Scholars Press China to Embrace Judicial Independence

[ChineseTiger1986]

You misinterpreted my post, buddy. Utilitarianism is a form , a political one, that is designed to be practical , pragmatic, serviceable, sensible, efficient. And in light of the current trends of the CPC's reforms , it is a Utilitarian model of government with socialist and Confucian principles embedded. I'm actually giving a positive reflection on China's current political form.

Secondarily, Japan is a Constitutional Monarchy, yes. His Imperial Majesty the Emperor is Symbol of the State, but he has no official powers. Those powers are vested on our Bicameral Legislature (Diet and Junior Assembly), the Judicial Branch, and the Executive Branch. Ours is a mixture of a Pure Representative Democracy with Windsorian Monarchical establishment.

Japan has been China's student for thousand of years, and there is not a single country in this world knows you guys more than we do.

Maybe you can even fool Uncle Sam, but you can never fool us.

Both left-wing and right-wing are in fact all obeying to your Emperor, but they are just assigned to play the different roles.

The left-wing playing the friendly face with China, whereas the right-wing playing the hostile face.

Now Abe's policy has been cornered with the even more stagnated economy, and I will predict that he can no longer stay in power as his outcome didn't match the expectation.

Now facing against the economic pressure, your Emperor will soon assign a left-wing PM to reconcile the economic relationship with China.

All your tactics and tricks came from us, and we know exactly what game you are playing with.

 

[Aepsilons]

Chinese Tiger 1986:


Exactly. In a developing society, social rights should precede political rights. Otherwise, as contemporary historical examples prove, it will lead to in-fighting, factionalism, under-development, inefficiency and vulnerability to external forces.

China has yet to provide full social rights such as freedom from lack of shelter, freedom from poverty and freedom from lack of medical care. These are what people on the ground really care about.

Development and economic welfare is key to a stable society, not some ephemeral ideas. What brings bread onto the dining table is not democracy, but good governance and efficiency.

Well said buddy. China , if i were to explain it through psychological processes, has reached the first 2 stages of Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs; 1) Physiological , 2) Safety. As the nation develops, she will reach the last 3 stages: 3) Belonging, 4) Esteem and 5) Self-Actualization. And when China reaches that 5th stage, she will be the greatest economic power this world has ever seen.

 

[powastick]

Exactly. In a developing society, social rights should precede political rights. Otherwise, as contemporary historical examples prove, it will lead to in-fighting, factionalism, under-development, inefficiency and vulnerability to external forces.
China has yet to provide full social rights such as freedom from lack of shelter, freedom from poverty and freedom from lack of medical care. These are what people on the ground really care about.
Development and economic welfare is key to a stable society, not some ephemeral ideas. What brings bread onto the dining table is not democracy, but good governance and efficiency.

I do like to add something that CY Leung said about poor people voting. In Malaysia poor people are being kept poor. The goverment has zero incentive to improve the livelihood. Improving income of the poor means changing the way of life of the poor and most poor don't like change. That is why Sabah and Sarawak in Malaysia remains poor. Poor people tend to think about the present while middle income people thinks about the future. That is why Sabah and Sarawak is said to be the safe deposit in wining elections for the government of Malaysia. Since poor people don't really fight for their future, any 'aid/gift' would make them happy. On the other hand, middle income people are hard to please.

 

[Aepsilons]

Japan has been China's student for thousand of years, and there is not a single country in this world knows you guys more than we do.

Maybe you can even fool Uncle Sam, but you can never fool us.

Both left-wing and right-wing are also obeying to your Emperor, but they are just assigned to play the different roles.

The left-wing playing the friendly face with China, whereas the right-wing playing the aggressive face.

Now Abe's policy has been cornered with the even more stagnated economy, and I will predict that he can no longer stay in power as his outcome didn't match the expectation.

Now facing against the economic pressure, your Emperor will soon assign a left-wing PM to reconcile the economic relationship with China.

All your tactics and tricks came from us, and we know exactly what game you are playing with.

Of course Japan has learned almost everything through China. No right minded Japanese would deny that , or the role of China in our nation's development, creation of identity. Everything that is Japanese has been passed by way of China. Of course I must imply that we added Japanese 'characteristics' to the arts, culture that Chinese civilization had passed down to us.
Nations, like people, are sentient entities are respond , adapt to the outside environment. We have seen, from 2009-2013, that when China and Japan ignored each other and had antagonized each other, it did nothing to benefit the region. In fact, it took 4 years for both sides (Chinese and Japanese) to readdress the situation , re-start relations, build up on it. I'm in the position that as China develops, implements policies that invites Japan, there's no reason why Japan and China can't be amicable with each other. East Asians are very unique race. We are proud, stubborn, hard working, duty-bound.

