Seattle protects temples, mosques after 'hate' shootings

[Neo]

Just what I wrote in my post.

He should be exterminated as per Islam unless he recants and reconverts.

He's in the USA and will be charged with capital punishment, not sure though if capital punishment applies in Washington or Oregon.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

He appears to be a clever man.

He will reconvert to Islam and then claim that all are against Islam.

Such people have no religion.

They are opportunists.

 

[A.Rahman]

He appears to be a clever man.

He will reconvert to Islam and then claim that all are against Islam.

Such people have no religion.

They are opportunists.

true, I wanted eye for an eye treatment for this guy. Too bad he lives in US, hope he dosnt drops the soap, else "nasty nate" gonna get his cocktail....FRUIT..

 

[A.Rahman]

Technically, as per Islam, he should be killed.

everyone who leaves Islam is automatically killed is a false notion, I can assure you that this was certainly not the case in many cases. Even though the penalty for treason was the death penalty (as was the case in the Law of Moses as well), there was no targeting of people who simply chose to leave Islam without any implication of treason. To simply kill anyone who chooses to follow a religion other than Islam is against the fundamental teachings of the Qur’an. Freedom of conscience is a fundamental principle of Qur’anic that is clearly stated in no unambiguous terms. I list just a few:

[Had your Lord willed, all the people on earth would have believed. So can you (Prophet) compel people to believe?] (Yunus 10: 99).

[Say, ‘Now the truth has come from your Lord: Let those who wish to believe in it do so, and let those who wish to reject it do so’] (Al-Kahf 17: 29).

[So (people) respond to your Lord before there comes a Day that cannot, against God’s will, be averted—you will have no refuge on that Day, and no possibility of denying (your sins). If they still turn away (remember that) We have not sent you (Prophet) to be their keeper: your duty is to deliver the message] (Ash-Shura 42: 47-48).

[There is no compulsion in religion: true guidance has become distinct from error, so whoever rejects false gods and believes in Allah has grasped the firmest hand-hold, one that will never break. Allah is all hearing and all knowing] (Al-Baqrah 2: 256).

hope this help.

 

[A.Rahman]

In the Name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful

​

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

CAIR CALLS FOR RELEASE OF AFGHAN CHRISTIAN
​

Islamic civil rights group says conversion a personal, not state matter

​

(WASHINGTON, D.C., 3/22/2006) - A prominent national Islamic civil rights and advocacy group today called on the government of Afghanistan to release Abdul Rahman, a man facing the death penalty for converting from Islam to Christianity.

The Washington-based Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) says the man's conversion is a personal matter not subject to the intervention of the state. SEE: Afghan Christian Could Face Death

In its statement, CAIR said:

"Islamic scholars say the original rulings on apostasy were similar to those for treasonous acts in legal systems worldwide and do not apply to an individual's choice of religion. Islam advocates both freedom of religion and freedom of conscience, a position supported by verses in the Quran, Islam's revealed text, such as:

1) 'If it had been the will of your Lord that all the people of the world should be believers, all the people of the earth would have believed! Would you then compel mankind against their will to believe?' (10:99)
2) '(O Prophet) proclaim: 'This is the Truth from your Lord. Now let him who will, believe in it, and him who will, deny it.'' (18:29)
3) 'If they turn away from thee (O Muhammad) they should know that We have not sent you to be their keeper. Your only duty is to convey My message.' (42:48)
4) 'Let there be no compulsion in religion.' (2:256)

"Religious decisions should be matters of personal choice, not a cause for state intervention. Faith imposed by force is not true belief, but coercion. Islam has no need to compel belief in its divine truth. As the Quran states: 'Truth stands out clear from error. Therefore, whoever rejects evil and believes in God has grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold that never breaks.' (2:256)

"We urge the government of Afghanistan to order the immediate release of Mr. Abdul Rahman."

Before issuing its statement, CAIR consulted with members of the Fiqh Council of North America, an association of Islamic legal scholars that interprets Muslim religious law.

CAIR, America's largest Muslim civil liberties group, has 32 offices, chapters and affiliates nationwide and in Canada. Its mission is to enhance the understanding of Islam, encourage dialogue, protect civil liberties, empower American Muslims, and build coalitions that promote justice and mutual understanding.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Why should an arsonist or a bomber be released?

