What's new

Russia to supply Sukhoi Superjet 100 to Vietnam

yeah but most of that is now assembled in russia now as it has linced or right to produce these things in russia

Do you have a source for this? I could only find this (Russian produced avionics set to reduce the cost of the Superjet and MS-21 | Russia & India Report) and it looks like a shill publication. No mention of actual approvals, only plans, and only for the avionics.

Unharmed by Sanctions, UAC Expanding Superjet Production | The Moscow Times suggests that sanctions have not directly impacted the aircraft, but mentions sales troubles and the fact that many parts are sourced outside of Russia. If there were solid plans to move all parts production into Russia, this would have been a good place to say that.

Further, there are other threads on this site suggesting that assembly might be done in India for some Superjets. Doesn't sound like assembling in Russia is the highest priority. There is an older article in the Weekly Standard suggesting the whole thing is a scam The Great Plane Robbery | The Weekly Standard
 
One additional note, the 2010 annual report for Superjet includes the following (page 18):
High level of participation of the foreign partners, the leading suppliers of aircraft systems and equipment from Europe and the USA in the business of JSC “Sukhoi Civil Aircraft” will contribute to the success of SSJ100 family being developed.

Really doesn't sound like there is intention to move away from non-Russian parts.

http://ir.superjet100.com/assets/files/library/reports/annual_reports_ru/annualreport2010eng.pdf

Reading through the annual reports is a bit disturbing, Sukhoi are way behind on deliveries. 2012 (last year with an English report), they had 179 orders. They delivered 17 in 2012, 25 in 2013, and were planning construction of 40 this year. At that rate, their salesforce can take the next few years off. (last two numbers from the Moscow Times article) Bombardier and Embraer were converting at about 80%, by comparison. I assume you don't get paid till you deliver, so something needs to get changed there.

Hehe, Vietnam, if you order now you can take delivery in 2030.
 
Those Viets are one of the biggest West worshippers right there, and they will mostly pick Boeing and Airbus.

Russia should try with the Chinese market instead.

Even Chinese Airlines use these two type jets mostly,if I'm not wrong.it has little to do with "West worshipping",because,these two companies have monopoly over civilian airlines market.
 
Do you have a source for this? I could only find this (Russian produced avionics set to reduce the cost of the Superjet and MS-21 | Russia & India Report) and it looks like a shill publication. No mention of actual approvals, only plans, and only for the avionics.

Unharmed by Sanctions, UAC Expanding Superjet Production | The Moscow Times suggests that sanctions have not directly impacted the aircraft, but mentions sales troubles and the fact that many parts are sourced outside of Russia. If there were solid plans to move all parts production into Russia, this would have been a good place to say that.

Further, there are other threads on this site suggesting that assembly might be done in India for some Superjets. Doesn't sound like assembling in Russia is the highest priority. There is an older article in the Weekly Standard suggesting the whole thing is a scam The Great Plane Robbery | The Weekly Standard

says who?
moscow times = western
the standartd = western

The satdnard accusess the plane prodject for corruptiion none of assemble in india mentioned. Youre pure liar and waste of time reading your stupid posts Kyle, you should be banned for making stuff up here you liar. The article is also made in 2010 before the plane was made it pure russia bashing and western propaganda.


ITAR-TASS: Economy - Western sanctions not to affect int’l cooperation on Sukhoi SuperJet
KOMSOMOLSK ON AMUR, August 16, /ITAR-TASS/. Western sanctions against Russia will have no direct impact on the production of Sukhoi SuperJet-100 passenger planes, United Aircraft Corporation President Mikhail Pogosyan said on Saturday.

The company is planning to increase their production at the Komsomolsk on Amur Aircraft Plant in the Far East, he said.

“I can’t say that they [the sanctions] will have no impact on aircraft making at all. There will certainly be some difficulties due to borrowing restrictions on foreign markets. But this is an indirect, not direct, impact,” Pogosyan said.

“We cooperate broadly with many countries on the Sukhoi SuperJet-100 and this is long-term cooperation. We have no reason to expect any disruptions or refusals from our partners,” he said.

UAC: Sanctions against Russia imposed by USA and EU present risk for Sukhoi SuperJet 100 project, but they are not critical - News - Russian Aviation - RUAVIATION.COM
UAC: Sanctions against Russia imposed by USA and EU present risk for Sukhoi SuperJet 100 project, but they are not critical
Russian Aviaton » Wednesday May 7, 2014 10:53 MSK


Sanctions against Russian companies imposed by USA and EU present risk for Sukhoi SuperJet 100 (SSJ 100) project, but they are not critical, Vice-president, Economics and Finance, of United Aircraft Corporation (UAC), Vladimir Chirikov, said during a conference call related to UAC’s financial statement for 2013 elaborated in compliance with IFRS, ITAR-TASS reports.