I do like to add something that CY Leung said about poor people voting. In Malaysia poor people are being kept poor. The goverment has zero incentive to improve the livelihood. Improving income of the poor means changing the way of life of the poor and most poor don't like change. That is why Sabah and Sarawak in Malaysia remains poor. Poor people tend to think about the present while middle income people thinks about the future. That is why Sabah and Sarawak is said to be the safe deposit in wining elections for the government of Malaysia. Since poor people don't really fight for their future, any 'aid/gift' would make them happy. On the other hand, middle income people are hard to please.

The Democrats in the United States take advantage of this in context to minority voting. This is unfortunately true for many African-Americans, Latino-Americans.

For example,

ObamaPhone Dubstep - YouTube

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Of course Japan has learned almost everything through China. No right minded Japanese would deny that , or the role of China in our nation's development, creation of identity. Everything that is Japanese has been passed by way of China. Of course I must imply that we added Japanese 'characteristics' to the arts, culture that Chinese civilization had passed down to us.
Nations, like people, are sentient entities are respond , adapt to the outside environment. We have seen, from 2009-2013, that when China and Japan ignored each other and had antagonized each other, it did nothing to benefit the region. In fact, it took 4 years for both sides (Chinese and Japanese) to readdress the situation , re-start relations, build up on it. I'm in the position that as China develops, implements policies that invites Japan, there's no reason why Japan and China can't be amicable with each other. East Asians are very unique race. We are proud, stubborn, hard working, duty-bound.

Now it is the break time for Abe and his pals, your Emperor will soon assign his left-wing colleague as the PM to reconcile the broken relationship with China.

 

[Aepsilons]

Now it is the break time for Abe and his pals, your Emperor will soon assign his left-wing colleague as the PM to reconcile the broken relationship with China.

Yes, in fact, he is trying hard to court Xi Jingping. A 180 degree turn from his policy say in 2013.

Abe, given he is a nationalist, has to swallow pride for sake of nation's interest.

Afterall, Abe is not Japan. Japan is the Entire Nation. All 128 million of us. And We want to Prosper.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Yes, in fact, he is trying hard to court Xi Jingping. A 180 degree turn from his policy say in 2013.

Abe, given he is a nationalist, has to swallow pride for sake of nation's interest.

Afterall, Abe is not Japan. Japan is the Entire Nation. All 128 million of us. And We want to Prosper.

Our country is not running by a bunch of angry youths who needs the anger management with you guys.

What we need is the biggest national interests for China, and you can keep switching your political stance as usual, we always know how to handle the situation and to play the game with you guys.

 

[Edison Chen]

Yeah, this is the theme of the fourth plenary session of CCP, "Rule by Law"

Rule of law must follow China's path - China - Chinadaily.com.cn

History was made at the Fourth Plenum of the 18th Central Committee of the Communist Party of China, because for the first time a Party plenary session discussed the rule of law, to be precise, how to strengthen the rule of law and constitutional governance, and boost the ongoing anti-corruption campaign.


The four-day plenum that ended on Thursday was important for another reason: Party General Secretary Xi Jinping reiterated that he is committed to deepening reforms to boost economic transparency, public trust and investor confidence.

Recognizing the historic significance of the plenum, Jiang Ping, a professor at China University of Political Science and Law, said in an article, "No exceptions to the rule of law," in China Daily on Oct 20: "As a key step toward the rule of law, all forms of judicial reform should first emphasize the supremacy of the Constitution. This is the only way to remove the obstacles in the path of judicial reform. Judicial power belongs to courts, and courts should adhere to the Constitution and laws while passing verdicts … There is a close link among China's efforts to promote political institutional reform, rule of law and judicial reform, because the rule of law is an important aspect of political institutional reform while judicial reform plays a crucial role in promoting the rule of law."

Now, the plenum's resolution will ensure that judicial reform does not meet with any more setbacks, for the reform is likely to focus on promoting constitutional governance, boosting the independent powers of the judiciary and the law-enforcement forces. Local courts are expected to get more powers, so that they can resist pressure from local Party committees and governments. And judges will now be treated less like any other civil servants and more like independent officials delivering just verdicts. (To me, in China, the court and judge are vassals of local governments)

According to the plenum, judicial reform will promote judicial transparency, because a transparent judiciary is a precondition for judicial fairness. Pilot projects with these goals at their core have already been launched in some cities such as Shanghai and Shenzhen, Guangdong province, to make judges more professional and independent.

American and European observers, however, may hesitate before either celebrating the plenum for its historic significance for reforms, because the plenum has emphasized the leading role of the Party in the country's "socialist rule of law". They may urge the Chinese leadership to further expedite reform efforts according to the West's "action now" agenda.

