Should Indian Army consider MV-22

[Capt.Popeye]

came across this when I was doing my daily routine surfing.

Boeing Eyes India Market For UAVs, Ospreys

Do you think it's a good move for India to buy V-22 Osprey?

First with Poseidon, the Globemaster and then Apache, Imagine the sight of 4 apache longbow and a few osprey follow in the Himalayas

There have been preliminary talks about the MV-22 Osprey and Boeing has made presentations to both the IAF and IN; but no serious evaluations have been carried out.
Going forward, there are two issues:

First is the cost of ownership and operations of these aircraft. Considering that the IAF and IN are concentrating on renewal/replacement of hardware first; there does not seem to be allocation of Capital Budgets for this aircraft. Remember that the Defence Budget(s) in India have to be transparent and are subject to discussion and debate.

The second is the fact that major defence eqpt. acquisitions are always tied into Strategic and Political considerations. While the Strategic relationship between India and USA has progressed rapidly; India is still wary of "strings that may be attached". Hence India has steadfastly refused to sign pacts such as CISMOA etc. Only when USA was willing to forego such agreements did India sign up for hardware acquisitions. While the Osprey is less likely to be impacted by such pacts (unlike fighter jets), India has carefully negotiated through every defence deal with the US.
India shares some interests with the US but is not keen to get into any military alliance or become some kind of Camp-Follower.

I think that the Osprey will come up for serious consideration only 5 years down the line.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

Well, seems like your government is thinking otherwise, been buying American stuff one after one, First with P8I Posideon, then Chinook, then Globemaster and finally Apache.

It has not been a head-long purchasing spree. Each acquisition has been carefully calibrated.

The failure of US contendors/vendors in the "big-ticket" MMRCA deal also points towards that.

 

[GR!FF!N]

came across this when I was doing my daily routine surfing.

Boeing Eyes India Market For UAVs, Ospreys

Do you think it's a good move for India to buy V-22 Osprey?

First with Poseidon, the Globemaster and then Apache, Imagine the sight of 4 apache longbow and a few osprey follow in the Himalayas

well,this is in discussion..India may buy few..money isn't the issue here,its the performance records..India is rethinking of buying a helo which is so costly but accident prone.but not only Army or Af,but Navy is also thinking to buy few of this as a AEW platform for our carriers..

http://www.spsnavalforces.net/exclusive/?id=84&h=Indian-interest-in-V-22-Osprey-intensifies

 

[janon]

@jhungary: Please edit the title to "Should India buy..." - because one thing is for sure, the Indian army will not get anything so fancy. As of now, they don't even operate attack helicopters, only the IAF does. There is no way the IAF will allow the army to purchase it, due to the turf war between the two.

Only the navy seems to have a genuine need for such a platform. Is it possible for them to operate from the IN's carriers? If so, it would be a tremendous boost to the navy's AEW capability, which currently relies on kamov helicopters, which simply cannot keep up with supersonic jets like the Mig-29K and N-LCA. Heavy fixed wing AEWAC aircrafts cannot operate on the IN's medium sized carriers. The UK was considering such a use for the V-22. However, I don't think they have actually developed an AEW variant yet. (Or have they?)

Apart from that role, they can also be used to transport amphibious troops as well as the navy special forces (both roles are being done by the US marines and navy seals with the osprey).

So the baseline platform can serve several roles for the navy - troop/cargo transport, SF insertion, AEW. The only issue I see is cost. If that factor can be managed, then it will give the navy (and the new amphibious division being raised at Andaman) some seriously enviable capabilities. The IN will need them in large numbers (of course, not as large as the US would). So maybe they could ask for license assembly (not manufacture, no ToT) in India, from knocked down kits, if that would bring down the unit costs. And a larger production run would mean lower cost for both India as well as the US anyway.

While everybody is fuming at the development cost of the machine, it has to be noted that some very cutting edge technology has gone into it. For instance, the triple redundant FBW system knows when to control it as a helicopter, and when to control it like a fixed wing aircraft. And so on.

 

[Abingdonboy]

@jhungary AFAIK there are atleast 3-4 different uses the Indian military has projected for the M/CV-22:

1) Dedicated SOFs transport. Within the next 5-7 years India is raising its own J-SOC (Joint Spec Ops Command) and a key part of this command will be dedicated aviation assets. The C-130J-30s the IAF already has for Spec Ops will be transferred to this command as will the IN's Dedicated Spec Ops helo unit. The CV-22 (along with some ALH WSIs) would be perfect for this command.


2) a seperate requirement for CSAR birds, by 2020 the IAF wants/needs atleast 30-40 dedicated CSAR birds. I have heard this news for myself. However it is unclear whether the V-22 is being considered for this role but I know the AW-101 and EC-725 are. But the V-22 would be quite a nice fit here IMHO escpecially for long range CSAR missions. We will have to wait and see on this front.


3) the IN has an unknown requirement for heavy lift helos for their future LDPs and future marine infantry units (SPB). The IN could also use the V-22 in a utility role to support their ACCs (like the USN uses their C-2 Greyhounds currently).


4) and this is only speculation, the IN has a requirement for a long range AEW system for their future ACCs. Now whilst it seems the IN is interested in CATOBAR/EMALS configured ACCs for the future which may point towards the E-2D, to have commanility across the ACC fleet it may make sense for the IN to fund an AEW variant of the V-22 so that this bird can operate off their STOBAR configured ACCs (VIKY and IAC-1) as well as off their larger CATOBAR configured ACCs (IAC-2 and beyond).


AFAIK the IN, IAF and ICG have all been briefed on the V-22 by Bell. I wouldn't read much into this- especially the ICG's briefing but it is worth noting.


Now you asked whether the IA should consider this bird and I highly doubt the Indian ARMY will be operating such heavy lift helos anytime soon- this will remain the domain of the IAF for the foreseeable future IMHO. And as far as India is concerned the V-22 will only be bought and used in very limited number in very specialised roles.

 

[Killswitch]

No and heres why:

High cost

Meant for invasions of far flung places, India has requirements of defending its territory and this can be done with helicopters easily enough.

 

[janon]

...
3) the IN has an unknown requirement for heavy lift helos for their future LDPs and future marine infantry units (SPB). The IN could also use the V-22 in a utility role to support their ACCs (like the USN uses their C-2 Greyhounds currently).
...

The Sagar prahari bal is not marine infantry, they are meant for patrolling the coastline and ports. Also to provide security at sensitive installations.

The future marine force will be fully comprised of IA soldiers working in tandem with IN. That is why there is so much of tri-service joint action going on at Andaman since 2009. I think they are planning to have an entire marine infantry division, as opposed to the brigade they have currently. (91 infantry brigade.)

 

[rockstarIN]

Enough with US equipment...

Limit the list with Apache, lets see how is their attitude/support to the machines bought...then we will see.

IMO, America lost in MMRCA big time. Had they allowed all terms without strings, things would have much different.

 

[Abingdonboy]

The Sagar prahari bal is not marine infantry, they are meant for patrolling the coastline and ports. Also to provide security at sensitive installations.

The future marine force will be fully comprised of IA soldiers working in tandem with IN. That is why there is so much of tri-service joint action going on at Andaman since 2009. I think they are planning to have an entire marine infantry division, as opposed to the brigade they have currently. (91 infantry brigade.)

This isn't what I hear mate. I hear the SPB IS this future Marine infantry. I had thought the same as you until I spoke with some people in the know. The IA will be relinquishing this amphibious assault role rather soon (next decade).