"There are some risks; we are working on them, but we believe that these risks are not of critical nature, - he said. – In general, the situation is under control".

Chirikov noted that the share of foreign-produced components in SSJ-100 aircraft is high, but Russian-produced components, which are being developed in the network of MS-21 project, may be used to replace them if necessary.

Nevertheless, the Vice-president of UAC stated that UAC “is monitoring the external environment” and believes that “the imposed sanctions will hardly affect the civil aircraft segment”.
 
@senheiser I think I said that it didn't look like sanctions would impact production. The fact that there is any risk to production at all from sanctions indicates that there are a substantial number of critical parts being produced outside Russia, which was the point I was making originally. Further, one of the sources I quoted was the annual reports from Sukhoi themselves. Do you dispute that as a source?

The Superjet does not compete with any American produced aircraft, in fact Boeing is one of the contributors to the Superjet project. I have no skin in the game, other than hoping it will force Bombardier and Embraer to get better. I've also run across comments that the Superjet is particularly comfortable to ride in. So, I wish the project no ill will at all. I'm not sure where you got that impression.

I understand you are very sensitive about Russia's prestige, but you must face the facts. The aircraft is troubled. Not by sanctions, or by the design itself (which I also complemented), but by Russia's inability to produce the aircraft in the numbers required to be competitive. I did not know that when I started reading about this. I found out by reading most the annual reports from Sukhoi, which describe the numbers of orders and the numbers of deliveries. The enterprise is going to fail if Sukhoi cannot find a way to get more aircraft out the door. Producing in India would be a big benefit in this regard, assuming India can do better with the Superjet than they have with other projects.

Here is the link for the India assembly: The assembly of Sukhoi SuperJet 100 and MS-21 aircraft may be launched in India - News - Russian Aviation - RUAVIATION.COM Nothing has come of it yet, that I can find. Is this a Russian enough source to be believable to you?

Lastly, there is yet another hint of production outside Russia that I have run across: O-Bay to purchase 100 regional Russian aircraft[1]- Chinadaily.com.cn
Earlier this year, the Chinese were talking about producing the aircraft locally, in spite of the fact that it is a direct competitor to the ARJ-21. Reddit had a thread running on it, and some commenters had suggesting the ARJ-21 was dead. I'd regard that as a rumor at this point. China is a big country, and could host two competing regional jet production lines, I believe.

The most optimistic projections have Sukhoi doing 100 or so aircraft/year by 2020. Considering that Embraer is doing 800+, and Bombardier 600+, that is just not good enough. The snide comment about Vietnam getting planes in 2030 was a reference to the fact that Sukhoi has plenty of orders, but is building about 1 aircraft per 5 orders - meaning a backlog is piling up. That means people that order now will get delivery much later - probably before 2030, but it was a joke using hyperbole. I think you're a bit too sensitive about it.

Your RUAVIATION link you included says essentially the same thing as the Moscow Times link, btw. I saw both, but Moscow Times included the production numbers, so I used that link instead.
 
Russia need VN to contain China, Russia dont need VN to support him over Crime .

If Russia were trying to contain China, they wouldn't have agreed to a 400 billion dollar oil deal with China and they wouldn't be trying to sell Su-35s to nor increase economic and military cooperation with China across the board. And those are just some random examples off the top of my head. I'm sure there are many more instances of China/Russia cooperation consistent with a warming strategic partnership better than anything experienced by the two countries in the last 50 years.

So with that being said, how could you have possibly come to the conclusion that Russia was trying to contain China or that they needed Vietnam (a poor, backwards, and irrelevant country) to do it? And your proof for this is because Russia sold Vietnam some civilian regional passenger jets that seat maybe 2 dozen people? I'm asking a serious question. Maybe I'm not as smart as you but I can't figure out how you could have possibly decided that yes, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary, Russia is containing China with Vietnamese help in the year 2014 through the game changing sales of unarmed executive business aircraft. :crazy:
 
@senheiser I think I said that it didn't look like sanctions would impact production. The fact that there is any risk to production at all from sanctions indicates that there are a substantial number of critical parts being produced outside Russia, which was the point I was making originally. Further, one of the sources I quoted was the annual reports from Sukhoi themselves. Do you dispute that as a source?