The deepening reform, however, is aimed at establishing a fair and just society. The scale of the program will be enormous given its admirable aim, and it will benefit from established institutions and past reform efforts. Also, increasing the independence and status of the judiciary will be crucial for the success of the program — this element has deep roots and precedents in thousands of years of Chinese history.

The success of the program will depend on the extent to which the law-enforcement and judicial departments change to meet the needs of the people. Here it is important to recall that the disastrous failure of former Russian president Boris Yeltsin's crash privatization and "instant free market" reform in the 1990s was the direct result of the impatience and messianic mania of Western, especially US, experts that the Kremlin naively turned to after the disintegration of the Soviet Union. In contrast, China has made it clear that in implementing its legal and judicial reform, it will stick to its own path and never blindly follow the Western model of division of power.

This is bound to invite criticisms from many Western media outlets and even official circles. Such criticisms should be ignored by China. The bane of constructive social reformers around the world in the last quarter century has been the inability of so many Americans and Europeans to recognize that different societies and cultures must be allowed to evolve differently and adapt to the changes at their own pace, a pace that suits their different economic conditions, political systems and historical experiences.

China should be guided in its judicial reform, as it has so successfully been in its economic miracle, by its own experiences and pragmatic results. And it should keep at arm's length the abstract ideological and sweeping theoretical solutions imposed by unworldly Western theorists.

The author is a senior fellow at the American University in Moscow, a columnist for the Post-Examiner online newspapers in the US, and has the book, Shifting Superpowers: The New and Emerging Relationship between the United States, China and India, to his credit.

 

[Edison Chen]

Indeed, we need judicial reform eagerly, but not that failed reform of Russia in 1990s. Every reform must follow the rules of that land, and give respect to the real need of local people, not a political fantacy of elite class, which will make the reform deviate from the true goal.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Indeed, we need judicial reform eagerly, but not that failed reform of Russia in 1990s. Every reform must follow the rules of that land, and give respect to the real need of local people, not a political fantacy of elite class, which will make the reform deviate from the true goal.

The true democracy is to bring the higher living standard to its people in the Maslow hierarchy form, not by voting those political crooks with the fake empty promise to its people.

 

[Edison Chen]

The true democracy is to bring the higher living standard to its people in the Maslow hierarchy form, not by voting those political crooks with the fake empty promise to its people.

Yes, this is the ultimate goal we long for.

China is China, the West is West. For example, the mind, the political thought of Chinese and Americans are totally different, the soil just decides what type of political structure you fit. Although China is getting stronger, still many people are in the middle or lower bucket of income, when their minds are just backward. On one hand, they hate the corruption, but on the other hand, assume they are in that position, they will do worse than corrupted officials. That's why Chinese should have more social responsibilities and awareness before the true democracy. They thought the democracy is just the election, this is wrong, many people today lack ethics and responsibilities, I am not expecting them to prop up the real democracy. I am just calling it here, if China adopts the western style right now immediately, there is still corruption, they will manipulate votes with any dirty tricks, why? They just want power, they don't have the awareness of responsibility to care their people. Some people want free, but even if you have two parties to choose from, what if they are both corrupted? It means you are still not free.

When Chinese, on the average, reach the real higher income threshold, they will take more social responsibilities. It's still 20-30 years when the condition is mature. Now, what we can do is to separate the local judicial system from the local administration, create a fair ground for all people, and make more supplement to the law, put everything under a systematically self-rebalancing society, not under corrupted official's mind anymore.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Yes, this is the ultimate goal we long for.

China is China, the West is West. For example, the mind, the political thought of Chinese and Americans are totally different, the soil just decides what type of political structure you fit. Although China is getting stronger, still many people are in the middle or lower bucket of income, when their minds are just backward. On one hand, they hate the corruption, but on the other hand, assume they are in that position, they will do worse than corrupted officials. That's why Chinese should have more social responsibilities and awareness before the true democracy. They thought the democracy is just the election, this is wrong, many people today lack ethics and responsibilities, I am not expecting them to prop up the real democracy. I am just calling it here, if China adopts the western style right now immediately, there is still corruption, they will manipulate votes with any dirty tricks, why? They just want power, they don't have the awareness of responsibility to care their people. Some people want free, but even if you have two parties to choose from, what if they are both corrupted? It means you are still not free.

When Chinese, on the average, reach the real higher income threshold, they will take more social responsibilities. It's still 20-30 years when the condition is mature. Now, what we can do is to separate the local judicial system from the local administration, create a fair ground for all people, and make more supplement to the law, put everything under a systematically self-rebalancing society, not under corrupted official's mind anymore.

