Proud LAHORI at home in BOMBAY

[paritosh]

Pakistanis believe that Kashmir should be liberated by all means necessary. Killing Indian soldiers in Kashmir by PA or legitimate Kashmiri Separatists for the sake of liberation of Kashmir is okay.

Thats what reality is.

then we can live without discussing this reality.
The only solution is people to people contact...no armed conflict can achieve as much...the few times we've had peace testify that...

 

[paritosh]

^^^ A modification: perhaps the declaration should be mandataory only for Sunni Punjabis.

Groups like Balochis or Christian Masihs would have absolutely no problem making a declaration denouncing Hafiz Saeed as vermin. Therefore they should be exempt from it.

Hafeez Saaeed couldn't have said it better...

 

[Halaku Khan]

please understand that ordinary people in any country want to live their lives and earn their bread...marry and see their kids grow old.
Sponsoring terror and wanting blood-shed is for the schemers and plotters...
I dislike it when people generalize their hate...a couple of days back some unhappy guys blew up a cafe in pune and killed some college kids...the same shitte happens across the border...and they are as human as we are and their grief is as heavy as ours...

When did I do any generalization? I only suggested giving people an opportunity to denounce terrorist vermin.

 

[Halaku Khan]

Hafeez Saaeed couldn't have said it better...

What's your problem?

I am asking some people to denounce terrorists, I am not blowing their limbs off. It is amazing that you should equate the two.

 

[Halaku Khan]

then we can live without discussing this reality.
The only solution is people to people contact...no armed conflict can achieve as much...the few times we've had peace testify that...

You may be interesting in living without confronting this reality, but this reality is interested in confronting you.

 

[paritosh]

When did I do any generalization? I only suggested giving people an opportunity to denounce terrorist vermin.

there can be no pre-conditions to human relations now...people do not discuss politics before they decide to like each other...they get friendly and then discuss politics...
in their minds the Shiv-sainiks and the maoists/marxists are the most patriotic Indians of our lot...
you don't have to hold people by the scruff to denounce or embrace a particular school of political view point...living in a democracy you should know better than that...unless someone is directly involved in a crime...

 

[Awesome]

then we can live without discussing this reality.
The only solution is people to people contact...no armed conflict can achieve as much...the few times we've had peace testify that...

Hafiz Saeed - or more particularly LeT is an enemy of the Pakistani state since it doesn't follow Pakistani rules of engagement of Indians. I will have no trouble denouncing them as the state denounces them.

However it totally depends then on person to person and if the average person in Pakistan even knows who is Hafiz Saeed and the rest. Some groups in Kashmir have stuck to their guns and only fought Indian army in Kashmir and not veered out into attacks outside of Kashmir. That's legitimate.

Any Pakistani that wants to fight the Indians Army in Kashmir should join the Pakistan Army. All independent groups operating from Pakistan are banned and denounced.

 

[Developereo]

Absolutely, that has to be on the visa form. In fact, the declaration should be video-taped and posted publicly.

I have never understood the concept of denounciations in general, and these idiotic visa questions in particular.

Sure, a denounciation by high profile personalities is useful but, for ordinary people, who cares what they do or don't 'publicly denounce'?

Do you honestly think a criminal would check 'NO' on such a visa form?

 

[Halaku Khan]

there can be no pre-conditions to human relations now... people do not discuss politics before they decide to like each other...they get friendly and then discuss politics...

I take it none of your relatives have been blown up so far, god forbid ...

you don't have to hold people by the scruff to denounce or embrace a particular school of political view point...living in a democracy you should know better than that...unless someone is directly involved in a crime...

Nobody would be held by the scruff or anything ... just a simple modification to the visa application process.

 

[paritosh]

What's your problem?

I am asking some people to denounce terrorists, I am not blowing their limbs off. It is amazing that you should equate the two.

Halaku Khan...I intend to home-in the disparity between reality and perception to you...
the Pakistanis see a purpose in liking this Saaed guy and all the organizations that support the Kashmiri struggle...right for them wrong for us...
while we love our army and don't want to hear about the hr violations which believe me do happen...
it's all about how different people are conditioned to accept their perception as reality...
as long as everyone puts their own perception on the table...their would be clashes...as your faith is questioned...
however if you are willing to look beyond...you'd see that everyone just wants to have a good time...that is what is more important...
I didn't mean to offend you.

 

[Awesome]

Furthermore, remember every government that grants visas does so out of some perceived profit. Generally the government earns more from the individuals presence than the individual earns from the country. For example if he works for a news paper the services he provides to that newspaper is of more value than the salary he receives in return.

Somebody or the other has sponsored him, has testified him to be profitable to Indians. Thats why he has a visa.

 

[Halaku Khan]

Hafiz Saeed - or more particularly LeT is an enemy of the Pakistani state since it doesn't follow Pakistani rules of engagement of Indians. I will have no trouble denouncing them as the state denounces them.

Well, I guess the state's denunciations don't count for much ... this is from a few days ago:

JuD vows to take Kashmir by force



“Kashmir had become a cold issue. But by denying Pakistan water, India has ensured that every farmer in Punjab is lining up with his tractor and plough, ready to overrun India.”

At one time, jihadis were interested only in the liberation of Kashmir, but the water issue had ensured that “Delhi, Pune and Kanpur” were all fair targets, he [JuD leader Abdur Rehman Makki] said.

 

[toxic_pus]

Pakistanis believe that Kashmir should be liberated by all means necessary. Killing Indian soldiers in Kashmir by PA or legitimate Kashmiri Separatists for the sake of liberation of Kashmir is okay.

Although, in principle, I don't want to agree with Halaku but sometimes comments like above do make me feel that perhaps it is acceptable that India tries to find out if a Pakistani seeking to enter Indian soil, or is already earning his/her bread and butter in India, is a closet jihadi/terrorist, who secretly wishes and is overjoyed by death of Indian citizens in uniform.

The likes of Asim make the likes of Siv Sena look like angels. And that is sad.

 

[paritosh]

I take it none of your relatives have been blown up so far, god forbid ...

cheeky..very cheeky but let me tell you of my brother...who recently got the Sena medal for single-handedly killing two terrorists in barahmulla in Kashmir...while risking his life...
he's had shrapnel wounds...has had colleagues being kidnapped...has seen shiitt...so we have our guy risking it all..

Nobody would be held by the scruff or anything ... just a simple modification to the visa application process.

a lot of people believe that it would have been more convenient if could have discarded the whole democratic process itself....

 

[Halaku Khan]

however if you are willing to look beyond...you'd see that everyone just wants to have a good time...that is what is more important...
I didn't mean to offend you.

Perhaps my good time consists of waging Ghazwa. I'm afraid you live in a very fragile bubble.