The Superjet does not compete with any American produced aircraft, in fact Boeing is one of the contributors to the Superjet project. I have no skin in the game, other than hoping it will force Bombardier and Embraer to get better. I've also run across comments that the Superjet is particularly comfortable to ride in. So, I wish the project no ill will at all. I'm not sure where you got that impression.

I understand you are very sensitive about Russia's prestige, but you must face the facts. The aircraft is troubled. Not by sanctions, or by the design itself (which I also complemented), but by Russia's inability to produce the aircraft in the numbers required to be competitive. I did not know that when I started reading about this. I found out by reading most the annual reports from Sukhoi, which describe the numbers of orders and the numbers of deliveries. The enterprise is going to fail if Sukhoi cannot find a way to get more aircraft out the door. Producing in India would be a big benefit in this regard, assuming India can do better with the Superjet than they have with other projects.

Here is the link for the India assembly: The assembly of Sukhoi SuperJet 100 and MS-21 aircraft may be launched in India - News - Russian Aviation - RUAVIATION.COM Nothing has come of it yet, that I can find. Is this a Russian enough source to be believable to you?

Lastly, there is yet another hint of production outside Russia that I have run across: O-Bay to purchase 100 regional Russian aircraft[1]- Chinadaily.com.cn
Earlier this year, the Chinese were talking about producing the aircraft locally, in spite of the fact that it is a direct competitor to the ARJ-21. Reddit had a thread running on it, and some commenters had suggesting the ARJ-21 was dead. I'd regard that as a rumor at this point. China is a big country, and could host two competing regional jet production lines, I believe.

The most optimistic projections have Sukhoi doing 100 or so aircraft/year by 2020. Considering that Embraer is doing 800+, and Bombardier 600+, that is just not good enough. The snide comment about Vietnam getting planes in 2030 was a reference to the fact that Sukhoi has plenty of orders, but is building about 1 aircraft per 5 orders - meaning a backlog is piling up. That means people that order now will get delivery much later - probably before 2030, but it was a joke using hyperbole. I think you're a bit too sensitive about it.

Your RUAVIATION link you included says essentially the same thing as the Moscow Times link, btw. I saw both, but Moscow Times included the production numbers, so I used that link instead.
look at boeing dreamliner it has backlog of 1054 planes and only 183 delivered

you also cant count
Embraer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

embraers and bombadiers orders are total in history. They were sooner out and have therefore more orders. If you look at delivers you can see bombardier only delivered 43 planes vs sukhois 20 planes over 2 years period. Superjet 100 when it came out ? 2011? Plus the disaster in 2012 in indonesia which was downed by America so the superjet would become a fail. Of course it sells as of now lower than excepted but in the future it will surpass them in the long run. Our plane is cheaper and technologically more advanced as there are massive technology from all around the west which will soon be localized and with ruble devaluation our plane is probably even more cheaper right now. The saturn engines are produced in russia, only the control panel is done in germany and has to be brought back home the rest is easily replaceable if it isnt already.

Yes we want outsource to china and india and why not if we can make money but you make it sound like they are producing for us but we only localizing it there and share western technology with them which the west wouldnt have sold to them. Because they fear china but not us so we acted like Trojan horse and will give china western technology as revenge to western sanctions and bashing/conspiratoing against our Plane. These 100 planes assembled in china arent also counted yet it would bring the order to 400, do you think chinese would buy 100 planes so easily if we wouldnt localize it?
All in all there is a bright future for Russian aviation and keep in mind Russia never made regional jets in the first place, it was ukraine who made regional jets called antonov. But now since we are at war with them we will never again buy their junk and replace it with our planes, europeans wont buy antonov so ukraine will just lose another source of money and go even more bankrupt. Russia is gaining ground not losing right now this is fact, if this would be MS21 than you would have right to say that but it isnt.
 
If Russia were trying to contain China, they wouldn't have agreed to a 400 billion dollar oil deal with China and they wouldn't be trying to sell Su-35s to nor increase economic and military cooperation with China across the board. And those are just some random examples off the top of my head. I'm sure there are many more instances of China/Russia cooperation consistent with a warming strategic partnership better than anything experienced by the two countries in the last 50 years.