The call is a most idiotic thing to do.

Religion has no place when a crime is committed.

Even the idea of a chap who converted is pardoned because he reconverts is ridiculous. A crime is a crime.

 

[A.Rahman]

Why should an arsonist or a bomber be released?

The call is a most idiotic thing to do.

Religion has no place when a crime is committed.

Even the idea of a chap who converted is pardoned because he reconverts is ridiculous. A crime is a crime.

I think you are confused, I was clarifying that you cant kill people in Islam if they convert

 

[JSK]

Sir, JSK certainly has good points but you know what I mean if I say that the issue will be blown out of proportion.

You know that there are other forums where some will be referring to this case five years from now...

Neo...As salim said, forums are hardly considered real world...

As for someone referring to this case 5 years from now - India/pakistan mentality has always been tit for tat...Pakistani members are just as guilty of bringing up what has been done in the past...which doesnt even concern Pakistan (gujarat riots for example)..so its give & take on both sides...

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

I think you are confused, I was clarifying that you cant kill people in Islam if they convert

I wouldn't know for sure, but what about this:

The news about the trial of the Afghani Christian convert and the worldwide reaction to it pose an interesting dilemma to Muslims all around the world. Here's something to consider: Open up any Islamic Jurisprudence book, turn the page to the chapter discussing 'Riddah' (the Arabic word for converting from Islam to another religion), and you will find out that what the court in Afghanistan was contemplating (executing the man) is unanimously approved by all Islamic scholars since the dawn of Islamic history! There is no debate, no need to argue for or against the ruling, and no in-depth analysis since it has never been challenged. It is considered Fact.
http://www.threaddump.org/tblog/archives/2006/03/can_you_leave_i.html

 

[Neo]

Neo...As salim said, forums are hardly considered real world...

True...but they influence a lot of minds, specially the less developped ones.

As for someone referring to this case 5 years from now - India/pakistan mentality has always been tit for tat...Pakistani members are just as guilty of bringing up what has been done in the past...which doesnt even concern Pakistan (gujarat riots for example)..so its give & take on both sides...

I know, some people just can't stop living in the past. Its unfortunate that good threads get ruined by them.

 

[JSK]

True...but they influence a lot of minds, specially the less developped ones.


I know, some people just can't stop living in the past. Its unfortunate that good threads get ruined by them.

Very true..and unfortunate indeed!!

anyway - I searched for any updated information on mr. Naveed Afzal Haq but could not find anything.

May he get the help he needs!

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

True...but they influence a lot of minds, specially the less developped ones.

They would be influenced by an imbecile too.

That is the risk that is ever present.

 

[Spring Onion]

I think JSK has a point.

Anything sensational does find its place in the US media, including a lady wanting to sue because she found a finger in her hamburger and it turned out to be a hoax!

Well may be but not in this case cuz Sir there are many incidents where school students started shooting at their class mates and killed or inured them, But there is hardly any sensation about the News in US Media.

But as soon there appears a Muslim Name there we go bang bang the entire Media is there saying it is belived this and that no matter who is that who Believed .:biggrin:

 

[JSK]

Well may be but not in this case cuz Sir there are many incidents where school students started shooting at their class mates and killed or inured them, But there is hardly any sensation about the News in US Media.

But as soon there appears a Muslim Name there we go bang bang the entire Media is there saying it is belived this and that no matter who is that who Believed .:biggrin:

Assuming we’re still referring to US in this case – ARE YOU KIDDING ME? Do you know how big of a deal cases such as these are made into? Recently, an MIT student who happened to be of Indian decent got arrested for saying/threatening President Bush in his blogs. That case made the biggest headlines and within hours, his whole history was presented on the news.

Have you forgotten Columbine incident? And the several incidents after that? I will repeat once again – every story gets its 15 minutes of fame on American news, after which its pretty much forgotten.

In the case of Muslims however, other Muslims seem to be make a big deal out of it, therefore, Story gets dragged out of its content – nothing more, nothing less!!!

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

That's right about the Indian threatening Bush.

What came of the case?