Prove God!

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I was raised a Hindu. Ganesh and Lakshmi are usually worshipped in our house. I am usually an enthusiastic participant in all the pujas and festivals.

My family have varied beliefs, some are very religious, others couldn't care less.

Thanks for replying. I was raised Muslim, and so were my parents.

Religiosity in my family, as in yours, varies, with myself being the most liberal, and one of my younger brothers, despite the same upbringing, being more along the lines of Nawas Sharif (and a big supporter of his too!).

By my point here is that despite the very similar upbringing of various members of our families, there are differences between each individual's ideology or belief system.

These differences are what I was trying to get at when I said that "man is responsible" not faith, because despite being raised in "faith", you and I (it seems) have chosen to view the world from a very "non faith" perspective.

If religion corrupts, then why did it not corrupt us? Why did it not corrupt people like Neo, Blain, Salim or Asim - none of whom would ever argue that it is fair to discriminate on the basis of faith, that it is fair to impose faith, that it is fair to commit violence in the name of faith?

Does it not boil down to the fact that those who merely follow along with the mindless discrimination and violence of some interpretations of faith are themselves to blame, for not choosing to reason and analyze, for allowing their prejudices and hate for the "other" to overpower any sense of reason that tells them what they are doing is wrong?

 

[MIG_ACE]

Does it not boil down to the fact that those who merely follow along with the mindless discrimination and violence of some interpretations of faith are themselves to blame, for not choosing to reason and analyze, for allowing their prejudices and hate for the "other" to overpower any sense of reason that tells them what they are doing is wrong?

You are absolutely right. Its the people who are responsible no doubt. But the problem is number of such people seems only to rise, with violence and discrimination increasing consequently. And there doesn't seem to be any simple way to stop such a mindset from spreading. This more than anything else leads people like me (and maybe stealth) to the belief that a World without religion might have been a better place to live in.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

You are absolutely right. Its the people who are responsible no doubt. But the problem is number of such people seems only to rise, with violence and discrimination increasing consequently. And there doesn't seem to be any simple way to stop such a mindset from spreading. This more than anything else leads people like me (and maybe stealth) to the belief that a World without religion might have been a better place to live in.

I can understand why people draw conclusions that blame faith, but such conclusions are drawn from a superficial analysis. You look at Muslim societies and Muslim nations and certain interpretations of Islam and you conclude that it is faith the caused this.

The truth is that the intolerance and violence in some Muslims nations is because there is a complete breakdown of institutions and no representative government.

So it is the above that has to be blamed, not faith. Faith is, as I have argued before, merely a tool to gain power. In China it is communism, in Russia, "democracy" and a form of "secularism" may reign, but Putin has managed to twist that into serving his own purposes and imposed a authoritarian form of government.

Nothing is immune from man's greed for power. The only way to stop such perversions of systems is to not find scapegoats in faith etc., but to acknowledge that we need to build institutions and processes with checks and balances that prevent too much power and authority from being concentrated in one entity.

 

[QuickSilver]

GOD?? Lets see...

The Vedas say 'God is omni present, everywhere, inside you, outside and everywhere'

There is also a concept of cycle of births and deaths and the final aim of any life form is the unite with the 'Singularity' or 'ONE' it is called 'paramatma'

In effect every life form has an 'atma' and only the form of the outside changes and not the atma.so atma is indestructible, the physical form it takes can change.However once its part in the physical world ends, it will have to reunite with the paramatma - the Singularity. (this is the advaita philosophy)

I am more of a scientific person, for me this interprets so easily into the form of matter and energy. If I simply put 'energy' in place of god and 'matter' in place of all material and non living things, it seems to make sense.

God is omni present, he is in you, outside and everywhere - energy is omnipesent, inside outside everywhere (even matter is a form of energy!!)

Atma is industrictable, only th outer physical features change - energy is neither created nor destroyed, it can be changed from one form to another

The ultimate aim is to join the paramatma - perhaps this is the most intriguing factor, an enigma. Paramatma is this ultimate source of all energy (from which all the matter everywhere is derived)

and

since we only know energy in some form or other (we do not really know what energy is!! we only know its forms.. its some means to do work, its a flame, its electrical energy its chemical energy and so on and so forth.. we can only see energy when it is in some form , we have felt its presence and have never really seen it in effect, we have seen energy as a form but nt the 'pure energy') paramatma is synonymous(for me atleast) with this 'pure energy' to which all matter and life will have to join someday (only to be converted into form and life again? I dunno)

this is my interpretation of GOD. the concept is surely there and for me, it is as scientific as it is spiritual.

Thanks.

 

[Mercenary101]

Correction. He "says" he did. Or other people say he did. And if God exists why only show himself to Moses and not to anyone else. Just show yourself to everyone and end the debate once and for all. LOL.

he did not see god he fell on his a$$ before he did lol

 

[Logic note]

I can understand why people draw conclusions that blame faith, but such conclusions are drawn from a superficial analysis. You look at Muslim societies and Muslim nations and certain interpretations of Islam and you conclude that it is faith the caused this.

The truth is that the intolerance and violence in some Muslims nations is because there is a complete breakdown of institutions and no representative government.

So it is the above that has to be blamed, not faith. Faith is, as I have argued before, merely a tool to gain power. In China it is communism, in Russia, "democracy" and a form of "secularism" may reign, but Putin has managed to twist that into serving his own purposes and imposed a authoritarian form of government.

Nothing is immune from man's greed for power. The only way to stop such perversions of systems is to not find scapegoats in faith etc., but to acknowledge that we need to build institutions and processes with checks and balances that prevent too much power and authority from being concentrated in one entity.

Dear Agno,

Truth (Brahman ) is different from God ..
God is truth corrupted with humans perception and desire .
So God doesn't exist .

Faith justifies our selfish perceptions and desire and it makes God , slave of our desire and ignorance .

we have to understand that conscience and faith are different.
when we humans loose our ability to use conscience over faith , the behaviour becomes inhuman .

Watch this ..

otGQqO2TYMI[/media] - OSHO: Absolutely Free to Be Funny

 

[Logic note]

OSHO: God is not a Solution - but a Problem


hhjOnYbKJJw[/media] - OSHO: God is not a Solution - but a Problem