So with that being said, how could you have possibly come to the conclusion that Russia was trying to contain China or that they needed Vietnam (a poor, backwards, and irrelevant country) to do it? And your proof for this is because Russia sold Vietnam some civilian regional passenger jets that seat maybe 2 dozen people? I'm asking a serious question. Maybe I'm not as smart as you but I can't figure out how you could have possibly decided that yes, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary, Russia is containing China with Vietnamese help in the year 2014 through the game changing sales of unarmed executive business aircraft. :crazy:
In the oil deal, Russia get money, China only get oil to keep surviving in this winter. Russia oil only help u to survive, not help u to become stronger.

Russia sell Su-35 to China, and sell to Vn later ,too. So, China cant defeat VN by Su-35.

Some Chinese here blame that Russia should stop supporting Vn and support China instead coz China support Russia over Crime issue when VN dont. SO, I just explain why Russia still support VN. If u dont know why small Vn can contain China, then, check again your IQ, seem like its quite low, thats why u r not smart like Russian :pop:
 
In the oil deal, Russia get money, China only get oil to keep surviving in this winter. Russia oil only help u to survive, not help u to become stronger.

Russia sell Su-35 to China, and sell to Vn later ,too. So, China cant defeat VN by Su-35.

Some Chinese here blame that Russia should stop supporting Vn and support China instead coz China support Russia over Crime issue when VN dont. SO, I just explain why Russia still support VN. If u dont know why small Vn can contain China, then, check again your IQ, seem like its quite low, thats why u r not smart like Russian :pop:
Your mind and logic are still that "funny"! :rofl:.
 
Lol.Boeing dreamliner has all kinds of battery problems ,engine problems lol. And these guys tell us that superjet 100 is bad. Lol look at what you sell first.
 
In the oil deal, Russia get money, China only get oil to keep surviving in this winter. Russia oil only help u to survive, not help u to become stronger.

Russia sell Su-35 to China, and sell to Vn later ,too. So, China cant defeat VN by Su-35.

Some Chinese here blame that Russia should stop supporting Vn and support China instead coz China support Russia over Crime issue when VN dont. SO, I just explain why Russia still support VN. If u dont know why small Vn can contain China, then, check again your IQ, seem like its quite low, thats why u r not smart like Russian :pop:

China was surviving fine without the oil but sealed the deal at competitive prices. China and Russia were actually in negotiations for the gas deal for near a decade before the Ukraine crisis provided China with a cost reduction that couldn't be ignored. Yet according to you, China needs the oil to survive the winter?? So what was China doing during every winter for a decade that the oil deal wasn't signed? Freezing? Or surpassing Japan to become the world's 2nd largest economy? So you're completely wrong on that point, if you can even call the fecal matter you somehow converted into text, a "point".

Russia tried to sell the Su-35 to China but China hasn't agreed to anything. All of the aggressive marketing has been from Russia's end. Meanwhile, Vietnam's not even mentioned. That's right. Your best friend Russia doesn't even consider little dirty Vietnam a worthy customer. Yet you assume that Russia will sell to Vietnam based on nothing but your imagination and you assume that China can't defeat an imaginary jet that Vietnam will never possess. Wrong again.

Basically your sad little rebuttal to my prior post accomplished absolutely nothing except reenforcing my belief that you're out of touch with reality or mentally challenged. Or both. :coffee:
 
China was surviving fine without the oil but sealed the deal at competitive prices. China and Russia were actually in negotiations for the gas deal for near a decade before the Ukraine crisis provided China with a cost reduction that couldn't be ignored. Yet according to you, China needs the oil to survive the winter?? So what was China doing during every winter for a decade that the oil deal wasn't signed? Freezing? Or surpassing Japan to become the world's 2nd largest economy? So you're completely wrong on that point, if you can even call the fecal matter you somehow converted into text, a "point".

Russia tried to sell the Su-35 to China but China hasn't agreed to anything. All of the aggressive marketing has been from Russia's end. Meanwhile, Vietnam's not even mentioned. That's right. Your best friend Russia doesn't even consider little dirty Vietnam a worthy customer. Yet you assume that Russia will sell to Vietnam based on nothing but your imagination and you assume that China can't defeat an imaginary jet that Vietnam will never possess. Wrong again.

Basically your sad little rebuttal to my prior post accomplished absolutely nothing except reenforcing my belief that you're out of touch with reality or mentally challenged. Or both. :coffee:
What I wanna say is that Russia will keep supporting VN despite VN dont support Russia over Crime like China coz Russia need Vn to contain China .

If u dont understand why Russia think small VN can contain China, then its bcz ur IQ is too low, thats why u cant understand what Russia think, thats all :pop:
 

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom