Russia objects to India plans to sell BrahMos missiles

[Contrarian]

Plus the speed of BrahMos makes it virtually immune to any counter like a SAM or so. Its speed also gives it the edge in terms of firepower. It speed guarentees that the impact will be huge apart from the warhead placed on it.

The terminal guidance system assures precision strikes in such a high speed. Its a missile, one of its kind. Why wouldnt other countries like to buy BrahMos instead of Yakhont. Its a much better missile. In anycase, i read some reports that BrahMos considering its size has a very short range than it is expected to. So probably at a later stage India would increase its range for the land versions.

There was a report, that in a question asked in the parliament over whether there are any immediate plans to increase the range of BrahMos, AK Antony replied 'No Sir'. It was a written question. So probably, once all the land versions are inducted, the def ministry will move to have its range increased.

 

[Keysersoze]

Plus the speed of BrahMos makes it virtually immune to any counter like a SAM or so. Its speed also gives it the edge in terms of firepower. It speed guarentees that the impact will be huge apart from the warhead placed on it.

The terminal guidance system assures precision strikes in such a high speed. Its a missile, one of its kind. Why wouldnt other countries like to buy BrahMos instead of Yakhont. Its a much better missile. In anycase, i read some reports that BrahMos considering its size has a very short range than it is expected to. So probably at a later stage India would increase its range for the land versions.

There was a report, that in a question asked in the parliament over whether there are any immediate plans to increase the range of BrahMos, AK Antony replied 'No Sir'. It was a written question. So probably, once all the land versions are inducted, the def ministry will move to have its range increased.

Sorry mate but if it were "virtually immune" then a few more people might be worried. How about a E2c or similar spotting it? How about SeaRAM or SM2 missiles (not to mention the old fashioned phalanx) to intercept it? And as for supersonic missiles it is not "one of a kind"
And there are already systems in place to counter the various other missiles so I would think that one more would not be a problem.
Speed is nice but accuracy is fairly important too.....
For every measure there is a counter measure.......

 

[Keysersoze]

Two reasons against that. The Brahmos has invited maximum interest in buyers. Sale of russian missiles that have performance close to that of the Brahmos are restricted by the MTCR.

Yes but Russian missiles would have better unit price with similar performance. And the Brahmos IS restrcted by the MTCR (it's range is under the requirement)

 

[Adux]

Sorry mate but if it were "virtually immune" then a few more people might be worried. How about a E2c or similar spotting it? How about SeaRAM or SM2 missiles (not to mention the old fashioned phalanx) to intercept it? And as for supersonic missiles it is not "one of a kind"
And there are already systems in place to counter the various other missiles so I would think that one more would not be a problem.
Speed is nice but accuracy is fairly important too.....
For every measure there is a counter measure.......

What makes you say it is not accurate, the final phase of brahmos is sea skimming, counter measures are effective, but i will they get the required reaction time is the question.

Do you know wether brahmos can do evasive manoveour durin a interecept lock by SM 2 , or phalanx

 

[Adux]

Yes but Russian missiles would have better unit price with similar performance. And the Brahmos IS restrcted by the MTCR (it's range is under the requirement)

Yankhont doesnt have similar performance, Similar motor performance yes, Guidance and mission computers no.

 

[Contrarian]

BrahMos does not come under the MTCR.
AFAIK, the MTCR applies to missiles that have range >300 miles
BrahMos has a stated range of 290miles.It was developed so that it could just bypass the MTCR.

Though like i said, there are questions regarding that a missile of that size would have the said range. So hopefully it can be improved unilaterally by India. Since India is selling it anyways, it means that it is exempted from the MTCR.

 

[vnomad]

Yes but Russian missiles would have better unit price with similar performance. And the Brahmos IS restrcted by the MTCR (it's range is under the requirement)

We're talking about the sale of Brahmos being restricted by the MTCR. Russian missiles unless downgraded cannot be sold while Russia is a signatory to the MTCR.

