They said of the 15 Sikh families in Ferozekhel, 10 had shifted while the remaining were preparing to do so.

The locals said the families were impoverished and had left the area to avoid any Taliban action.




And this is from the first post of the thread
 
No topic is closed till it does not reach Kashmir. This is what I am seeing from last few weeks, since Moderators are i dont know where. So you will see lot of bashing from both sides, just wait and watch... :angry:
hahahhahaha, well-said!
 
hmmm....RR..
1)the sikhs are not a part of a conquered force my friend....they are peaceful and poor people living from ages in pakistan...

So what? Jizya doesnt apply to just conquered forces.

Look, this isn't difficult.

In Islamic societies, Muslims pay Zakat, what do non Muslims pay? There is no word for tax in Islam. We use the terms "Zakat", and "Jizya".

This is for an Islamic society. Now I'm of the opinion Zakat and Jizya should be the same. Both sets of people use the facilities.

2)the jizya and the other tax for the Muslims are not same...otherwise the'yd be called by the same name...

Both are taxes. They are called separate for the reasons already given, if you'll read them.

3)a tax totaling to millions...to be payed by a handful of poor sikh families to a renegade faction...deemed terrorist by the whole world...seems a tad bit unjust...

Right or wrong, they are Orakzai tribals. Noone rules them directly except themselves. Lumping all Taliban together is silly anyway, they may have nothing to do with Mehsud, or anyone else. They might just be Orakzais who have been labelled as Taliban. If that's the case, no they're not terrorists.

But someone needs to give them a maths lesson.

4)when we pay taxes...the govt...builds roads and provides basic amenities....the sikhs have to pay this huge tax just to be able to live..

Did they threaten the Sikhs with death? I think they just repossed their properties.

Mind you, repossession is still wrong, if they're not charging Muslims the same Zakat.

5)sikhs and other minorities should have the same rights as other muslims...this tax thus is unfair

The tax is very fair if they apply Zakat to the Muslims.

i am sorry to quote from the quoran...i have no right to indulge into what is written in something which is sacred to millions...but answer these simple qn.s...

There you go.
 
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