Yeah, only those most corrupt people want the western "democracy", because they can do the money laundry and whitewash all the sins and crimes by building up a judicial system that only suits to their own interests.

I think that China's democracy should be developed from the communist system, although I am against the communism in its extreme anarchist form like we had in the cultural revolution. The democracy from the communist ideology is that the power to the people.

The democracy from the western capitalism has been developed into the imperialism, whereas the democracy from HK/Taiwan and other former western colonies has been developed into the western lackey.

These are not what we want, we want the democracy in the socialism with the Chinese characteristics.

 

[Edison Chen]

Yeah, only those most corrupt people want the western "democracy", because they can do the money laundry and whitewash all the sins and crimes by building up a judicial system that suits to their own interests.

I think that China's democracy should be developed from the communist system, although I am against the communism in its extreme anarchist form like we had in the cultural revolution. The democracy from the communist ideology is that the power to the people.

The democracy from the western capitalism has been developed into the imperialism, whereas the democracy from HK/Taiwan and other former western colonies has been developed into the western lackey.

These are not what we want, we want the democracy in the socialism with the Chinese characteristics.

Yes, we should be confident and insist our own style. Chinese society has the most mature and efficient governance experience, although not so good, but they are getting better. We can borrow some advanced ideas and management system from Hong Kong and Singapore, at least they are doing better than most developing countries. China and those two have similar social structure and we belong to the same race. We can learn their good experience, and modify them into China's real situations. I am sure Chinese people the politicians are smart enough to choose the best way for ourselves.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Yes, we should be confident and insist our own style. Chinese society has the most mature and efficient governance experience, although not so good, but they are getting better. We can borrow some advanced ideas and management system from Hong Kong and Singapore, at least they are doing better than most developing countries. China and those two have similar social structure and we belong to the same race. We can learn their good experience, and modify them into China's real situations. I am sure Chinese people the politicians are smart enough to choose the best way for ourselves.

We are always pragmatic, we can borrow some ideas even from the West if it can be beneficial to our society, but we will always keep our root.

 

[TaiShang]

Here it is important to recall that the disastrous failure of former Russian president Boris Yeltsin's crash privatization and "instant free market" reform in the 1990s was the direct result of the impatience and messianic mania of Western, especially US, experts that the Kremlin naively turned to after the disintegration of the Soviet Union. In contrast, China has made it clear that in implementing its legal and judicial reform, it will stick to its own path and never blindly follow the Western model of division of power.

That's the whole point. China will never accept to be directed and imposed upon by foreign interests, under no matter what shiny motto they may hide their real intentions. China will not stagnate or freeze the flow of history, but will be, and is, progressing constantly, but, at its own speed, and based on the realities of the land, NOT on the the realities and collective experiences of the West.

The democracy from the western capitalism has been developed into the imperialism, whereas the democracy from HK/Taiwan and other former western colonies has been developed into the western lackey.

These are not what we want, we want the democracy in the socialism with the Chinese characteristics.

Exactly, and, China is strong enough, but not a pushover, to keep on its own path and ignore foreign meddling. A Libya 2.0 is not applicable to China, and, the state knows well how to use the language of coercion, as well as consent to "convince" its certain foreign partners.

CPC key meeting sets blueprint for “rule of law”

• CCTVNEWS
• On October 23, 2014

The fourth plenary session of the 18th Communist Party of China (CPC) Central Committee concluded in Beijing on Thursday.

The session was devoted to the central theme of “rule of law” for the first time in history of Party meetings.



According to an official statement released after the meeting, the overall goal of the reforms is to “form a system serving the socialist rule of law with Chinese characteristics” and to build a socialist country under the rule of law.

It also said that China will aim to build a stronger legal system that is both fairer and more reliable.

Some major tasks highlighted include more public awareness of the legal system, and stronger party leadership in pushing forward rule of law.

The meeting also endorsed prior decisions to expel six former officials from the party, while three new members have been named to fill the vacancies in the CPC central committee.

Among the expelled are three central committee members, including Li Dongsheng, former vice minister of public security; Jiang Jiemin, former head of the State-owned Assets Supervision and Administration Commission; and Yang Jinshan, former deputy commander of the Chengdu Military Area Command of the People’s Liberation Army.

Three alternative central committee members are also expelled, namely, Wang Yongchun, Li Chuncheng, and Wan Qingliang.

Three new officials have been named as CPC central committee members, including Ma Jiantang, Wang Zuo’an and Mao Wanchun.

Ma is chief of the National Bureau of Statistics, Wang is director of the State Administration of Religious Affairs, and Mao is member of the standing committee of the CPC Shaanxi provincial committee.