 

[Keysersoze]

BrahMos does not come under the MTCR.
AFAIK, the MTCR applies to missiles that have range >300 miles
BrahMos has a stated range of 290miles.It was developed so that it could just bypass the MTCR.

Though like i said, there are questions regarding that a missile of that size would have the said range. So hopefully it can be improved unilaterally by India. Since India is selling it anyways, it means that it is exempted from the MTCR.

Russia may have provisions in place that does not allow India to do that. As a signatory to the MTCR they would have been responsible for desseminating technology that was modified to something covered by the MTCR.

 

[Contrarian]

The missile has been developed. It has been co-developed with India. India did not merely fund the BrahMos. It has an equal stake. The scientists know the in's&out's of BrahMos. They can SURELY increase the range of BrahMos.
Russia would not be responsible as its not donating the technology, it was made together, India is equally responsible. Russia is not dessemating the technology. India has rights to it, so if India indeed does this, then Russia would not be held responsible.

 

[joey]

LEmme clear up certain things,

1> Range of yakhont is soemthing 220 kms (am i right?)
2> Brahmos is >> Yakhont, Brahmos has its roots in Shipwreck missile.
3> Indian officials did something too, They showed in a diagram i think diff between brahmos and yakhont.
4> Russia is money hungry country, if brahmos was sold they wud get 50% profit if Yakhont 100% profit.
5> Misunderstanding happens, happened between britain and US lots of time.
6> Neo INDIA is perfectly capable of making its own brahmos now as ITS FULL TOT of the Ramjet propulsion.

7> I have been told Brahmos range is MORE than advertised, Its hi-lo range is 290 kms , lo-o range should be ATLEAST 200 kms and HI-HI range is undisclosed as it violates MCTR.

 

[vnomad]

LEmme clear up certain things,

1> Range of yakhont is soemthing 220 kms (am i right?)

The range is upto 300 kms depending on the launch platform.

 

[joey]

oh geez i just checked the report exxagerated as usual.

Russia had yakhont contract before brahmos, its not only yakhont but some Amur subs as well.
Russian official were offended because we displayed a comparison between yakhont and brahmos and showed them which is better

Brahmos hi-hi range is undisclosed and is 100% >300 kms.
plain physics as per brahmos site hi-low range is 280 kms or 300 kms hi-hi have to be more if we follow kinematics.

Just like astraa bvraam has 40 kms ground to air testing but a2a becomes 80 kms.

also brahmos is unique the air launched has 9 PROFILES of attack which yakhont doesnt has..........has lofted trajectory etc etc.

 

[vnomad]

Brahmos hi-hi range is undisclosed and is 100% >300 kms.
plain physics as per brahmos site hi-low range is 280 kms or 300 kms hi-hi have to be more if we follow kinematics.

In the hi-hi mode doesn't the missile become more susceptible to ECM and missile-defence systems?

 

[Lilo]

Russia not for exporting BrahMos to other nations

"India is one thing; she is our strategic partner"

# It can upset balance of forces in any region
# Its range could be extended from the current 300 km

Moscow: Describing the BrahMos cruise missile, developed jointly by India and Russia, as ``highly lethal'' and capable of upsetting the balance of forces in any region where they may appear, a top Russian defence official has said Moscow was not keen on its export to other countries.

Initially, Moscow and New Delhi agreed to jointly export it to ``friendly'' countries.

However, recent aggressive marketing moves by the New Delhi-based company had drawn flak in Russia.

``This is a very lethal and potent weapon system, which can upset the balance of forces in any region," said Colonel-General Anatoly Mazurkevich . — PTI

© Copyright 2000 - 2006 The Hindu

[/B]

http://www.thehindu.com/2007/01/22/stories/2007012222670100.htm

Its range could be extended from the current 300 km

Finally.. the cat is out of the bag.

 

[Bull]

I think Russia has played ot out well and they might be rewarded with participation in the 5th gen plane and the MTA.